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To clarify a bit, I didn't mean cheating in a much negative way. Using physical goods as reference to color is the basic evolution for everyone. As I understan

by hrktb 7y ago

To clarify a bit, I didn't mean cheating in a much negative way. Using physical goods as reference to color is the basic evolution for everyone. As I understand it "blue" in english for instance was initially pointing to a concrete thing (lead?) as well, but the words went through many transitions isolating the world for the color from its original counterpart. But I think in english the concepts still stay more separated, for instance "rose" as a color has parted a lot from the common perception of an actual rose's color. Or looking at Faber Castel's color chart for instance [1], pink declinations are all defined relative to "pink", in contrast on the article's chart we'll have declinations like Ume (plum), Sakura (cherry), Ichigo (strawberry). I am not saying one is better, or one is lazier. [1] https://www.faber-castell.fr/produits/CrayondecouleurPolychromosrougegéraniumclair/110121 https://www.faber-castell.fr/produits/CrayondecouleurPolychr...

klodolph 7y ago
> But I think in english the concepts still stay more separated, … My question is, why do you think that? It sounds like an unfounded assertion to me. I hear you repeating claims but color names have been extensively studied in linguistics, and you have direct access to Japanese dictionaries and encyclopedias online, and you can type Japanese color names into Google image search, so it should be relatively easy to come up with even a small bit of evidence. > …for instance "rose" as a color has parted a lot from the common perception of an actual rose's color. If you look up “rose color” in Japanese Wikipedia, you’ll see that it specifically defines it as a shade between red and magenta, even though roses come in many different shades (yellow, orange, white, cream, etc). https://ja.wikipedia.org/wiki/%E8%96%94%E8%96%87%E8%89%B2 https://ja.wikipedia.org/wiki/%E8%96%94%E8%96%87%E8%89%B2 The problem here is that I am not a Japanese speaker, but this seems to be evidence that the term “rose color” is a specific color, and not a term that means “the color of a rose”. “Peach color” is also interesting. https://ja.wikipedia.org/wiki/%E6%A1%83%E8%89%B2 https://ja.wikipedia.org/wiki/%E6%A1%83%E8%89%B2 Unlike English, this color is not the color of a peach fruit. It is also not the color of a peach blossom, despite the fact that “peach-blossom color” is listed as a synonym. Instead, it is the color that fabric takes when dyed with peach blossoms, but the practice of dyeing cloth with peach blossoms has fallen out of usage. You will find a different set of colors if you do a Google image search for 桃花 (peach blossom) and 桃花色 (peach blossom color). (You may find some sexual material in your image search, so maybe don’t do the search in the office.) So the term “peach color” in Japanese refers to a specific shade of pink which is divorced from its meaning. I guess English isn’t special after all.

by hrktb 7y ago

klodolph 7y ago

> But I think in english the concepts still stay more separated, … My question is, why do you think that? It sounds like an unfounded assertion to me. I hear you repeating claims but color names have been extensively studied in linguistics, and you have direct access to Japanese dictionaries and encyclopedias online, and you can type Japanese color names into Google image search, so it should be relatively easy to come up with even a small bit of evidence. > …for instance "rose" as a color has parted a lot from the common perception of an actual rose's color. If you look up “rose color” in Japanese Wikipedia, you’ll see that it specifically defines it as a shade between red and magenta, even though roses come in many different shades (yellow, orange, white, cream, etc). https://ja.wikipedia.org/wiki/%E8%96%94%E8%96%87%E8%89%B2 https://ja.wikipedia.org/wiki/%E8%96%94%E8%96%87%E8%89%B2 The problem here is that I am not a Japanese speaker, but this seems to be evidence that the term “rose color” is a specific color, and not a term that means “the color of a rose”. “Peach color” is also interesting. https://ja.wikipedia.org/wiki/%E6%A1%83%E8%89%B2 https://ja.wikipedia.org/wiki/%E6%A1%83%E8%89%B2 Unlike English, this color is not the color of a peach fruit. It is also not the color of a peach blossom, despite the fact that “peach-blossom color” is listed as a synonym. Instead, it is the color that fabric takes when dyed with peach blossoms, but the practice of dyeing cloth with peach blossoms has fallen out of usage. You will find a different set of colors if you do a Google image search for 桃花 (peach blossom) and 桃花色 (peach blossom color). (You may find some sexual material in your image search, so maybe don’t do the search in the office.) So the term “peach color” in Japanese refers to a specific shade of pink which is divorced from its meaning. I guess English isn’t special after all.