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Face masks from China intended for France 'hijacked' by US at the last minute

35 points by Cantbekhan 7y ago

jb775 7y ago
Shouldn't France be pissed off at China for re-selling the already sold masks? The US probably wasn't even told the masks in question were already sold. The countries should coordinate who needs masks sooner, and work out the logistics. My wife is a nurse in the US and they literally don't have enough masks for nurses/doctors to wear.
osobo 7y ago
Such an American thing to do. Joke's on them though: These Chinese masks are often defective.
- kharms 7y ago
  France blocked the export of (purchased) masks to Switzerland, and other nations. https://www.swissinfo.ch/eng/coronavirus_medical-goods-from-the-eu-remain-blocked/45642340 https://www.swissinfo.ch/eng/coronavirus_medical-goods-from-...
- Justin_K 7y ago
  I wish I could downvote this as there is no substance to the claim that the US stole masks or stole an order from someone else. If anything, the Chinese would be at fault here for diverting an order.
- vinay427 7y ago
  At least the Americans paid for them in a deal, unlike the French that sezied masks destined for places like Switzerland, where I live.
diebeforei485 7y ago
Even removing the "paying 3-4 times more, and in cash" aspect, the US probably needs it more at the moment.
- MagnumOpus 7y ago
  France has 900 cases per million vs the US at 700 cases per million. So: no, unless you think French lives are worth less?
  - diebeforei485 7y ago
    Masks cannot be divided fractionally, so per-capita analysis does not work here.
    - mantap 7y ago
      That doesn't make any sense.
      - thatguy0900 7y ago
        You need masks based on the number of patients, not the number of patients per capita, it makes perfect sense. Not that I'm defending this.
        drusepth 7y ago
        Looking at either number of patients or patients per capita both result in nonfractional masks given to individual patients. It's just a matter of whether someone morally thinks more patients equals more urgent (60k FR vs 235K US), or a higher percentage of the population as patients (0.08% FR vs 0.07% US) equals more urgent, no?
        Wowfunhappy 7y ago
        I don't know where diebeforei485 was going with "fractional masks" either, but thatguy0900 makes a good point in isolation. A country of 1,000 people and a 10% infection rate has a greater shortage of masks than a country of 5 people and a 100% infection rate.
        7y ago
robocat 7y ago
France hijacks masks and other PPE intended for EU: https://www.irishtimes.com/news/world/europe/coronavirus-european-solidarity-sidelined-as-french-interests-take-priority-1.4216184 https://www.irishtimes.com/news/world/europe/coronavirus-eur... “On March 3rd, President Emmanuel Macron announced that he was requisitioning ‘all stocks and the production of protective masks’ for distribution to medical personnel and French people infected with Covid-19. One fifth of all surgical procedures in the EU use personal protective equipment imported from Asia by the Swedish company Mölnlycke. The company’s main distribution warehouse for southern Europe, Belgium and the Netherlands is in Lyon.”
- RegnisGnaw 7y ago
  The better quote would be this: "Mölnlycke’s entire stock of an estimated six million masks was seized by the French. All had been contracted for, including a million masks each for France, Italy and Spain. The rest were destined for Belgium, the Netherlands, Portugal and Switzerland, which has special trading status with the EU."
- rasz 7y ago
  This was after Germany did the same with 3M distribution center.
mantap 7y ago
SARS was 20 years ago. France has had 20 years to prepare for this but left it to the last minute. Of course the masks are going to the highest bidder, that's entirely predictable.
- conchulio 7y ago
  It’s like if you paid for a new car and when you want to unlock it and drive it home someone else pays two times more and takes it from you. That’s not not allowed even in the freest markets in the world.
  - mantap 7y ago
    It is allowed. It's a fundamental principle of international law that states are not subject to the laws of other states, except by treaty. There's no applicable law that would prevent China from doing this. Besides even in the consumer space you have things like airlines overbooking flights and then kicking people off the plane when too many passengers show up.
  - diebeforei485 7y ago
    I don't believe France actually paid for the masks at that point though.
RegnisGnaw 7y ago
Germany did the same thing to Switzerland (seized rather then outbid) https://www.bloomberg.com/news/articles/2020-03-09/germany-faces-backlash-from-neighbors-over-mask-export-ban https://www.bloomberg.com/news/articles/2020-03-09/germany-f... Countries that have the power are doing everything to ensure they have masks first. I'm not surprised France and US are doing it.
ardy42 7y ago
So what's going on? This article claims that millions of N95 respirators located in the US are queued up to be shipped overseas: https://www.forbes.com/sites/daviddisalvo/2020/03/30/i-spent-a-day-in-the-coronavirus-driven-feeding-frenzy-of-n95-mask-sellers-and-buyers-and-this-is-what-i-learned/ https://www.forbes.com/sites/daviddisalvo/2020/03/30/i-spent... > By the end of the day, roughly 280 million masks from warehouses around the U.S. had been purchased by foreign buyers and were earmarked to leave the country, according to the broker — and that was in one day. > To his knowledge none of the masks had been purchased by buyers in the U.S.
timwaagh 7y ago
It is pretty ugly what is happening now. france seizing european masks. the us seizing french masks. dutch ventilators getting seized in the us. we're supposed to be allies. let's stop this now. Perhaps we can let nato take charge of mask distribution and procurement. Otherwise that thing with Italians getting russian aid might not be a one-off.
- notechback 7y ago
  Italy got more masks and PPE from Germany and France than China and Russia. You don't hear much about the former as their intention is to actually help, while the latter are doing a propaganda campaign.
  - zepto 7y ago
    I.e. the propaganda campaign is working
sfj 7y ago
Meanwhile, Taiwan is donating 2 million masks to the US: https://www.washingtonexaminer.com/policy/defense-national-security/taiwan-to-donate-2m-hospital-masks-to-united-states https://www.washingtonexaminer.com/policy/defense-national-s...
Verdes 7y ago
France gave back half of the Swedish masks (coming from the Molnlyncke supply in Lyon) and they were first seized in France, because of a French requisition law... Will the US Government give back half the plane they stole from French people in China?
edwinyzh 7y ago
Things like this is really an eye-opener to me, frankly.

35 points by Cantbekhan 7y ago

Shouldn't France be pissed off at China for re-selling the already sold masks? The US probably wasn't even told the masks in question were already sold. The countries should coordinate who needs masks sooner, and work out the logistics. My wife is a nurse in the US and they literally don't have enough masks for nurses/doctors to wear.

osobo 7y ago

Such an American thing to do. Joke's on them though: These Chinese masks are often defective.

kharms 7y ago
France blocked the export of (purchased) masks to Switzerland, and other nations. https://www.swissinfo.ch/eng/coronavirus_medical-goods-from-the-eu-remain-blocked/45642340 https://www.swissinfo.ch/eng/coronavirus_medical-goods-from-...
Justin_K 7y ago
I wish I could downvote this as there is no substance to the claim that the US stole masks or stole an order from someone else. If anything, the Chinese would be at fault here for diverting an order.
vinay427 7y ago
At least the Americans paid for them in a deal, unlike the French that sezied masks destined for places like Switzerland, where I live.

diebeforei485 7y ago

Even removing the "paying 3-4 times more, and in cash" aspect, the US probably needs it more at the moment.

MagnumOpus 7y ago
France has 900 cases per million vs the US at 700 cases per million. So: no, unless you think French lives are worth less?
- diebeforei485 7y ago
  Masks cannot be divided fractionally, so per-capita analysis does not work here.
  - mantap 7y ago
    That doesn't make any sense.
    - thatguy0900 7y ago
      You need masks based on the number of patients, not the number of patients per capita, it makes perfect sense. Not that I'm defending this.
      - drusepth 7y ago
        Looking at either number of patients or patients per capita both result in nonfractional masks given to individual patients. It's just a matter of whether someone morally thinks more patients equals more urgent (60k FR vs 235K US), or a higher percentage of the population as patients (0.08% FR vs 0.07% US) equals more urgent, no?
        Wowfunhappy 7y ago
        I don't know where diebeforei485 was going with "fractional masks" either, but thatguy0900 makes a good point in isolation. A country of 1,000 people and a 10% infection rate has a greater shortage of masks than a country of 5 people and a 100% infection rate.
        7y ago

robocat 7y ago

France hijacks masks and other PPE intended for EU: https://www.irishtimes.com/news/world/europe/coronavirus-european-solidarity-sidelined-as-french-interests-take-priority-1.4216184 https://www.irishtimes.com/news/world/europe/coronavirus-eur... “On March 3rd, President Emmanuel Macron announced that he was requisitioning ‘all stocks and the production of protective masks’ for distribution to medical personnel and French people infected with Covid-19. One fifth of all surgical procedures in the EU use personal protective equipment imported from Asia by the Swedish company Mölnlycke. The company’s main distribution warehouse for southern Europe, Belgium and the Netherlands is in Lyon.”

RegnisGnaw 7y ago
The better quote would be this: "Mölnlycke’s entire stock of an estimated six million masks was seized by the French. All had been contracted for, including a million masks each for France, Italy and Spain. The rest were destined for Belgium, the Netherlands, Portugal and Switzerland, which has special trading status with the EU."
rasz 7y ago
This was after Germany did the same with 3M distribution center.

mantap 7y ago

SARS was 20 years ago. France has had 20 years to prepare for this but left it to the last minute. Of course the masks are going to the highest bidder, that's entirely predictable.

conchulio 7y ago
It’s like if you paid for a new car and when you want to unlock it and drive it home someone else pays two times more and takes it from you. That’s not not allowed even in the freest markets in the world.
- mantap 7y ago
  It is allowed. It's a fundamental principle of international law that states are not subject to the laws of other states, except by treaty. There's no applicable law that would prevent China from doing this. Besides even in the consumer space you have things like airlines overbooking flights and then kicking people off the plane when too many passengers show up.
- diebeforei485 7y ago
  I don't believe France actually paid for the masks at that point though.

RegnisGnaw 7y ago

Germany did the same thing to Switzerland (seized rather then outbid) https://www.bloomberg.com/news/articles/2020-03-09/germany-faces-backlash-from-neighbors-over-mask-export-ban https://www.bloomberg.com/news/articles/2020-03-09/germany-f... Countries that have the power are doing everything to ensure they have masks first. I'm not surprised France and US are doing it.

ardy42 7y ago

So what's going on? This article claims that millions of N95 respirators located in the US are queued up to be shipped overseas: https://www.forbes.com/sites/daviddisalvo/2020/03/30/i-spent-a-day-in-the-coronavirus-driven-feeding-frenzy-of-n95-mask-sellers-and-buyers-and-this-is-what-i-learned/ https://www.forbes.com/sites/daviddisalvo/2020/03/30/i-spent... > By the end of the day, roughly 280 million masks from warehouses around the U.S. had been purchased by foreign buyers and were earmarked to leave the country, according to the broker — and that was in one day. > To his knowledge none of the masks had been purchased by buyers in the U.S.

timwaagh 7y ago

It is pretty ugly what is happening now. france seizing european masks. the us seizing french masks. dutch ventilators getting seized in the us. we're supposed to be allies. let's stop this now. Perhaps we can let nato take charge of mask distribution and procurement. Otherwise that thing with Italians getting russian aid might not be a one-off.

notechback 7y ago
Italy got more masks and PPE from Germany and France than China and Russia. You don't hear much about the former as their intention is to actually help, while the latter are doing a propaganda campaign.
- zepto 7y ago
  I.e. the propaganda campaign is working

sfj 7y ago

Meanwhile, Taiwan is donating 2 million masks to the US: https://www.washingtonexaminer.com/policy/defense-national-security/taiwan-to-donate-2m-hospital-masks-to-united-states https://www.washingtonexaminer.com/policy/defense-national-s...

Verdes 7y ago

France gave back half of the Swedish masks (coming from the Molnlyncke supply in Lyon) and they were first seized in France, because of a French requisition law... Will the US Government give back half the plane they stole from French people in China?

edwinyzh 7y ago

Things like this is really an eye-opener to me, frankly.