12 ms·

Unbuilt London: The “railway arcade” above the streets

62 points by gullyfur 7y ago

Theodores 7y ago
The illustration looks lovely, however, the realisation would probably have been more like Docklands Light Railway, which is elevated but not following the existing streets as per the illustration. There is a certain amount of wasteland that goes in the immediate vicinity of the DLR, which is a 'light' railway with the electric propulsion that was what they were looking for with the pneumatic system.
notjustanymike 7y ago
Leave it to the English to consider ways to get even less sunlight.
- jjgreen 7y ago
  It burns!
- bobthepanda 7y ago
  To be fair, how many blue-sky days were there in industrial England?
growlist 7y ago
'Umbrella manufacturers hate him!'
rwmj 7y ago
There's a good radio programme about Brunel's Atmospheric Railway (and Musk's Hyperloop): https://www.bbc.co.uk/programmes/m00027mg https://www.bbc.co.uk/programmes/m00027mg
take_a_breath 7y ago
Similar to Chicago's "L" in the downtown Loop. Although that one is in the middle of the street, not over the sidewalks.
- hbosch 7y ago
  I believe it's spelled "El", as in, "elevated".
  - idreyn 7y ago
    this is maybe my least favorite bit of transit-related pedantry, but it's officially designated the 'L' (in single quotes) by the CTA.
    - drewbug01 7y ago
      > this is maybe my least favorite bit of transit-related pedantry I'm most impressed that you've stack-ranked your various bits of transit-related pedantry. But, in the interest of science, what is your most favorite bit of transit-related pedantry?
      - ummwhat 7y ago
        The thing that connects a train to overhead wires is called a pantograph. The connection to a third rail is not a pantograph.
mannykannot 7y ago
An atmospheric railway would not be silent. Steel wheels on steel rails make a lot of noise, especially before the development of continuous welded rail, and also when without the dampening effect of being on the ground.
- kitd 7y ago
  This was pointed out in the article.
- DonHopkins 7y ago
  Pressurized air and leather flaps have the potential of sounding like a giant industrial whoopie cushion.
londons_explore 7y ago
Pretty much this design was built... They just flipped the positions of the people and the trains...
- bobthepanda 7y ago
  Well, no, they dug up the street to build the railway. A true flipping would've been the construction of a new street level above the old one, and then the dedication of the old one to railway uses. Chicago did do this, but for the purposes of building sewers: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Raising_of_Chicago https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Raising_of_Chicago
  - dTal 7y ago
    Wow, now this really is a forgotten gem of history. They raised every building in Chicago on jacks, with people still inside them! "One patron was puzzled to note that the front steps leading from the street into the hotel were becoming steeper every day and that when he checked out, the windows were several feet above his head, whereas before they had been at eye level."
deleted 7y ago
[deleted]
DenisM 7y ago
That looks exactly like Seattle monorail. https://www.seattlemonorail.com/events-and-news/this-week-at-seattle-center/ https://www.seattlemonorail.com/events-and-news/this-week-at...
- romwell 7y ago
  No, the whole point is that it does not: the arcades would be connected to the buildings, providing a roof which people could under lengthwise. This is important, because that meant, as the article says, that the building facades had to be rebuilt all the way through. And this was a major reason for a no-go for the project. Seattle Monorail runs on a track that is supported by wide pillars, not an arcade. You can't walk length-wise under it, the pillars are in the way. But the pillars mean that it does not need to touch the buildings it runs next to. It can (and does) go in the middle of the street. In short, it's not an arcade.
bsdubernerd 7y ago
Absolutely tangential but I love this style of illustration, especially all the technical drawings of the era. Works of art on themselves.
thescriptkiddie 7y ago
Here's an amusing podcast (with slides) about the atmospheric railway and why it didn't work. I recommend watching at 1.5x speed. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JaRVy31lTlQ https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JaRVy31lTlQ
toddmorey 7y ago
Elevated railways like monorails aren't more widespread because of the added expense around elevated track and especially elevated stations. Somehow, you've got to get folks up and down from there. I'm glad because they are pretty unsightly.
- zwayhowder 7y ago
  All costing I've seen for elevated tracks is actually significantly cheaper than at grade or underground options. I used to be on my local government and worked with the state government on a number of transport projects so I can't cite sources directly. This website has some comparisons, but obviously is biased towards monorails. https://www.monorailsaustralia.com.au/ https://www.monorailsaustralia.com.au/ If you look at countries such as Japan that asides from population density have a very relaxed attitude to multifloor buildings having entrances at different levels you can see successful elevated railway implementations because the stations are integrated to existing large buildings such as malls, hotels & commercial offices. One thing I've noticed in Sydney was people don't tend to look up if their not expecting something, so in Chinatown and Koreatown (We don't really have a Japantown yet but Sydney Central Park is getting there) buildings have advertisements on the other floors to let people know they are upstairs. In the rest of the city you can walk past a building and have no idea who the tenants are on the other floors. This also stopped Sydney from noticing the (in hindsight) blatantly obvious, almost Jetsonesque monorail stations right above their heads.
  - teruakohatu 7y ago
    Serious question: do you think The Simpsons hurt the monorail industry?
- ihuman 7y ago
  > Somehow, you've got to get folks up and down from there How is that different from underground railways? You still need to get people down and up from them
  - notatoad 7y ago
DonHopkins 7y ago
What kind of games did they have for arcades in Victorian London? Was it mainly pinball? ;)

62 points by gullyfur 7y ago

The illustration looks lovely, however, the realisation would probably have been more like Docklands Light Railway, which is elevated but not following the existing streets as per the illustration. There is a certain amount of wasteland that goes in the immediate vicinity of the DLR, which is a 'light' railway with the electric propulsion that was what they were looking for with the pneumatic system.

notjustanymike 7y ago

Leave it to the English to consider ways to get even less sunlight.

jjgreen 7y ago
It burns!
bobthepanda 7y ago
To be fair, how many blue-sky days were there in industrial England?

growlist 7y ago

'Umbrella manufacturers hate him!'

rwmj 7y ago

There's a good radio programme about Brunel's Atmospheric Railway (and Musk's Hyperloop): https://www.bbc.co.uk/programmes/m00027mg https://www.bbc.co.uk/programmes/m00027mg

take_a_breath 7y ago

Similar to Chicago's "L" in the downtown Loop. Although that one is in the middle of the street, not over the sidewalks.

hbosch 7y ago
I believe it's spelled "El", as in, "elevated".
- idreyn 7y ago
  this is maybe my least favorite bit of transit-related pedantry, but it's officially designated the 'L' (in single quotes) by the CTA.
  - drewbug01 7y ago
    > this is maybe my least favorite bit of transit-related pedantry I'm most impressed that you've stack-ranked your various bits of transit-related pedantry. But, in the interest of science, what is your most favorite bit of transit-related pedantry?
    - ummwhat 7y ago
      The thing that connects a train to overhead wires is called a pantograph. The connection to a third rail is not a pantograph.

mannykannot 7y ago

An atmospheric railway would not be silent. Steel wheels on steel rails make a lot of noise, especially before the development of continuous welded rail, and also when without the dampening effect of being on the ground.

kitd 7y ago
This was pointed out in the article.
DonHopkins 7y ago
Pressurized air and leather flaps have the potential of sounding like a giant industrial whoopie cushion.

londons_explore 7y ago

Pretty much this design was built... They just flipped the positions of the people and the trains...

bobthepanda 7y ago
Well, no, they dug up the street to build the railway. A true flipping would've been the construction of a new street level above the old one, and then the dedication of the old one to railway uses. Chicago did do this, but for the purposes of building sewers: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Raising_of_Chicago https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Raising_of_Chicago
- dTal 7y ago
  Wow, now this really is a forgotten gem of history. They raised every building in Chicago on jacks, with people still inside them! "One patron was puzzled to note that the front steps leading from the street into the hotel were becoming steeper every day and that when he checked out, the windows were several feet above his head, whereas before they had been at eye level."

deleted 7y ago

[deleted]

DenisM 7y ago

That looks exactly like Seattle monorail. https://www.seattlemonorail.com/events-and-news/this-week-at-seattle-center/ https://www.seattlemonorail.com/events-and-news/this-week-at...

romwell 7y ago
No, the whole point is that it does not: the arcades would be connected to the buildings, providing a roof which people could under lengthwise. This is important, because that meant, as the article says, that the building facades had to be rebuilt all the way through. And this was a major reason for a no-go for the project. Seattle Monorail runs on a track that is supported by wide pillars, not an arcade. You can't walk length-wise under it, the pillars are in the way. But the pillars mean that it does not need to touch the buildings it runs next to. It can (and does) go in the middle of the street. In short, it's not an arcade.

bsdubernerd 7y ago

Absolutely tangential but I love this style of illustration, especially all the technical drawings of the era. Works of art on themselves.

thescriptkiddie 7y ago

Here's an amusing podcast (with slides) about the atmospheric railway and why it didn't work. I recommend watching at 1.5x speed. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JaRVy31lTlQ https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JaRVy31lTlQ

toddmorey 7y ago

Elevated railways like monorails aren't more widespread because of the added expense around elevated track and especially elevated stations. Somehow, you've got to get folks up and down from there. I'm glad because they are pretty unsightly.

zwayhowder 7y ago
All costing I've seen for elevated tracks is actually significantly cheaper than at grade or underground options. I used to be on my local government and worked with the state government on a number of transport projects so I can't cite sources directly. This website has some comparisons, but obviously is biased towards monorails. https://www.monorailsaustralia.com.au/ https://www.monorailsaustralia.com.au/ If you look at countries such as Japan that asides from population density have a very relaxed attitude to multifloor buildings having entrances at different levels you can see successful elevated railway implementations because the stations are integrated to existing large buildings such as malls, hotels & commercial offices. One thing I've noticed in Sydney was people don't tend to look up if their not expecting something, so in Chinatown and Koreatown (We don't really have a Japantown yet but Sydney Central Park is getting there) buildings have advertisements on the other floors to let people know they are upstairs. In the rest of the city you can walk past a building and have no idea who the tenants are on the other floors. This also stopped Sydney from noticing the (in hindsight) blatantly obvious, almost Jetsonesque monorail stations right above their heads.
- teruakohatu 7y ago
  Serious question: do you think The Simpsons hurt the monorail industry?
ihuman 7y ago
> Somehow, you've got to get folks up and down from there How is that different from underground railways? You still need to get people down and up from them
- notatoad 7y ago

DonHopkins 7y ago

What kind of games did they have for arcades in Victorian London? Was it mainly pinball? ;)