4 ms·

The difference you're missing is we're still relying on COBOL, but we aren't relying on grandparents to make the butter and bread we eat lest we starve.

Grimm1 7y ago
Not ideal, but it's not like it couldn't be migrated to another language and COBOL docs are readily available to at least understand the language. We would find a way.
- Zenst 7y ago
  I've worked for a software migration company and for some languages and the bulk of code you can automate the migration. However you also need to migrate the data and then anything that touches that data, so whilst you may want to migrate one program, that program will be a suit of programs and systems making it a more complicated task than it appears on the surface. If you can data warehouse aspects off, that's great and can slowly bite away, migrate chunks bit by bit. Though one of the last will often be the database itself. Report generation is often an area that will hit resources hard and can also be easiest to migrate away towards something better using a system that periodically syncs the database onto another platform with all the latest do it yourself easy accessible tools. That allows those wanting the reports to be able to make and change that themselves removing a lot of code development and main system overhead. With that, knowing the language is not even half the battle, the business knowledge would be the lion's share and to integrate the two skills effectively, that's where the money is. You could have a payroll system, migrate line by line, logic by logic from COBOL to C. Yet the way the data is handled, the nuances of the way the languages round numbers, store data, formats, handle exceptions or early termination. It's not just a case of setting the right flags in the compiler and job done. But yes, there is always a way. As always, the devil is in the detail.
  - Kye 7y ago
    One solution I saw somewhere here on HN the last time it came up was to carefully virtualize the existing systems so they have snapshots to restore from when things go wrong. That opens the possibility of moving the data to more modern systems with a translation layer between the 40 year old systems and the new systems that slowly replace them.
Zenst 7y ago
If you think of the butter as software running upon a compter and the process of manufacture the programming language, then you start to see it differently. Though my main point I was making is that skills get lost over time for various reasons and how later you try to rediscover those skills for various reasons. I dare say that being able to make butter would be handy in some situations, imagine being isolated and access to a cow milk easily and your local shop not having any butter in stock for a while.

Grimm1 7y ago

Not ideal, but it's not like it couldn't be migrated to another language and COBOL docs are readily available to at least understand the language. We would find a way.

Zenst 7y ago
I've worked for a software migration company and for some languages and the bulk of code you can automate the migration. However you also need to migrate the data and then anything that touches that data, so whilst you may want to migrate one program, that program will be a suit of programs and systems making it a more complicated task than it appears on the surface. If you can data warehouse aspects off, that's great and can slowly bite away, migrate chunks bit by bit. Though one of the last will often be the database itself. Report generation is often an area that will hit resources hard and can also be easiest to migrate away towards something better using a system that periodically syncs the database onto another platform with all the latest do it yourself easy accessible tools. That allows those wanting the reports to be able to make and change that themselves removing a lot of code development and main system overhead. With that, knowing the language is not even half the battle, the business knowledge would be the lion's share and to integrate the two skills effectively, that's where the money is. You could have a payroll system, migrate line by line, logic by logic from COBOL to C. Yet the way the data is handled, the nuances of the way the languages round numbers, store data, formats, handle exceptions or early termination. It's not just a case of setting the right flags in the compiler and job done. But yes, there is always a way. As always, the devil is in the detail.
- Kye 7y ago
  One solution I saw somewhere here on HN the last time it came up was to carefully virtualize the existing systems so they have snapshots to restore from when things go wrong. That opens the possibility of moving the data to more modern systems with a translation layer between the 40 year old systems and the new systems that slowly replace them.

Zenst 7y ago

If you think of the butter as software running upon a compter and the process of manufacture the programming language, then you start to see it differently. Though my main point I was making is that skills get lost over time for various reasons and how later you try to rediscover those skills for various reasons. I dare say that being able to make butter would be handy in some situations, imagine being isolated and access to a cow milk easily and your local shop not having any butter in stock for a while.