7 ms·

That display is $1.5k ea, and comes with an NDA mostly forbidding you to even think about it, much less think about the possibility of letting the thought of pe

That display is $1.5k ea, and comes with an NDA mostly forbidding you to even think about it, much less think about the possibility of letting the thought of permitting your mouth talk about it cross your mind.

Quequau 7y ago
This sort of thing is pretty consistent with all these devices. I guess the manufacturers only want to sell to outfits like Amazon or Google and want to make damn sure that everyone else is left out. I'm convinced that this is a significant factor in the relative narrowness of success, or out right lack, of the technology.
- noir_lord 7y ago
  I don't understand it either, a decent profit on a vast number of units versus a higher profit on a smaller number is a classic trade off. I guess they make enough from ebook readers they don't want to make them more widely available.
  - deleted 7y ago
    [deleted]
  - woofie11 7y ago
    I'm not sure that's the trade-off. My experience is that it's hard to predict where new technologies will be used (see history of radio and telephone). With something like eInk, getting it into the hands of engineers building wonky prototypes would allow rapid exploration of a lot of new markets. But yeah, many business leaders are insecure and don't understand IP.
  - sparker72678 7y ago
    Selling to one big company is a way better deal for most businesses if you can swing it. You have ONE customer to deal with, instead of thousands or millions, they will (likely) give you a ton of cash up front as you ramp up your production (payment for the rest on delivery), and you only have to work out how to ship them to one location, instead of either setting up a storefront or finding a distributor. You have easy-to-forecast revenue and you can stay in your niche as a component manufacturer instead of becoming a consumer goods product company.
    - WalterBright 7y ago
      > You have ONE customer to deal with That has its downsides. For one thing, they own you. For another, if their plans shift, you are out of business.
- deleted 7y ago
  [deleted]
Nextgrid 7y ago
I wonder, why is there an NDA on the software using their code? Why would they want to hide their API, considering anyone nefarious would just buy the thing anyway ($1,5k isn’t a huge barrier to entry) and completely disregard the NDA anyway?
- londons_explore 7y ago
  I think it's insecure business leaders. They are worried a competitor might pop up and outcompete them, and they hope that lumbering their employees, their suppliers, and their customers with NDA's will prevent anyone from becoming that competitor. I'm not sure they realise how much the NDA's scare off good employees, suppliers, and customers, leaving them unable to make quick progress, and in turn making them ripe for someone to outcompete.
  - theandrewbailey 7y ago
    And if someone does come along to compete with them, they might use patent lawfare to drive them out of business.
deleted 7y ago
[deleted]
roland35 7y ago
I'm sure the NDA also says you're not supposed to talk about the NDA! We're all in trouble now.
- vasco 7y ago
  We didn't sign it.
  - magduf 7y ago
    That probably doesn't matter to the people pushing the NDA. Why should they care about the realities of contract law, when they can just make up lies and get people to believe them under threat of lawsuit? It's just like how so many car dealerships will tell you that getting your car serviced anywhere else will "void your warranty" even though that's blatantly illegal.
    - yoz-y 7y ago
      Not signing a contract and signing a contract of dubious legal value are two different things. In the second case you need to argue the legality, in the first case there is nothing to argue about.
bottle2 7y ago
I didn't see the NDA, but it has this forbidding message (which I think the author of the article ignored): "(II) PURCHASER IS PURCHASING THE PRODUCTS FOR COMMERCIAL USE AND/OR IN A BUSINESS CAPACITY. ORDERS PLACED BY CONSUMERS WILL NOT BE ACCEPTED."
- runxel 7y ago
  I'm pretty sure this is not lawful so you can't be sued if you lied in the first place.
  - teraflop 7y ago
    Why would it not be lawful?
    - runxel 7y ago
      Ask the other way around: Why would this be lawful? If you sell something you give up any rights on the item sold. You can not any longer demand what the object should be used for, nor by whom it should be used.
      - Biganon 7y ago
        You can still consider it a breach of the contract.
        nkrisc 7y ago
        Sure, but would that even hold up in court? You can put anything in a contract, that doesn't make it enforceable.
        runxel 7y ago
        As nkrisc already pointed out, just because you put something in a contract it doesn't mean it's enforceable, or lawful. See, if it's not lawful in the first place, you can't "breach" it. IANAL, but I had enough law during my studies to know where this will lead. Maybe you can do these kind of shenanigans in the US of A, but I'm confident this kind of contract clauses are not possible in Europe.
flowersjeff 7y ago
...How dare you even consider making something cool that others might want, and result in further sales! For Shame! (Truly insane position of the company - they ought to hire this person and make this a product one can buy.)

Quequau 7y ago

This sort of thing is pretty consistent with all these devices. I guess the manufacturers only want to sell to outfits like Amazon or Google and want to make damn sure that everyone else is left out. I'm convinced that this is a significant factor in the relative narrowness of success, or out right lack, of the technology.

noir_lord 7y ago
I don't understand it either, a decent profit on a vast number of units versus a higher profit on a smaller number is a classic trade off. I guess they make enough from ebook readers they don't want to make them more widely available.
- deleted 7y ago
  [deleted]
- woofie11 7y ago
  I'm not sure that's the trade-off. My experience is that it's hard to predict where new technologies will be used (see history of radio and telephone). With something like eInk, getting it into the hands of engineers building wonky prototypes would allow rapid exploration of a lot of new markets. But yeah, many business leaders are insecure and don't understand IP.
- sparker72678 7y ago
  Selling to one big company is a way better deal for most businesses if you can swing it. You have ONE customer to deal with, instead of thousands or millions, they will (likely) give you a ton of cash up front as you ramp up your production (payment for the rest on delivery), and you only have to work out how to ship them to one location, instead of either setting up a storefront or finding a distributor. You have easy-to-forecast revenue and you can stay in your niche as a component manufacturer instead of becoming a consumer goods product company.
  - WalterBright 7y ago
    > You have ONE customer to deal with That has its downsides. For one thing, they own you. For another, if their plans shift, you are out of business.
deleted 7y ago
[deleted]

Nextgrid 7y ago

I wonder, why is there an NDA on the software using their code? Why would they want to hide their API, considering anyone nefarious would just buy the thing anyway ($1,5k isn’t a huge barrier to entry) and completely disregard the NDA anyway?

londons_explore 7y ago
I think it's insecure business leaders. They are worried a competitor might pop up and outcompete them, and they hope that lumbering their employees, their suppliers, and their customers with NDA's will prevent anyone from becoming that competitor. I'm not sure they realise how much the NDA's scare off good employees, suppliers, and customers, leaving them unable to make quick progress, and in turn making them ripe for someone to outcompete.
- theandrewbailey 7y ago
  And if someone does come along to compete with them, they might use patent lawfare to drive them out of business.

deleted 7y ago

[deleted]

roland35 7y ago

I'm sure the NDA also says you're not supposed to talk about the NDA! We're all in trouble now.

vasco 7y ago
We didn't sign it.
- magduf 7y ago
  That probably doesn't matter to the people pushing the NDA. Why should they care about the realities of contract law, when they can just make up lies and get people to believe them under threat of lawsuit? It's just like how so many car dealerships will tell you that getting your car serviced anywhere else will "void your warranty" even though that's blatantly illegal.
  - yoz-y 7y ago
    Not signing a contract and signing a contract of dubious legal value are two different things. In the second case you need to argue the legality, in the first case there is nothing to argue about.

bottle2 7y ago

I didn't see the NDA, but it has this forbidding message (which I think the author of the article ignored): "(II) PURCHASER IS PURCHASING THE PRODUCTS FOR COMMERCIAL USE AND/OR IN A BUSINESS CAPACITY. ORDERS PLACED BY CONSUMERS WILL NOT BE ACCEPTED."

runxel 7y ago
I'm pretty sure this is not lawful so you can't be sued if you lied in the first place.
- teraflop 7y ago
  Why would it not be lawful?
  - runxel 7y ago
    Ask the other way around: Why would this be lawful? If you sell something you give up any rights on the item sold. You can not any longer demand what the object should be used for, nor by whom it should be used.
    - Biganon 7y ago
      You can still consider it a breach of the contract.
      - nkrisc 7y ago
        Sure, but would that even hold up in court? You can put anything in a contract, that doesn't make it enforceable.
      - runxel 7y ago
        As nkrisc already pointed out, just because you put something in a contract it doesn't mean it's enforceable, or lawful. See, if it's not lawful in the first place, you can't "breach" it. IANAL, but I had enough law during my studies to know where this will lead. Maybe you can do these kind of shenanigans in the US of A, but I'm confident this kind of contract clauses are not possible in Europe.

flowersjeff 7y ago

...How dare you even consider making something cool that others might want, and result in further sales! For Shame! (Truly insane position of the company - they ought to hire this person and make this a product one can buy.)