4 ms·
Because they didn't intend to use chloroquine as a way to reduce the immune response to cytokine storms. They intended to use it to prevent virus replication i
by Cantbekhan 7y ago
Because they didn't intend to use chloroquine as a way to reduce the immune response to cytokine storms.
They intended to use it to prevent virus replication in the cells at the early stages of the immune response to allow the immune system to build up a response at a slower pace.
The amount of treatment proposed in Europe is around 5 days of HCQ with about 800mg on D1 and then 400mg on D2-5. This is an incredibly low dosage and will have very little immunosuppressant effect. It takes a very long time to act as an efficient immunosuppressant (1 to 3 months for Lupus).
Expecting HCQ to suppress the immune system for cytokine storms in a matter of hours seems very strange.
As that controversial French doctor said in multiple interviews. If you are already in need of a respirator then your issue is no longer the virus but your own immune system killing you (cytokine storm or added bacterial pneumonia). At that stage, HCQ is not very useful. Not in these dosages at least.
Most people are only focusing on the immunosuppressing effect of HCQ for some reason which is very strange to me.
It takes time for chloroquine to act as a zinc ionophore as well and for zinc to enter the cells (and it needs to be in the cells to inhibit RNA polymerase). As you can see in the studies I posted. Between 24 and 72 hours it seems.
If the virus cannot replicate correctly (with the zinc idea), it might give more time to "flatten the curve" for the immune system. To build up antibodies and respond to the disease without inducing a cytokine storm.
This at least is their hypothesis. And it has not been confirmed in any other way than by observing that those with chronic Lupus+HCQ treatment seemed to be "immune" to the disease. And this was only done in Wuhan as far as I know.
Unfortunately Dr Zhan Zhang has not yet published his full results except for this preliminary https://www.medrxiv.org/content/10.1101/2020.03.22.20040758v2.full.pdf https://www.medrxiv.org/content/10.1101/2020.03.22.20040758v...
Which doesn't go into much detail about anything except that "it seems to work". Unfortunately ... Yet I do see logic in the idea.
I just wish people (with access to patient files in major hospital centers) would also look into this and they could maybe confirm this "once and for all" without even needing a full blown trial.
- touisteur 7y agoDo we know of any case of severe covid-19 that was taking immunosuppresors (post-transplant, so cyclosporine or tacrolimus?). Haven't heard of one and the doctors my wife talks to (who follow hundreds of those) haven't heard of one. Yet.
- touisteur 7y agoCorrection, sorry, seems we have (in France) over a 100 adult hospitalized patients infected, that are post renal transplant (less than 5 years post transplant it seems). Not heard of liver transplant cases, or even child transplant cases (even more fragile).