6 ms·

In the age of RSUs, graduating in the middle of a recession is financially incredible IF you managed to get the job before all the hiring freezes AND it is at o

by adtac 7y ago

In the age of RSUs, graduating in the middle of a recession is financially incredible IF you managed to get the job before all the hiring freezes AND it is at one of the publicly traded big N companies with good trade volume. Your RSU price is lower, you get more stock units for the same dollar amount at the time of joining in your initial grant (arguably much more important than refreshers). I have a friend who recently got his MSFT joining RSUs at $130 a few weeks ago.

redisman 7y ago
Finding a job in the middle of a recession is financially incredible
- adjkant 7y ago
  Anecdotally I'm still getting lots of recruiter spam from these types of companies on Linkedin and my current company that offers a good deal of RSU's is still hiring. It's not everywhere but in this particular recession and within those offers already offering lots of high value RSU's I suspect hiring is not slowing by a ton.
  - sysbin 7y ago
    Recruitment spamming isn't useful for accessing hiring rate. Recruiters are always building their database of who is out there and gathering information.
    - adjkant 7y ago
      I mean building your database via "I'd like to connect" message is one thing, getting specific job descriptions + being asked to start the recruitment process is a bit farther than that. I'm getting about the same ratio of type so far the past month. I'm not saying it's 1 to 1 but these companies are at least still actively hiring, and I have no reason to doubt that based on my company doing the same.
      - sysbin 7y ago
        Gathering information is the recruitment process. It's just used to filter the good candidates out of bad candidates. The process is further used to get a valuation of what each candidate is willing or desiring to be paid and this is the main reason recruiters will always be working. I'm still being spammed as well and where the recruitment process is part of the spam. I work in academia which I enjoy and I'm not looking to leave my job but I do think the actual hiring will slow somewhat down. Too early to predict how much in all areas of engineering but I assume in a few months we will see.
sfshaw 7y ago
Your friend figured out how to time the market. Amazing.
- dempseye 7y ago
  His parents were the ones who really showed foresight.
  - autonoshitbox 7y ago
    No, his grandparents were. Actually...
    - krustyburger 7y ago
      I think we can all agree that it was the first aquatic organism that bravely oozed onto dry land.
      - irrational 7y ago
        The primordial soup would like a word.
        DonHopkins 7y ago
        Julia Child had a great recipe for Primordial Soup! https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Julia_Child https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Julia_Child https://massasoit.instructure.com/courses/346438/pages/video-the-primordial-soup-with-julia-child https://massasoit.instructure.com/courses/346438/pages/video... Also a great recipe for shark repellent, that she made for the CIA. https://www.cia.gov/news-information/featured-story-archive/2015-featured-story-archive/shark-repellent.html https://www.cia.gov/news-information/featured-story-archive/... And she showed how to bone a chicken Saturday Night Live: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=eSxv6IGBgFQ https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=eSxv6IGBgFQ
      - arcticbull 7y ago
        Uh, I think reddit is leaking
Waterluvian 7y ago
I hear winning the lottery is also financially incredible.
thebean11 7y ago
Don't count your chickens before they vest, in 6 months somebody might be getting them at $90
- yaitsyaboi 7y ago
  Yea, but who has more time for the market to swing back up than a 22 year old?
  - saagarjha 7y ago
    A 21 year old.
- dehrmann 7y ago
  Assuming the compensation is 2/3 salary, 1/3 equity, that drop is only 10%. I'm worrying more about keeping my job than the value of my equity.
- adtac 7y ago
  It's advisable to hold your RSUs for at least one year for a favourable tax treatment, so the 33% discount he got is still very good; he's likely not going to sell his RSUs in six months. He got the offer and decided on his start date way back in August of last year so any luck he happens by is good luck. He could've chosen to be luckier if the stock price goes down further, but I'd say this is pretty lucky as it is already for something he can't control. Edit: ignore the tax part, I think I'm wrong there.
  - foota 7y ago
    Isn't the favorable tax treatment only on the appreciation from the vest price?
    - adtac 7y ago
      Ah I'm not too sure. That might be the case.
goldenchrome 7y ago
That's not that financially incredible. That's the price that MSFT was at less than a year ago.
- quickthrower2 7y ago
  Glad someone else noticed this. We are yet to have a crash from the coronavirus pandemic. You'd need another compound 50% off before I call it a crash.
  - jlmorton 7y ago
    Indeed, we're currently somewhat above the nadir in 2018 when we were all worried about the effects of 10-25% tariffs on $250 billion of US imports of Chinese products. I don't know about the rest of you, but I am definitely not feeling as confident in the mid-term, or even long-term outlook as I was then in 2018.
    - arcticbull 7y ago
      I'm neutral on the market right now, I don't think it's entirely unfairly priced. NASDAQ is in the best shape of the indices because tech companies don't seem hugely affected by all this insanity. Most major investment banks are expecting a huge boom in Q4/Q1 and return to business as usual. COVID new cases are trending downwards across all major economies (except the US, to follow soon) [1] I'm actually feeling better now than I was in October 2018. Rates are lower, tons of financial stimulus, a waning problem and a warming stock market. [1] https://aatishb.com/covidtrends/ https://aatishb.com/covidtrends/
      - Retric 7y ago
        The issue is without herd immunity or a vaccine this can all start up again from a single case anywhere in the world. That’s a lot of uncertainty.
        arcticbull 7y ago
kccqzy 7y ago
This might be off topic but why is the initial grant much more important than refreshers?
- foghornleghorn 7y ago
  most rank and file get next to nothing for refreshers.
vecter 7y ago
Are companies lowering the equity value of their offers currently? They might do that if they believe the stock will recover by 20-30% in 6 months, but I'm not on the job market so I don't know if companies are actually doing this.
NeutronStar 7y ago
Or, as OP said, 17 years after graduating in programming, you should have a job. There. Success!!
icedchai 7y ago
Sure, if you time everything right, you can make out very well. All these things have to line up. (FYI I bought MSFT stock for half that, back in 2017.)
deleted 7y ago
[deleted]

by adtac 7y ago

redisman 7y ago

Finding a job in the middle of a recession is financially incredible

adjkant 7y ago
Anecdotally I'm still getting lots of recruiter spam from these types of companies on Linkedin and my current company that offers a good deal of RSU's is still hiring. It's not everywhere but in this particular recession and within those offers already offering lots of high value RSU's I suspect hiring is not slowing by a ton.
- sysbin 7y ago
  Recruitment spamming isn't useful for accessing hiring rate. Recruiters are always building their database of who is out there and gathering information.
  - adjkant 7y ago
    I mean building your database via "I'd like to connect" message is one thing, getting specific job descriptions + being asked to start the recruitment process is a bit farther than that. I'm getting about the same ratio of type so far the past month. I'm not saying it's 1 to 1 but these companies are at least still actively hiring, and I have no reason to doubt that based on my company doing the same.
    - sysbin 7y ago
      Gathering information is the recruitment process. It's just used to filter the good candidates out of bad candidates. The process is further used to get a valuation of what each candidate is willing or desiring to be paid and this is the main reason recruiters will always be working. I'm still being spammed as well and where the recruitment process is part of the spam. I work in academia which I enjoy and I'm not looking to leave my job but I do think the actual hiring will slow somewhat down. Too early to predict how much in all areas of engineering but I assume in a few months we will see.

sfshaw 7y ago

Your friend figured out how to time the market. Amazing.

dempseye 7y ago
His parents were the ones who really showed foresight.
- autonoshitbox 7y ago
  No, his grandparents were. Actually...
  - krustyburger 7y ago
    I think we can all agree that it was the first aquatic organism that bravely oozed onto dry land.
    - irrational 7y ago
      The primordial soup would like a word.
      - DonHopkins 7y ago
        Julia Child had a great recipe for Primordial Soup! https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Julia_Child https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Julia_Child https://massasoit.instructure.com/courses/346438/pages/video-the-primordial-soup-with-julia-child https://massasoit.instructure.com/courses/346438/pages/video... Also a great recipe for shark repellent, that she made for the CIA. https://www.cia.gov/news-information/featured-story-archive/2015-featured-story-archive/shark-repellent.html https://www.cia.gov/news-information/featured-story-archive/... And she showed how to bone a chicken Saturday Night Live: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=eSxv6IGBgFQ https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=eSxv6IGBgFQ
    - arcticbull 7y ago
      Uh, I think reddit is leaking

Waterluvian 7y ago

I hear winning the lottery is also financially incredible.

thebean11 7y ago

Don't count your chickens before they vest, in 6 months somebody might be getting them at $90

yaitsyaboi 7y ago
Yea, but who has more time for the market to swing back up than a 22 year old?
- saagarjha 7y ago
  A 21 year old.
dehrmann 7y ago
Assuming the compensation is 2/3 salary, 1/3 equity, that drop is only 10%. I'm worrying more about keeping my job than the value of my equity.
adtac 7y ago
It's advisable to hold your RSUs for at least one year for a favourable tax treatment, so the 33% discount he got is still very good; he's likely not going to sell his RSUs in six months. He got the offer and decided on his start date way back in August of last year so any luck he happens by is good luck. He could've chosen to be luckier if the stock price goes down further, but I'd say this is pretty lucky as it is already for something he can't control. Edit: ignore the tax part, I think I'm wrong there.
- foota 7y ago
  Isn't the favorable tax treatment only on the appreciation from the vest price?
  - adtac 7y ago
    Ah I'm not too sure. That might be the case.

goldenchrome 7y ago

That's not that financially incredible. That's the price that MSFT was at less than a year ago.

quickthrower2 7y ago
Glad someone else noticed this. We are yet to have a crash from the coronavirus pandemic. You'd need another compound 50% off before I call it a crash.
- jlmorton 7y ago
  Indeed, we're currently somewhat above the nadir in 2018 when we were all worried about the effects of 10-25% tariffs on $250 billion of US imports of Chinese products. I don't know about the rest of you, but I am definitely not feeling as confident in the mid-term, or even long-term outlook as I was then in 2018.
  - arcticbull 7y ago
    I'm neutral on the market right now, I don't think it's entirely unfairly priced. NASDAQ is in the best shape of the indices because tech companies don't seem hugely affected by all this insanity. Most major investment banks are expecting a huge boom in Q4/Q1 and return to business as usual. COVID new cases are trending downwards across all major economies (except the US, to follow soon) [1] I'm actually feeling better now than I was in October 2018. Rates are lower, tons of financial stimulus, a waning problem and a warming stock market. [1] https://aatishb.com/covidtrends/ https://aatishb.com/covidtrends/
    - Retric 7y ago
      The issue is without herd immunity or a vaccine this can all start up again from a single case anywhere in the world. That’s a lot of uncertainty.
      - arcticbull 7y ago

kccqzy 7y ago

This might be off topic but why is the initial grant much more important than refreshers?

foghornleghorn 7y ago
most rank and file get next to nothing for refreshers.

vecter 7y ago

Are companies lowering the equity value of their offers currently? They might do that if they believe the stock will recover by 20-30% in 6 months, but I'm not on the job market so I don't know if companies are actually doing this.

NeutronStar 7y ago

Or, as OP said, 17 years after graduating in programming, you should have a job. There. Success!!

icedchai 7y ago

Sure, if you time everything right, you can make out very well. All these things have to line up. (FYI I bought MSFT stock for half that, back in 2017.)

deleted 7y ago

[deleted]