7 ms·

Huge discussion about this topic one-two days ago: https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=22834959 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=22834959 (805 points, 459

Huge discussion about this topic one-two days ago: https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=22834959 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=22834959 (805 points, 459 comments)

panarky 7y ago
Not a dupe. This article explains in detail how the contact tracing API can work while preserving privacy. Random identifiers not linked to you or your device, identifiers change every 10 minutes so third parties can't track you over time, processing locally on the device instead of by Apple or Google or the government, etc.
- syshum 7y ago
  >>how the contact tracing API can work while preserving privacy. It cant, and any claims it can is sheer arrogance on the part of the developers. you can not simultaneously assign an identifier to everyone, and maintain privacy, they are mutually exclusive. If you can ID someone, and trace that ID back then it is not private
  - DagAgren 7y ago
    Well good news: This system does not assign an identifier to everyone, so it works.
    - sasasassy 7y ago
      Private until someone flags someone or everyone as infected.
      - DagAgren 7y ago
        That is not a possible.
    - syshum 7y ago
      It absolutely does, and broadcasts it via BlueTooth, then other phones track which ID's you have been near. The idea that can not be used for something other than COVID is moronic, this type of system has been done in Marketing for a long time, Google knows this very well. This is not a new or novel idea, nor it is private
      - DagAgren 7y ago
        It does not transmit "an ID". It transmits random IDs, that cycle often.
        syshum 7y ago
        Except for people that Test Positive, which then it uploads each of the Daily Tracing keys to a central server for each of the day you were positive, this is reversible, and has to be in order to identify all of the contacts the person came in contact with you can not have an anonymous system that also provides aways to trace back to individuals you came in contact with it is impossible and their complex Hash of hashes is just a way to make it seems private for people that do not understand what is really going on, it sounds good on the surface, but that is all it is surface level that is with out getting into the ways to compromise the device to get the original Tracking key that all of the other tracking keys are generated from
        DagAgren 7y ago
        Yes, that is the tradeoff you are making to keep actual human beings from dying painfully. You can afford to give up a few days of your privacy for that. Really, you can.
        syshum 7y ago
        Really you are going to come back at me with a Privacy vs Safety fallacy. If that is all the justification you have, you have already lost the debate. That kind of justification can be used for all manner of dystopian programs. Authoritarians have been limiting privacy and freedom for centuries on the basis of safety. Right now in congress the EARNIT act is attempting to use that very argument for the "safety of children" we all need to give up E2E encryption No I completely reject your premise that because of safety I need to give up my privacy
  - jsmeaton 7y ago
    If you haven’t already, you should read the linked article. It does a great job explaining the features of the system in easy language.
- ReactiveJelly 7y ago
  > third parties can't track you over time I thought having a third party track everyone over time was the entire point of contact tracing?

Huge discussion about this topic one-two days ago: https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=22834959 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=22834959 (805 points, 459 comments)

panarky 7y ago

Not a dupe. This article explains in detail how the contact tracing API can work while preserving privacy. Random identifiers not linked to you or your device, identifiers change every 10 minutes so third parties can't track you over time, processing locally on the device instead of by Apple or Google or the government, etc.

syshum 7y ago
>>how the contact tracing API can work while preserving privacy. It cant, and any claims it can is sheer arrogance on the part of the developers. you can not simultaneously assign an identifier to everyone, and maintain privacy, they are mutually exclusive. If you can ID someone, and trace that ID back then it is not private
- DagAgren 7y ago
  Well good news: This system does not assign an identifier to everyone, so it works.
  - sasasassy 7y ago
    Private until someone flags someone or everyone as infected.
    - DagAgren 7y ago
      That is not a possible.
  - syshum 7y ago
    It absolutely does, and broadcasts it via BlueTooth, then other phones track which ID's you have been near. The idea that can not be used for something other than COVID is moronic, this type of system has been done in Marketing for a long time, Google knows this very well. This is not a new or novel idea, nor it is private
    - DagAgren 7y ago
      It does not transmit "an ID". It transmits random IDs, that cycle often.
      - syshum 7y ago
        Except for people that Test Positive, which then it uploads each of the Daily Tracing keys to a central server for each of the day you were positive, this is reversible, and has to be in order to identify all of the contacts the person came in contact with you can not have an anonymous system that also provides aways to trace back to individuals you came in contact with it is impossible and their complex Hash of hashes is just a way to make it seems private for people that do not understand what is really going on, it sounds good on the surface, but that is all it is surface level that is with out getting into the ways to compromise the device to get the original Tracking key that all of the other tracking keys are generated from
        DagAgren 7y ago
        Yes, that is the tradeoff you are making to keep actual human beings from dying painfully. You can afford to give up a few days of your privacy for that. Really, you can.
        syshum 7y ago
        Really you are going to come back at me with a Privacy vs Safety fallacy. If that is all the justification you have, you have already lost the debate. That kind of justification can be used for all manner of dystopian programs. Authoritarians have been limiting privacy and freedom for centuries on the basis of safety. Right now in congress the EARNIT act is attempting to use that very argument for the "safety of children" we all need to give up E2E encryption No I completely reject your premise that because of safety I need to give up my privacy
- jsmeaton 7y ago
  If you haven’t already, you should read the linked article. It does a great job explaining the features of the system in easy language.
ReactiveJelly 7y ago
> third parties can't track you over time I thought having a third party track everyone over time was the entire point of contact tracing?