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What a ridiculous zeal. Hardly anyone at this point is arguing that there actually is an issue. After all, flu is still a dangerous illness, esp. for certain g

What a ridiculous zeal. Hardly anyone at this point is arguing that there actually is an issue. After all, flu is still a dangerous illness, esp. for certain groups of people, so even plainly calling this COVID thing "just a flu" is not equivalent to saying that it's not an issue. It's your framing of the phrase "just a flu", that makes it look like some kind of heresy or insult. And, most importantly, why do you call out only journalists and politicians, while there are many perferctly credible people, - first of all, medical experts, - who keep saying, that the scale of panic is dumb? How about doing some reading and fact-checking before crying wolf?

paulgb 7y ago
"just the flu" to me implies that we can treat it like the flu, i.e. go about life as usual and stay home if we catch it. It seems beyond obvious at this point that that's not the case. (Hopefully soon there will be a vaccine and it will become the case.)
- atomashpolskiy 7y ago
  But it literally is a strain of flu. And staying at home, sleeping and drinking a lot of water is exactly what the majority of people who contracted COVID are doing at the moment. Or do you believe that there are 1.3 million people in hospitals or cemeteries right now?
  - paulgb 7y ago
    > Or do you believe that there are 1.3 million people in hospitals or cemeteries right now? No, but I believe that in contrast to the flu, there are millions of healthy people (rightly) staying home right now. Are you saying that the lockdowns are unwarranted?
    - atomashpolskiy 7y ago
      I'm not in the position to make such statements, but there is quite a number of medical professionals, who say exactly this: massive lockdowns of general population aren't necessary. As for me, I personally believe that the medicine is worse than the disease in this case. We can be quite certain at this point that there will be lots of casualties from the economical disruption, and whether the unconstrained virus could have caused more suffering is a question to be answered.
      - paulgb 7y ago
        > but there is quite a number of medical professionals, who say exactly this: massive lockdowns of general population aren't necessary Who?
        atomashpolskiy 7y ago
        Consider this your homework. Google hasn't shutdown yet.
        paulgb 7y ago
        Congratulations on finding a way to turn not having evidence to back up your argument into being condescending.
        atomashpolskiy 7y ago
        I just don't think you are seriously asking for information, because there is shitload on the Web already, but rather mocking me (judging by your one-worded response, which is rude). But in case I'm wrong, here's a nice collection of links to begin with, updated daily: https://swprs.org/a-swiss-doctor-on-covid-19/ https://swprs.org/a-swiss-doctor-on-covid-19/ Scroll to the bottom for most recent updates.
  - nullc 7y ago
    > But it literally is a strain of flu. No, it literally is not. The flu is caused by influenza. Covid19 is caused by sars-cov-2, a relative of SARS-CoV which caused SARS ( https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Severe_acute_respiratory_syndrome https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Severe_acute_respiratory_syndr... ). It is also a (more distant) relative of HCoV-OC43 which is one of the many viruses that cause the cold. The problems that influenza and sars-cov-2 cause for us are pretty different: Influenza mutates fairly quickly so we're not able to stop it completely with our otherwise highly effective vaccines, while even though they mutate comparatively much slower we don't have any effective drug treatments for coronaviruses: Some are not dangerous enough to have been economically interesting to develop treatments for while others were stopped by non-drug interventions (like the sick people dying too quickly and the detection of fever before the virus was highly communicable).
    - atomashpolskiy 7y ago
      I was saying that this is yet another virus strain that causes flu-like illness, i.e. cold with fever, etc. Leave your pedantry for someone else.
      - nullc 7y ago
        I tend to reserve it for people who use "x is literally y" as the totality of their argument. :P
        atomashpolskiy 7y ago
        You see, only a few months ago for the majority of people the word "flu" was a perferctly fine umbrella term for all of these viruses, including multiple coronaviruses. Now everyone is an expert virusologist with rigorous fervor for miniscule details. This is silly and drives us into the wrong direction, because the actual illness is not very different (it's a fact), but the amount of attention payed to it leads to huge overreaction. Oh, it's a relative of SARS, god forbid, oh my god, we're all going to die! Bullshit.
      - tigershark 7y ago
  - deleted 7y ago
    [deleted]
  - rsynnott 7y ago
    > But it literally is a strain of flu Eh? No, it is not. Who told you this? Whoever it was, stop listening to them. Bloody hell.
    - atomashpolskiy 7y ago
      I was using the word "flu" in the broader sense. People commonly refer to virus-caused colds as simply flu. So what I was trying to say was that this is yet another virus that causes "flu".
      - rsynnott 7y ago
        Ah, I see, ‘flu’ in the ‘broader sense’ of basically bloody anything. Yes, I’ve got a touch of the bubonic plague today. Oh, I’m using ‘bubonic plague’ in the broader sense; I stubbed my toe.
        atomashpolskiy 7y ago
        Note that it's you who is grossly exaggerating. Got anything meaningful to say regarding confirmed difference between flu and covid?
tigershark 7y ago
It’s an insult. Covid-19 is in the best case 30 times as deadly as the flu while being twice as contagious. Calling it just a flu and downplaying it is actively causing thousands of deaths.
- atomashpolskiy 7y ago
  You seem to be mentally unstable. There is nothing insulting about being skeptical. I have facts to back my statements, can you say the same for yourself?
  - tigershark 7y ago
    You didn’t post any fact. Only a meaningless link to Iceland numbers. Thanks for insinuating that I’m mentally unstable by the way. That is certainly a very stable and mature behaviour.
    - atomashpolskiy 7y ago
      You post fear-inducing bullshit with a straight face, get insulted by something that challenges your beliefs and carpet-bomb all my comments in the thread. That's the definition of a crank.
atomashpolskiy 7y ago
As this comment seems to be controversial, and I'm getting many downvotes, I'd like to provide a couple of links for anyone interested in the topic. John Ioannidis MD of Stanford University: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=d6MZy-2fcBw https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=d6MZy-2fcBw Knut Wittkowski, for twenty years head of The Rockefeller University's Department of Biostatistics, Epidemiology, and Research Design: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lGC5sGdz4kg https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lGC5sGdz4kg A collection of fact-checked links to public statements and critical research about COVID-19, updated DAILY (scroll to bottom for the most recent additions): https://swprs.org/a-swiss-doctor-on-covid-19/ https://swprs.org/a-swiss-doctor-on-covid-19/

paulgb 7y ago

"just the flu" to me implies that we can treat it like the flu, i.e. go about life as usual and stay home if we catch it. It seems beyond obvious at this point that that's not the case. (Hopefully soon there will be a vaccine and it will become the case.)

atomashpolskiy 7y ago
But it literally is a strain of flu. And staying at home, sleeping and drinking a lot of water is exactly what the majority of people who contracted COVID are doing at the moment. Or do you believe that there are 1.3 million people in hospitals or cemeteries right now?
- paulgb 7y ago
  > Or do you believe that there are 1.3 million people in hospitals or cemeteries right now? No, but I believe that in contrast to the flu, there are millions of healthy people (rightly) staying home right now. Are you saying that the lockdowns are unwarranted?
  - atomashpolskiy 7y ago
    I'm not in the position to make such statements, but there is quite a number of medical professionals, who say exactly this: massive lockdowns of general population aren't necessary. As for me, I personally believe that the medicine is worse than the disease in this case. We can be quite certain at this point that there will be lots of casualties from the economical disruption, and whether the unconstrained virus could have caused more suffering is a question to be answered.
    - paulgb 7y ago
      > but there is quite a number of medical professionals, who say exactly this: massive lockdowns of general population aren't necessary Who?
      - atomashpolskiy 7y ago
        Consider this your homework. Google hasn't shutdown yet.
        paulgb 7y ago
        Congratulations on finding a way to turn not having evidence to back up your argument into being condescending.
        atomashpolskiy 7y ago
        I just don't think you are seriously asking for information, because there is shitload on the Web already, but rather mocking me (judging by your one-worded response, which is rude). But in case I'm wrong, here's a nice collection of links to begin with, updated daily: https://swprs.org/a-swiss-doctor-on-covid-19/ https://swprs.org/a-swiss-doctor-on-covid-19/ Scroll to the bottom for most recent updates.
- nullc 7y ago
  > But it literally is a strain of flu. No, it literally is not. The flu is caused by influenza. Covid19 is caused by sars-cov-2, a relative of SARS-CoV which caused SARS ( https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Severe_acute_respiratory_syndrome https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Severe_acute_respiratory_syndr... ). It is also a (more distant) relative of HCoV-OC43 which is one of the many viruses that cause the cold. The problems that influenza and sars-cov-2 cause for us are pretty different: Influenza mutates fairly quickly so we're not able to stop it completely with our otherwise highly effective vaccines, while even though they mutate comparatively much slower we don't have any effective drug treatments for coronaviruses: Some are not dangerous enough to have been economically interesting to develop treatments for while others were stopped by non-drug interventions (like the sick people dying too quickly and the detection of fever before the virus was highly communicable).
  - atomashpolskiy 7y ago
    I was saying that this is yet another virus strain that causes flu-like illness, i.e. cold with fever, etc. Leave your pedantry for someone else.
    - nullc 7y ago
      I tend to reserve it for people who use "x is literally y" as the totality of their argument. :P
      - atomashpolskiy 7y ago
        You see, only a few months ago for the majority of people the word "flu" was a perferctly fine umbrella term for all of these viruses, including multiple coronaviruses. Now everyone is an expert virusologist with rigorous fervor for miniscule details. This is silly and drives us into the wrong direction, because the actual illness is not very different (it's a fact), but the amount of attention payed to it leads to huge overreaction. Oh, it's a relative of SARS, god forbid, oh my god, we're all going to die! Bullshit.
    - tigershark 7y ago
- deleted 7y ago
  [deleted]
- rsynnott 7y ago
  > But it literally is a strain of flu Eh? No, it is not. Who told you this? Whoever it was, stop listening to them. Bloody hell.
  - atomashpolskiy 7y ago
    I was using the word "flu" in the broader sense. People commonly refer to virus-caused colds as simply flu. So what I was trying to say was that this is yet another virus that causes "flu".
    - rsynnott 7y ago
      Ah, I see, ‘flu’ in the ‘broader sense’ of basically bloody anything. Yes, I’ve got a touch of the bubonic plague today. Oh, I’m using ‘bubonic plague’ in the broader sense; I stubbed my toe.
      - atomashpolskiy 7y ago
        Note that it's you who is grossly exaggerating. Got anything meaningful to say regarding confirmed difference between flu and covid?

tigershark 7y ago

It’s an insult. Covid-19 is in the best case 30 times as deadly as the flu while being twice as contagious. Calling it just a flu and downplaying it is actively causing thousands of deaths.

atomashpolskiy 7y ago
You seem to be mentally unstable. There is nothing insulting about being skeptical. I have facts to back my statements, can you say the same for yourself?
- tigershark 7y ago
  You didn’t post any fact. Only a meaningless link to Iceland numbers. Thanks for insinuating that I’m mentally unstable by the way. That is certainly a very stable and mature behaviour.
  - atomashpolskiy 7y ago
    You post fear-inducing bullshit with a straight face, get insulted by something that challenges your beliefs and carpet-bomb all my comments in the thread. That's the definition of a crank.

atomashpolskiy 7y ago

As this comment seems to be controversial, and I'm getting many downvotes, I'd like to provide a couple of links for anyone interested in the topic. John Ioannidis MD of Stanford University: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=d6MZy-2fcBw https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=d6MZy-2fcBw Knut Wittkowski, for twenty years head of The Rockefeller University's Department of Biostatistics, Epidemiology, and Research Design: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lGC5sGdz4kg https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lGC5sGdz4kg A collection of fact-checked links to public statements and critical research about COVID-19, updated DAILY (scroll to bottom for the most recent additions): https://swprs.org/a-swiss-doctor-on-covid-19/ https://swprs.org/a-swiss-doctor-on-covid-19/