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The federal government should have enacted stay at home measures. By leaving it up to the states, it's been bungled and the covid outbreak is lasting longer an

The federal government should have enacted stay at home measures. By leaving it up to the states, it's been bungled and the covid outbreak is lasting longer and killing more people. This leads to stay at home needing extensions and a further drain on the economy.

mrfusion 7y ago
I really think martial law at the federal level would have been the end of our democracy. I don’t think it’s a good trade off. The current measures aren’t doing so bad in the realm of possible outcomes.
- ceejayoz 7y ago
  There are a lot of steps before martial law. Hell, have the President do a public address from the Oval calling on the states to issue a coordinated stay-at-home order. Lay out the reasoning, the benefits. Would've helped in Florida, apparently. https://www.miamiherald.com/news/politics-government/state-politics/article241660601.html https://www.miamiherald.com/news/politics-government/state-p... > “I’m in contact with [the White House task force] and I’ve said, ‘Are you recommending this?’ ” DeSantis said. “The task force has not recommended that to me. If they do, obviously that would be something that carries a lot of weight with me. If any of those task force folks tell me that we should do X, Y or Z, of course we’re going to consider it. But nobody has said that to me thus far.”
- quickthrowman 7y ago
  You’re being pedantic. Some Republican governors were scared to enact stay-at-home without Trump’s blessing. It has nothing to do with what’s legally possible in the US.
jandrewrogers 7y ago
The Federal government does not have the authority, it is expressly prohibited. What you think “should” have happened is literally impossible without dissolution of the US government. This is not remotely controversial, the Supreme Court has visited this many times. States are sovereign and autonomous entities for this purpose, same as for most things. A surprisingly small number of Americans have any understanding of the structure of our government, a glaring failure of our education systems. It is no wonder that foreigners have so many misconceptions about the nature of US government given how few Americans understand it.
- blhack 7y ago
  It's a failure of our eduction system, but it's also a complete failure of traditional media. My guess is that it is because most major traditional media outlets are national entities. It's easier for those national media entities to talk about a government that appears relevant to their entire audience (the federal government), instead of 50+ articles each scoped at the state level. This damages peoples' ability to do correct sensemaking because they overweighting entertainment sources as if they were data sources.
- DiogenesKynikos 7y ago
  Germany also has a strict Federal structure, but they managed. They called a meeting of all the state governments, together with the Federal government, and agreed on a set of procedures. Each state does things a bit differently, but they're largely on the same page now. Why wasn't anything like this attempted in the US?
  - jandrewrogers 7y ago
    The US Federal government is similar to the EU; member States have considerable amounts of absolute sovereignty, their own forms of government, and their own legal systems. Importantly, the Federal government cannot operate in a State except with consent of the State, which is withheld in numerous instances. The Federal government works for the States, not the other way around, and the States are free to ignore requests by the Federal government on most matters. Why wasn't the response coordinated across the EU? Same answer applies to the US. It would be like herding cats. The Federal government can ask nicely but no one is required to listen Externally, the US presents a common negotiating front. Internally, it is 50+ separate countries. Americans interact almost exclusively with their State governments when in the country, not the Federal government. This explains, for example, why there is no "national" ID in the US. Americans are citizens of their States, first and foremost, and each State has their own independent ID systems. What makes the US somewhat unique is that Americans have an absolute right to change their citizenship among the member States at any time. There was a time not that long ago when many Americans more closely identified with their State citizenship than their Federal citizenship.

mrfusion 7y ago

I really think martial law at the federal level would have been the end of our democracy. I don’t think it’s a good trade off. The current measures aren’t doing so bad in the realm of possible outcomes.

ceejayoz 7y ago
There are a lot of steps before martial law. Hell, have the President do a public address from the Oval calling on the states to issue a coordinated stay-at-home order. Lay out the reasoning, the benefits. Would've helped in Florida, apparently. https://www.miamiherald.com/news/politics-government/state-politics/article241660601.html https://www.miamiherald.com/news/politics-government/state-p... > “I’m in contact with [the White House task force] and I’ve said, ‘Are you recommending this?’ ” DeSantis said. “The task force has not recommended that to me. If they do, obviously that would be something that carries a lot of weight with me. If any of those task force folks tell me that we should do X, Y or Z, of course we’re going to consider it. But nobody has said that to me thus far.”
quickthrowman 7y ago
You’re being pedantic. Some Republican governors were scared to enact stay-at-home without Trump’s blessing. It has nothing to do with what’s legally possible in the US.

jandrewrogers 7y ago

The Federal government does not have the authority, it is expressly prohibited. What you think “should” have happened is literally impossible without dissolution of the US government. This is not remotely controversial, the Supreme Court has visited this many times. States are sovereign and autonomous entities for this purpose, same as for most things. A surprisingly small number of Americans have any understanding of the structure of our government, a glaring failure of our education systems. It is no wonder that foreigners have so many misconceptions about the nature of US government given how few Americans understand it.

blhack 7y ago
It's a failure of our eduction system, but it's also a complete failure of traditional media. My guess is that it is because most major traditional media outlets are national entities. It's easier for those national media entities to talk about a government that appears relevant to their entire audience (the federal government), instead of 50+ articles each scoped at the state level. This damages peoples' ability to do correct sensemaking because they overweighting entertainment sources as if they were data sources.
DiogenesKynikos 7y ago
Germany also has a strict Federal structure, but they managed. They called a meeting of all the state governments, together with the Federal government, and agreed on a set of procedures. Each state does things a bit differently, but they're largely on the same page now. Why wasn't anything like this attempted in the US?
- jandrewrogers 7y ago
  The US Federal government is similar to the EU; member States have considerable amounts of absolute sovereignty, their own forms of government, and their own legal systems. Importantly, the Federal government cannot operate in a State except with consent of the State, which is withheld in numerous instances. The Federal government works for the States, not the other way around, and the States are free to ignore requests by the Federal government on most matters. Why wasn't the response coordinated across the EU? Same answer applies to the US. It would be like herding cats. The Federal government can ask nicely but no one is required to listen Externally, the US presents a common negotiating front. Internally, it is 50+ separate countries. Americans interact almost exclusively with their State governments when in the country, not the Federal government. This explains, for example, why there is no "national" ID in the US. Americans are citizens of their States, first and foremost, and each State has their own independent ID systems. What makes the US somewhat unique is that Americans have an absolute right to change their citizenship among the member States at any time. There was a time not that long ago when many Americans more closely identified with their State citizenship than their Federal citizenship.