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The US's response could not be described as anything even approaching competent. This is still just getting started. Let's check back in a few months and see h

The US's response could not be described as anything even approaching competent. This is still just getting started. Let's check back in a few months and see how this comment has aged...

blhack 7y ago
What should the US have done that other countries are doing? We closed travel early, we started closing businesses early, and we hold daily press conferences with multiple medical and financial experts that are directly informing the entire population of what measures they should be taking. edit: it seems like the general response to "what should we have done" is "the federal government should have shut down travel/businesses nationwide". Is that even legal for the federal government to do? I know that when Trump floated the idea of travel restrictions for NY, Cuomo called it an act of war (https://www.cnn.com/2020/03/28/politics/cuomo-ny-quarantine-cnntv/index.html https://www.cnn.com/2020/03/28/politics/cuomo-ny-quarantine-...).
- vvanders 7y ago
  Not suspending federal support for testing would go a long way.
- _delirium 7y ago
  We still haven't really closed travel: even the source of the biggest current outbreak, NYC, still has airports operating! And not only for medical flights... you can just buy yourself a plane ticket from NYC to Miami if you want to visit. The first significant US outbreak was in Washington state in February, and there were no real travel-restriction measures to/from the Seattle area back then either, which is part of how it spread across the country. It probably wouldn't be possible to do a China-style quarantine of an entire region, like the way they completely locked down travel to/from Hubei, but we didn't do anything even 25% of the way there... SeaTac kept operating for weeks as if there was no issue, with large volumes of passengers exiting the source of the then-biggest outbreak. We were also quite late on shutting down businesses, although some places later than others. Fairly high-ranking officials (the Oklahoma governor, the NYC mayor, etc.) were openly encouraging people to go out to big events as late as mid-March, weeks after there was evidence of community spread.
  - ceejayoz 7y ago
    > We were also quite late on shutting down businesses Hell, there are still eight states that haven't, per the map at https://www.nytimes.com/interactive/2020/us/coronavirus-stay-at-home-order.html https://www.nytimes.com/interactive/2020/us/coronavirus-stay....
- cycrutchfield 7y ago
  How about waiting for 4-6 weeks while the CDC shipped a buggy test before we started actually ramping up testing. We could have had a trajectory like South Korea.
- three_seagrass 7y ago
  The federal government should have enacted stay at home measures. By leaving it up to the states, it's been bungled and the covid outbreak is lasting longer and killing more people. This leads to stay at home needing extensions and a further drain on the economy.
  - mrfusion 7y ago
    I really think martial law at the federal level would have been the end of our democracy. I don’t think it’s a good trade off. The current measures aren’t doing so bad in the realm of possible outcomes.
    - ceejayoz 7y ago
      There are a lot of steps before martial law. Hell, have the President do a public address from the Oval calling on the states to issue a coordinated stay-at-home order. Lay out the reasoning, the benefits. Would've helped in Florida, apparently. https://www.miamiherald.com/news/politics-government/state-politics/article241660601.html https://www.miamiherald.com/news/politics-government/state-p... > “I’m in contact with [the White House task force] and I’ve said, ‘Are you recommending this?’ ” DeSantis said. “The task force has not recommended that to me. If they do, obviously that would be something that carries a lot of weight with me. If any of those task force folks tell me that we should do X, Y or Z, of course we’re going to consider it. But nobody has said that to me thus far.”
    - quickthrowman 7y ago
      You’re being pedantic. Some Republican governors were scared to enact stay-at-home without Trump’s blessing. It has nothing to do with what’s legally possible in the US.
  - jandrewrogers 7y ago
    The Federal government does not have the authority, it is expressly prohibited. What you think “should” have happened is literally impossible without dissolution of the US government. This is not remotely controversial, the Supreme Court has visited this many times. States are sovereign and autonomous entities for this purpose, same as for most things. A surprisingly small number of Americans have any understanding of the structure of our government, a glaring failure of our education systems. It is no wonder that foreigners have so many misconceptions about the nature of US government given how few Americans understand it.
- monocasa 7y ago
  How about not making the states big against each other for medical supplies?
- com2kid 7y ago
  Competent would have been starting production of masks and ventilators in January, and closing borders at the same time, and mandating mask wearing in public in early February.
- pmorici 7y ago
  Testing, if they had spun up testing in January and mandated testing of every International traveler that had been to a country with an outbreak in the past two weeks they probably could ahve avoided a total shut down like we have now. The bungled testing is the original sin that got us to where we are now. The ventilator thing is a bit of a side show because by time you have a problem big enough to need a ton of ventilators it is already out of control.
- DiogenesKynikos 7y ago
  Two things: 1. Tested widely early on, like South Korea did. 2. Shut down public life weeks earlier, once it became clear there was community spread. The Federal press conferences feature a few informative experts, but they also feature one very prominent source of disinformation: the guy in charge. He downplayed the virus for months, and gives rambling, poorly considered, sometimes damaging statements (e.g., causing a run on a drug needed by Lupus patients, because he likes the idea that this drug is a miracle cure that will allow America to go back to work). His latest performance was a dishonest attack on the WHO, meant to redirect blame for mismanagement of the crisis onto that organization. Comparing the Federal press conferences to those in other countries is really eye-opening. If you want to see what good, factual, relatively unpolitical press conferences look like, take a look at the daily updates in Singapore or Germany.
tootie 7y ago
Trump has been true to form in his lying and aggrandizing at every point, but I think the public has just gotten used to it. The CDC and state governors have been mixed, but the hardest hit states (WA, NY, CA) have been pretty aggressive.
TechBro8615 7y ago
This is an emotionally charged political comment. If you only watch CNN and read the NYT, you might think this. But if you look at the curve, and per-capita death numbers, the US seems to be doing a good job managing the crisis relative to its size. Has anyone in the US died because they didn’t have a ventilator? Not that I’m aware of. Washington State is already on the downslope. The history books will be very kind to Trump for his response, much to the chagrin of an inexplicably biased literati class rooting against him.
- andbberger 7y ago
  Yes indeed yours is an emotionally charged political comment, thanks for prefacing it with the warning. NY has started splitting ventilators.
  - TechBro8615 7y ago
    The implication of your assertions is that the market is irrational right now. You could make a lot of money buying some puts in July. (And I hoped you’d appreciate the ambiguity in the opening sentence :-) Ultimately we’re all in this together and we all want what’s best for the country and world.)
- Retric 7y ago
  If the US had does as well as South Korea it would have 1,300 deaths and ~200 new infections per day. Instead we have 10x as many deaths per capita and at least 150x as many new infections per capita today. 50m people, 208 deaths, 27 new infections yesterday. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/2020_coronavirus_pandemic_in_South_Korea https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/2020_coronavirus_pandemic_in_S... 330m people, 14,696 deaths (cdc), 32,039 new infections yesterday: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/2020_coronavirus_pandemic_in_the_United_States https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/2020_coronavirus_pandemic_in_t... They are a poorer country with a higher population density, yet somehow we failed.

The US's response could not be described as anything even approaching competent. This is still just getting started. Let's check back in a few months and see how this comment has aged...

blhack 7y ago

What should the US have done that other countries are doing? We closed travel early, we started closing businesses early, and we hold daily press conferences with multiple medical and financial experts that are directly informing the entire population of what measures they should be taking. edit: it seems like the general response to "what should we have done" is "the federal government should have shut down travel/businesses nationwide". Is that even legal for the federal government to do? I know that when Trump floated the idea of travel restrictions for NY, Cuomo called it an act of war (https://www.cnn.com/2020/03/28/politics/cuomo-ny-quarantine-cnntv/index.html https://www.cnn.com/2020/03/28/politics/cuomo-ny-quarantine-...).

vvanders 7y ago
Not suspending federal support for testing would go a long way.
_delirium 7y ago
We still haven't really closed travel: even the source of the biggest current outbreak, NYC, still has airports operating! And not only for medical flights... you can just buy yourself a plane ticket from NYC to Miami if you want to visit. The first significant US outbreak was in Washington state in February, and there were no real travel-restriction measures to/from the Seattle area back then either, which is part of how it spread across the country. It probably wouldn't be possible to do a China-style quarantine of an entire region, like the way they completely locked down travel to/from Hubei, but we didn't do anything even 25% of the way there... SeaTac kept operating for weeks as if there was no issue, with large volumes of passengers exiting the source of the then-biggest outbreak. We were also quite late on shutting down businesses, although some places later than others. Fairly high-ranking officials (the Oklahoma governor, the NYC mayor, etc.) were openly encouraging people to go out to big events as late as mid-March, weeks after there was evidence of community spread.
- ceejayoz 7y ago
  > We were also quite late on shutting down businesses Hell, there are still eight states that haven't, per the map at https://www.nytimes.com/interactive/2020/us/coronavirus-stay-at-home-order.html https://www.nytimes.com/interactive/2020/us/coronavirus-stay....
cycrutchfield 7y ago
How about waiting for 4-6 weeks while the CDC shipped a buggy test before we started actually ramping up testing. We could have had a trajectory like South Korea.
three_seagrass 7y ago
The federal government should have enacted stay at home measures. By leaving it up to the states, it's been bungled and the covid outbreak is lasting longer and killing more people. This leads to stay at home needing extensions and a further drain on the economy.
- mrfusion 7y ago
  I really think martial law at the federal level would have been the end of our democracy. I don’t think it’s a good trade off. The current measures aren’t doing so bad in the realm of possible outcomes.
  - ceejayoz 7y ago
    There are a lot of steps before martial law. Hell, have the President do a public address from the Oval calling on the states to issue a coordinated stay-at-home order. Lay out the reasoning, the benefits. Would've helped in Florida, apparently. https://www.miamiherald.com/news/politics-government/state-politics/article241660601.html https://www.miamiherald.com/news/politics-government/state-p... > “I’m in contact with [the White House task force] and I’ve said, ‘Are you recommending this?’ ” DeSantis said. “The task force has not recommended that to me. If they do, obviously that would be something that carries a lot of weight with me. If any of those task force folks tell me that we should do X, Y or Z, of course we’re going to consider it. But nobody has said that to me thus far.”
  - quickthrowman 7y ago
    You’re being pedantic. Some Republican governors were scared to enact stay-at-home without Trump’s blessing. It has nothing to do with what’s legally possible in the US.
- jandrewrogers 7y ago
  The Federal government does not have the authority, it is expressly prohibited. What you think “should” have happened is literally impossible without dissolution of the US government. This is not remotely controversial, the Supreme Court has visited this many times. States are sovereign and autonomous entities for this purpose, same as for most things. A surprisingly small number of Americans have any understanding of the structure of our government, a glaring failure of our education systems. It is no wonder that foreigners have so many misconceptions about the nature of US government given how few Americans understand it.
monocasa 7y ago
How about not making the states big against each other for medical supplies?
com2kid 7y ago
Competent would have been starting production of masks and ventilators in January, and closing borders at the same time, and mandating mask wearing in public in early February.
pmorici 7y ago
Testing, if they had spun up testing in January and mandated testing of every International traveler that had been to a country with an outbreak in the past two weeks they probably could ahve avoided a total shut down like we have now. The bungled testing is the original sin that got us to where we are now. The ventilator thing is a bit of a side show because by time you have a problem big enough to need a ton of ventilators it is already out of control.
DiogenesKynikos 7y ago
Two things: 1. Tested widely early on, like South Korea did. 2. Shut down public life weeks earlier, once it became clear there was community spread. The Federal press conferences feature a few informative experts, but they also feature one very prominent source of disinformation: the guy in charge. He downplayed the virus for months, and gives rambling, poorly considered, sometimes damaging statements (e.g., causing a run on a drug needed by Lupus patients, because he likes the idea that this drug is a miracle cure that will allow America to go back to work). His latest performance was a dishonest attack on the WHO, meant to redirect blame for mismanagement of the crisis onto that organization. Comparing the Federal press conferences to those in other countries is really eye-opening. If you want to see what good, factual, relatively unpolitical press conferences look like, take a look at the daily updates in Singapore or Germany.

tootie 7y ago

Trump has been true to form in his lying and aggrandizing at every point, but I think the public has just gotten used to it. The CDC and state governors have been mixed, but the hardest hit states (WA, NY, CA) have been pretty aggressive.

TechBro8615 7y ago

This is an emotionally charged political comment. If you only watch CNN and read the NYT, you might think this. But if you look at the curve, and per-capita death numbers, the US seems to be doing a good job managing the crisis relative to its size. Has anyone in the US died because they didn’t have a ventilator? Not that I’m aware of. Washington State is already on the downslope. The history books will be very kind to Trump for his response, much to the chagrin of an inexplicably biased literati class rooting against him.

andbberger 7y ago
Yes indeed yours is an emotionally charged political comment, thanks for prefacing it with the warning. NY has started splitting ventilators.
- TechBro8615 7y ago
  The implication of your assertions is that the market is irrational right now. You could make a lot of money buying some puts in July. (And I hoped you’d appreciate the ambiguity in the opening sentence :-) Ultimately we’re all in this together and we all want what’s best for the country and world.)
Retric 7y ago
If the US had does as well as South Korea it would have 1,300 deaths and ~200 new infections per day. Instead we have 10x as many deaths per capita and at least 150x as many new infections per capita today. 50m people, 208 deaths, 27 new infections yesterday. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/2020_coronavirus_pandemic_in_South_Korea https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/2020_coronavirus_pandemic_in_S... 330m people, 14,696 deaths (cdc), 32,039 new infections yesterday: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/2020_coronavirus_pandemic_in_the_United_States https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/2020_coronavirus_pandemic_in_t... They are a poorer country with a higher population density, yet somehow we failed.