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You'll find examples on both sides. Rust is a great example of a successful language growing in the open.

by leshow 7y ago

progre 7y ago
Really growing, so much that it's kinda hard to keep up with
- leshow 7y ago
  Oh please, maybe if all you're doing is reading hackernews articles. The language hasn't really changed that much in the last few years. The only major feature is async/await.
  - dragonsh 7y ago
    Rust is a complicated language and still has a very long journey ahead to prove its worth, I have yet to see it being used extensively in Mozilla to re-write Firefox which hasn't happened yet (may not happen as replacing C++ with Rust is a nightmare given most useful systems code is still either C or C++). Hopefully zig [1], picks up. It's compiled code is smaller and better in performance compared to Rust and also provides a mechanism to write safe code with allocator choices. Also the overall zig language design fits in brain as the grammar is not complex unlike Rust which has a steep and complex learning curve. Rust developer spend a lot of time learning language feature and fighting with borrow checker syntax and still need to rely on unsafe C library to do anything useful. Zig made a conscious choice to make it work with C and realize it needs to work with C rather than replace it unlike Rust which is relying on C and still trying to proclaim as C replacement, when its not yet ready. [1] https://ziglang.org/ https://ziglang.org/
    - iopq 7y ago
      Parts of Firefox are already written in Rust: https://wiki.mozilla.org/Oxidation https://wiki.mozilla.org/Oxidation they are continuing the work to replace the least performant/secure components in Rust when it's easily possible to switch them out
- Ar-Curunir 7y ago
  You shouldn’t take your opinions on things from HN discussions that claim that Rust is changing quickly, and then are only able to point out 3 things over 5 years that have changed.
  - progre 7y ago
    I don't. Crate authors seems to be playing catch up to, or more likely, abandon their old work. I'ts really hard coming in to Rust to get a feel for what to use in any given situation as the crates are either dead or in alpha.
    - dbrgn 6y ago
      Can you point to any evidence that abandoned crates are abandoned due to language changes (as opposed to lost interest by the author, for example)? Code written for Rust 1.0 will most probably still work perfectly fine today.
neutronicus 7y ago
Rust is also an example of a language that leans pretty heavily into "familiar C++ syntax as a marketing tool." Although they did not cave on the Ternary Operator. About which a certain contingent (myself included) is vocally unhappy.

You'll find examples on both sides. Rust is a great example of a successful language growing in the open.

by leshow 7y ago

You'll find examples on both sides. Rust is a great example of a successful language growing in the open.

progre 7y ago

Really growing, so much that it's kinda hard to keep up with

leshow 7y ago
Oh please, maybe if all you're doing is reading hackernews articles. The language hasn't really changed that much in the last few years. The only major feature is async/await.
- dragonsh 7y ago
  Rust is a complicated language and still has a very long journey ahead to prove its worth, I have yet to see it being used extensively in Mozilla to re-write Firefox which hasn't happened yet (may not happen as replacing C++ with Rust is a nightmare given most useful systems code is still either C or C++). Hopefully zig [1], picks up. It's compiled code is smaller and better in performance compared to Rust and also provides a mechanism to write safe code with allocator choices. Also the overall zig language design fits in brain as the grammar is not complex unlike Rust which has a steep and complex learning curve. Rust developer spend a lot of time learning language feature and fighting with borrow checker syntax and still need to rely on unsafe C library to do anything useful. Zig made a conscious choice to make it work with C and realize it needs to work with C rather than replace it unlike Rust which is relying on C and still trying to proclaim as C replacement, when its not yet ready. [1] https://ziglang.org/ https://ziglang.org/
  - iopq 7y ago
    Parts of Firefox are already written in Rust: https://wiki.mozilla.org/Oxidation https://wiki.mozilla.org/Oxidation they are continuing the work to replace the least performant/secure components in Rust when it's easily possible to switch them out
Ar-Curunir 7y ago
You shouldn’t take your opinions on things from HN discussions that claim that Rust is changing quickly, and then are only able to point out 3 things over 5 years that have changed.
- progre 7y ago
  I don't. Crate authors seems to be playing catch up to, or more likely, abandon their old work. I'ts really hard coming in to Rust to get a feel for what to use in any given situation as the crates are either dead or in alpha.
  - dbrgn 6y ago
    Can you point to any evidence that abandoned crates are abandoned due to language changes (as opposed to lost interest by the author, for example)? Code written for Rust 1.0 will most probably still work perfectly fine today.

neutronicus 7y ago

Rust is also an example of a language that leans pretty heavily into "familiar C++ syntax as a marketing tool." Although they did not cave on the Ternary Operator. About which a certain contingent (myself included) is vocally unhappy.