4 ms·

Sales and account management are easier to hire and fire. That said I bet some engineers were let go. If you're not directly client facing or related to e-comme

by scurvy 7y ago

Sales and account management are easier to hire and fire. That said I bet some engineers were let go. If you're not directly client facing or related to e-commerce, you're not essential right now.

jstanley 7y ago
But aren't sales and account management precisely the people who are client-facing or related to e-commerce?
- scurvy 7y ago
  Yes but they're the easiest to ramp up and wind down. Certain segments of the economy as devastated right now. Would not want to be a flight attendant, but airplane engine mechanics are probably still in demand as cargo flights replace passenger traffic (since we're ordering everything online now). Logically, that would extend to people whose job revolves around signing up restaurants to marketing portals. The restaurants that have an online business are already there. Those that don't have an online business are already closed.
  - penagwin 7y ago
    According to flight aware, global air traffic is down 75%. So I'd bet mechanics aren't doing so hot either unless they were dedicated to cargo. Programmers arent as easy to replace because they already understand the system. Training takes time, and if there's not enough documentation then you'll end up contacting the previous programmers for help (I've seen it happen) anyway.
- ransom1538 7y ago
  Yes. But now they have no one to call.
- hadlock 7y ago
  Marketing and SDRs are really easy to scale up/down; there are some things that are specific to each product but generally it doesn't matter what you are selling it is the same soft skills. Account Executives and Sales Engineers who provide long term support are a lot harder to replace though.
crimsonalucard 7y ago
Execs are even easier to fire as they are the furthest away from the front lines, but they're the ones doing the firing so too bad for everyone else.
crimsonalucard 7y ago
Realistically I would say a lot of engineers are easy to fire. You only need a certain amount of engineers to do maintenance.
- vinay427 7y ago
  I think they mean easy to fire in the sense of "easy to go through the process of firing and deallocating tasks/knowledge/etc.", not "easy to justify firing."
- dguaraglia 7y ago
  Engineers are easy to fire, but incredibly hard (and expensive) to hire, especially if you become known as the company that'll fire people immediately in a crisis. There's a fine line between saving money now and spending it later, and I'm sure Yelp - just like every other company out there - is trying to figure out where does that line lay.
  - crimsonalucard 7y ago
    I don't think engineers have this as a specific trait. Every worker in any occupation has the attitude you describe above. The thing that truly influences "hard to hire" is supply and demand. With the influx of bootcamps Software engineering supply has increased and with COVID-19 decreasing demand Engineers may no longer have the luxury of picking and choosing like they used to. I'm an engineer btw. Just viewing the situation from a realistic lens.
    - dguaraglia 7y ago
      I am an engineer too. I've helped hire engineers at two pretty big companies before and have done all the hiring for my current company. While the supply has increased, the number of senior engineers hasn't grown at the same pace. I know of companies who've fired even their senior engineers, but they've been hit particularly hard by this crisis (think 'business model is literally rendered invalid' level of affected). Most people who think they'll be able to weather at least the next six months will be reluctant to fire more experienced engineers, because they know how hard it was to hire them to begin with. While some of the options might be gone, chances are people who get laid off or are still in the market will look for companies with better chances of surviving this (think Google, Apple, Facebook, etc.), so the pool of experienced talent might actually be reduced for startups. In other words: people with 5 years of industry experience are playing in a completely different arena than more junior engineers, who are unfortunately in a more precarious situation.

by scurvy 7y ago

Sales and account management are easier to hire and fire. That said I bet some engineers were let go. If you're not directly client facing or related to e-commerce, you're not essential right now.

jstanley 7y ago

But aren't sales and account management precisely the people who are client-facing or related to e-commerce?

scurvy 7y ago
Yes but they're the easiest to ramp up and wind down. Certain segments of the economy as devastated right now. Would not want to be a flight attendant, but airplane engine mechanics are probably still in demand as cargo flights replace passenger traffic (since we're ordering everything online now). Logically, that would extend to people whose job revolves around signing up restaurants to marketing portals. The restaurants that have an online business are already there. Those that don't have an online business are already closed.
- penagwin 7y ago
  According to flight aware, global air traffic is down 75%. So I'd bet mechanics aren't doing so hot either unless they were dedicated to cargo. Programmers arent as easy to replace because they already understand the system. Training takes time, and if there's not enough documentation then you'll end up contacting the previous programmers for help (I've seen it happen) anyway.
ransom1538 7y ago
Yes. But now they have no one to call.
hadlock 7y ago
Marketing and SDRs are really easy to scale up/down; there are some things that are specific to each product but generally it doesn't matter what you are selling it is the same soft skills. Account Executives and Sales Engineers who provide long term support are a lot harder to replace though.

crimsonalucard 7y ago

Execs are even easier to fire as they are the furthest away from the front lines, but they're the ones doing the firing so too bad for everyone else.

crimsonalucard 7y ago

Realistically I would say a lot of engineers are easy to fire. You only need a certain amount of engineers to do maintenance.

vinay427 7y ago
I think they mean easy to fire in the sense of "easy to go through the process of firing and deallocating tasks/knowledge/etc.", not "easy to justify firing."
dguaraglia 7y ago
Engineers are easy to fire, but incredibly hard (and expensive) to hire, especially if you become known as the company that'll fire people immediately in a crisis. There's a fine line between saving money now and spending it later, and I'm sure Yelp - just like every other company out there - is trying to figure out where does that line lay.
- crimsonalucard 7y ago
  I don't think engineers have this as a specific trait. Every worker in any occupation has the attitude you describe above. The thing that truly influences "hard to hire" is supply and demand. With the influx of bootcamps Software engineering supply has increased and with COVID-19 decreasing demand Engineers may no longer have the luxury of picking and choosing like they used to. I'm an engineer btw. Just viewing the situation from a realistic lens.
  - dguaraglia 7y ago
    I am an engineer too. I've helped hire engineers at two pretty big companies before and have done all the hiring for my current company. While the supply has increased, the number of senior engineers hasn't grown at the same pace. I know of companies who've fired even their senior engineers, but they've been hit particularly hard by this crisis (think 'business model is literally rendered invalid' level of affected). Most people who think they'll be able to weather at least the next six months will be reluctant to fire more experienced engineers, because they know how hard it was to hire them to begin with. While some of the options might be gone, chances are people who get laid off or are still in the market will look for companies with better chances of surviving this (think Google, Apple, Facebook, etc.), so the pool of experienced talent might actually be reduced for startups. In other words: people with 5 years of industry experience are playing in a completely different arena than more junior engineers, who are unfortunately in a more precarious situation.