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In theory, it seems like nvc should enable higher degrees of emotional authenticity and transparency, but in practice, at least in my experience, it seems to do

In theory, it seems like nvc should enable higher degrees of emotional authenticity and transparency, but in practice, at least in my experience, it seems to do the opposite for most people. Anecdotally, the vast majority of the nvc people I've observed are some combination of manipulative, dishonest, or severely passive aggressive. I wonder if the explanation for this is found here: because I need [universal need]. It's never because the speaker is selfish, or an asshole, it's always a "universal need". One notable exception was, by nature, a sweet, kind, respectful person before she encountered nvc. NVC fit her well, and she remained a wonderful person, who still communicated in a straight forward and honest manner.

BeetleB 7y ago
> It's never because the speaker is selfish Trust me: Everyone is selfish. They just manifest it in different ways. That person who gives everything he has for charity is being selfish. Most sane people do things because it satisfies something in them. The one who is very generous is getting something out of it. Even when dealing with selfish people, it's good to identify what they are getting out of it.
- jshevek 7y ago
  This is an obvious and trivial observation which misses the point of my statement. In my experience, the vast majority of NVC practitioners use NVC as a weapon to manipulate others by righteously invoking "universal needs" while avoiding introspection into their character flaws. Edit: I acknowledge that my "anectdata" leaves out people who practice NVC without giving any overt indication of it. As with vegans, there is probably a selection bias for other personality characteristics. (The best vegans are not as obviously vegan)
  - BeetleB 7y ago
    Generally, people using the NVC template that you recognize are "beginners". So your edit is probably very relevant. As I said in another comment: Actually observe those who communicate very well in stressful situations (very well = both parties not upset after the fact, with some resolution on the issue at hand), and you'll find their approach is fairly similar to NVC - they're just not using the templates your recognize.
- fenwick67 7y ago
  https://www.thefreedictionary.com/selfish https://www.thefreedictionary.com/selfish "Concerned chiefly or excessively with oneself, and having little regard for others" (the second part being an important piece of the definition you have forgotten)
Ididntdothis 7y ago
I think for all these methods to work there is the prerequisite that the user has some level of internal balance already or at least is willing to develop it. Otherwise something like NVC is just a way of papering over one’s own flaws. I had such a phase too a long time ago when I learned some communication skills. I enthusiastically applied my new methods and was constantly pissed off at other people because they didn’t reciprocate immediately. It took me a while to realize that I first had to clean up my own act before there could be a real improvement.
- jshevek 7y ago
  Thank you for your response. Would you agree that introspection and character development are important parts of a healthy NVC process? That an individual's application of NVC suffers without it?
  - pmichaud 7y ago
    I think it's probably more than just that. I think when applied ideally, NVC is just a method of character development. I think the point of the format is to create internal clarity about what is happening inside you (your beliefs and values) and in your interactions with other people. I think that sentence is about NVC, but is also just a general description of character building (at least a substantial part of it). So yeah, people who now have a new format to say sentences in, but who make no changes internally are doing NVC wrong :)
  - Ididntdothis 7y ago
    “Would you agree that introspection and character development are important parts of a healthy NVC process? That an individual's application of NVC suffers without it?“ That’s my firm belief. It’s pretty much the same with all methods. If you just use technique without deeper understanding the result will always be shallow. We see the same with Agile. A lot of companies are practicing the methods but don’t really understand or follow the underlining reasoning.
  - wintermutestwin 7y ago
    Here are a list of soft skills that should be practiced to strengthen your ability to resolve conflict: Empathy, Non-judgement, Active Listening, Calm presence, Interrupting gently, Reframing, Asking effective questions.

BeetleB 7y ago

> It's never because the speaker is selfish Trust me: Everyone is selfish. They just manifest it in different ways. That person who gives everything he has for charity is being selfish. Most sane people do things because it satisfies something in them. The one who is very generous is getting something out of it. Even when dealing with selfish people, it's good to identify what they are getting out of it.

jshevek 7y ago
This is an obvious and trivial observation which misses the point of my statement. In my experience, the vast majority of NVC practitioners use NVC as a weapon to manipulate others by righteously invoking "universal needs" while avoiding introspection into their character flaws. Edit: I acknowledge that my "anectdata" leaves out people who practice NVC without giving any overt indication of it. As with vegans, there is probably a selection bias for other personality characteristics. (The best vegans are not as obviously vegan)
- BeetleB 7y ago
  Generally, people using the NVC template that you recognize are "beginners". So your edit is probably very relevant. As I said in another comment: Actually observe those who communicate very well in stressful situations (very well = both parties not upset after the fact, with some resolution on the issue at hand), and you'll find their approach is fairly similar to NVC - they're just not using the templates your recognize.
fenwick67 7y ago
https://www.thefreedictionary.com/selfish https://www.thefreedictionary.com/selfish "Concerned chiefly or excessively with oneself, and having little regard for others" (the second part being an important piece of the definition you have forgotten)

Ididntdothis 7y ago

I think for all these methods to work there is the prerequisite that the user has some level of internal balance already or at least is willing to develop it. Otherwise something like NVC is just a way of papering over one’s own flaws. I had such a phase too a long time ago when I learned some communication skills. I enthusiastically applied my new methods and was constantly pissed off at other people because they didn’t reciprocate immediately. It took me a while to realize that I first had to clean up my own act before there could be a real improvement.

jshevek 7y ago
Thank you for your response. Would you agree that introspection and character development are important parts of a healthy NVC process? That an individual's application of NVC suffers without it?
- pmichaud 7y ago
  I think it's probably more than just that. I think when applied ideally, NVC is just a method of character development. I think the point of the format is to create internal clarity about what is happening inside you (your beliefs and values) and in your interactions with other people. I think that sentence is about NVC, but is also just a general description of character building (at least a substantial part of it). So yeah, people who now have a new format to say sentences in, but who make no changes internally are doing NVC wrong :)
- Ididntdothis 7y ago
  “Would you agree that introspection and character development are important parts of a healthy NVC process? That an individual's application of NVC suffers without it?“ That’s my firm belief. It’s pretty much the same with all methods. If you just use technique without deeper understanding the result will always be shallow. We see the same with Agile. A lot of companies are practicing the methods but don’t really understand or follow the underlining reasoning.
- wintermutestwin 7y ago
  Here are a list of soft skills that should be practiced to strengthen your ability to resolve conflict: Empathy, Non-judgement, Active Listening, Calm presence, Interrupting gently, Reframing, Asking effective questions.