5 ms·

Maybe you're right, however in Italy when they announced the shutting down of regions in the north, people fled to the south and immigrants started flying home,

Maybe you're right, however in Italy when they announced the shutting down of regions in the north, people fled to the south and immigrants started flying home, which helped spread the virus in all of Italy and throughout Europe. It is now generally believed that a better strategy would have been for all of Italy to be shut down at once [1] Also Bill Gates might be wrong on this one, but I wouldn't call his opinions in this field ignorant. Given his track record and the work that his foundation is doing, I'm pretty sure he has expert counseling and his advice on the matter is anything but. [1] https://hbr.org/2020/03/lessons-from-italys-response-to-coronavirus https://hbr.org/2020/03/lessons-from-italys-response-to-coro...

mantas 7y ago
Shutting down Italy wouldn't have prevented migrants, tourists and people on business trips from going back home. Shutting down whole US would be more similar to shutting down whole EU because of Italy. Even today "shut down" in EU differs a lot from country to country.
- bad_user 7y ago
  That EU's measures differ from country to country is regrettable. It means that countries like Germany, which are doing extensive testing (500,000 tests per week), have hospitals in good shape and overall a good administration, will get out of this crisis before other countries and will keep their borders closed for longer than necessary, this delaying everyone's economic recovery. These days solidarity, cooperation and coordination are of the utmost importance. Note that I am an EU citizen and I hope we'll all be alright.
  - 411111111111111 7y ago
    germany is doing extensive testing? last i heard we couldn't get a test without either paying for it yourself or proving that you've had direct contact with a confirmed corona patient... did they change that?
    - bad_user 7y ago
      I don't live in Germany, but they started doing 160,000 per week and now they've ramped up to 500,000 tests per week. That's extensive testing. Not sure about your situation, but from official numbers at least, they are doing more tests than everyone else in Europe.
      - 411111111111111 7y ago
        i just checked, it really looks like they changed it...you can now get tested if a doctor deems it necessary, which he is allowed to if you're showing corvid-19 relevant symptoms. good to know, and thanks for pointing it out!
  - mantas 7y ago
    As a citizen of EU member, I don't agree at all. It's good that each member can fine-tune details to their specific situation. Italy/Spain/France are fucked and they do need super strict measures. Meanwhile in my country we have relatively few cases. Most of them are imported and good chunk of local cases are medicine personnel. Right now we're far from full lock-down as seen in most unfortunate places. Many businesses that don't have customers on premises are operating more or less as usual. Sports outside are still allowed. Right now amount of daily cases is not growing. Significant part of them are people coming home from more affected countries. Medical system is far from overrun. Given that the country is relatively sparse and social norms are rather distant, we're looking forward to having fewer and fewer new cases. If all goes well, some restrictions will be lightened up in mid-April. E.g. outdoors cafes may be allowed to open up given that distance between visitors will be enforced. Next, non-essential shops may be allowed to open up for visitors with masks etc. It will probably take a long time to allow mass events though. But that's relatively small part of economy. Why should we stay in lockdown if all is good locally, but Italy, Spain or Sweden still have ongoing crisis? We'll obviously keep our borders closed till our neighbours clean up their acts. Solidarity is having life going on as much as safely possible and making stuff for affected allies. Not staying in lockdown side-by-side.
    - bad_user 7y ago
      Because everyone else is only 20 days or so behind Italy. As WHO experts say from their experience with Ebola and others, it's better to act early. I see a lot of disbelief on this site too, it appears that exponential growth can fool even us. Only 2 weeks ago I noticed people here saying that Trump must be doing something right in the US because the country hasn't gone to hell. I replied with "give it another week or two". And now the situation in New York is dire and everyone else is following, with the US poised to be the next epicenter. What country are you from btw? Are you sure the population is properly tested? Given the lack of tests or expertise on the market I kind of doubt it. This virus is dangerous because 75% or more of the infected population is close to asymptomatic, yet highly contagious. You might be having a lot more cases among you than you realize.
      - 7y ago

mantas 7y ago

Shutting down Italy wouldn't have prevented migrants, tourists and people on business trips from going back home. Shutting down whole US would be more similar to shutting down whole EU because of Italy. Even today "shut down" in EU differs a lot from country to country.

bad_user 7y ago
That EU's measures differ from country to country is regrettable. It means that countries like Germany, which are doing extensive testing (500,000 tests per week), have hospitals in good shape and overall a good administration, will get out of this crisis before other countries and will keep their borders closed for longer than necessary, this delaying everyone's economic recovery. These days solidarity, cooperation and coordination are of the utmost importance. Note that I am an EU citizen and I hope we'll all be alright.
- 411111111111111 7y ago
  germany is doing extensive testing? last i heard we couldn't get a test without either paying for it yourself or proving that you've had direct contact with a confirmed corona patient... did they change that?
  - bad_user 7y ago
    I don't live in Germany, but they started doing 160,000 per week and now they've ramped up to 500,000 tests per week. That's extensive testing. Not sure about your situation, but from official numbers at least, they are doing more tests than everyone else in Europe.
    - 411111111111111 7y ago
      i just checked, it really looks like they changed it...you can now get tested if a doctor deems it necessary, which he is allowed to if you're showing corvid-19 relevant symptoms. good to know, and thanks for pointing it out!
- mantas 7y ago
  As a citizen of EU member, I don't agree at all. It's good that each member can fine-tune details to their specific situation. Italy/Spain/France are fucked and they do need super strict measures. Meanwhile in my country we have relatively few cases. Most of them are imported and good chunk of local cases are medicine personnel. Right now we're far from full lock-down as seen in most unfortunate places. Many businesses that don't have customers on premises are operating more or less as usual. Sports outside are still allowed. Right now amount of daily cases is not growing. Significant part of them are people coming home from more affected countries. Medical system is far from overrun. Given that the country is relatively sparse and social norms are rather distant, we're looking forward to having fewer and fewer new cases. If all goes well, some restrictions will be lightened up in mid-April. E.g. outdoors cafes may be allowed to open up given that distance between visitors will be enforced. Next, non-essential shops may be allowed to open up for visitors with masks etc. It will probably take a long time to allow mass events though. But that's relatively small part of economy. Why should we stay in lockdown if all is good locally, but Italy, Spain or Sweden still have ongoing crisis? We'll obviously keep our borders closed till our neighbours clean up their acts. Solidarity is having life going on as much as safely possible and making stuff for affected allies. Not staying in lockdown side-by-side.
  - bad_user 7y ago
    Because everyone else is only 20 days or so behind Italy. As WHO experts say from their experience with Ebola and others, it's better to act early. I see a lot of disbelief on this site too, it appears that exponential growth can fool even us. Only 2 weeks ago I noticed people here saying that Trump must be doing something right in the US because the country hasn't gone to hell. I replied with "give it another week or two". And now the situation in New York is dire and everyone else is following, with the US poised to be the next epicenter. What country are you from btw? Are you sure the population is properly tested? Given the lack of tests or expertise on the market I kind of doubt it. This virus is dangerous because 75% or more of the infected population is close to asymptomatic, yet highly contagious. You might be having a lot more cases among you than you realize.
    - 7y ago