6 ms·

What's wrong with the subscription model? Vendors get recurring money and aren't incentivized to make sweeping changes to have major releases to get more money

What's wrong with the subscription model? Vendors get recurring money and aren't incentivized to make sweeping changes to have major releases to get more money for the same product; consumers can manage cash flow by only paying while they need it, there is a lower barrier to purchase, and vendors have more predictable income.

mcgrath_sh 7y ago
The mental overhead of renting every piece of software I own would be exhausting, not to mention consistently expensive. Subscriptions come out of a different part of the my budget than purchases do, and it is an ongoing expense I have to factor is versus coming out of my funds once every few years, if I can afford it at that time. There are several pieces of software I would have gladly bought at 2-3 times their annual subscription rate, but instead simply moved on from. I get it. Software developers need to be paid, but I’m not renting every tool I want to use. I also understand I’m in the minority because I understand why there is a new version every few years and would gladly purchase those. Simply put, the overhead and uncertainty of a subscription model devalues the vast majority of software for me to make me find alternatives.
- eskaytwo 7y ago
  And it’s much easier to expense a one off purchase on tax than adding up all the recurring subscriptions. But yes, the cognitive load is a big one for me too.
  - TeMPOraL 7y ago
    Same for me. I describe it in terms of relationship. Each subscription is another relationship with a third party that I otherwise don't care about, that I don't want to be in any ongoing relationship with. I just want to a) pay for the software, and b) use it to do the things I need done. Just like if I were buying a hammer.
    - mcgrath_sh 7y ago
      A power drill is my favorite analogy. If I drilled holes once every 18 months, I’d gladly rent from Home Depot. If I found myself doing a weekend project every month, I want to own a drill. That drill comes with the expectation that it has an 18-24 month warranty (support cycle) and if my power outlet (OS) doesn’t change after that, I expect the current drill (current version) to keep working, essentially, until the hardware dies. However, I do not expect Milwaukee to add a light or whatever new feature to the drill, or change the plug if my outlet changes. After that 18-24 month period, I expect that new features, breakage, etc will mean I buy a new drill. I know it is an imperfect metaphor, but it helps get my point across that valuing ownership doesn’t make someone cheap. It makes them unwilling to lease software.
- Wowfunhappy 7y ago
  I don't think you're in the minority.
pabs3 7y ago
How do you "subscribe" to open source software?
- mwcampbell 7y ago
  It's time for us to give up on the dream of having good software for free. That's what this whole thread is about. It's a wake-up call for us all. We have to pay for what we value.
  - deleted 7y ago
    [deleted]
- jtbayly 7y ago
  How do you “buy” open source software?
- chrisseaton 7y ago
  How were you paying for open source software before? Were you paying for something like a Linux distribution? You can often do that on a subscription as well if you want to.
jtbayly 7y ago
There are definitely some benefits to subscriptions, but returning to the GP, it’s sort of like renting your nail gun. And your compressor. And your tool belt. And your screw driver. At some point it makes sense to own it and stop renting. Renting is very expensive.
indymike 7y ago
Nothing, at all. There is a downside: every invoice, every payment is a checkpoint where the customer can cancel.
taneq 7y ago
As a consumer of software there are three MAJOR problems with the subscription model: 1) If it's for a piece of software I use on an ongoing basis the cost often rapidly eclipses what I'd have paid for standalone software, and it never stops rising. 2) There's usually some awkwardly contrived cloud tie-in, purely to enforce subscriptions, which breaks the software if your internet connection or the supplier's servers are down. This adds a completely unnecessary external dependency. 3) You're entirely at the vendor's mercy if they decide to change the software. At the very least, you're subjected to constant small breakages of your workflow, and at worst they change some major feature that you depend on and put you out of business for days or weeks until you find a workaround. Edit: Also 4) The aforementioned awkward cloud tie-in often brings with it some gnarly privacy issues, with your sensitive files and private data being leeched off to the vendor's servers FoR YoUR ConVeNIeNcE.
- mgkimsal 7y ago
  I've found JetBrains and .. tele.. ? (screenflow) to both be decent compromises. Well... I guess screenflow isn't a rental - I upgraded through version 6 - I may upgrade to 9 now, as there's enough 'new' stuff (and I have a newer laptop) to make it worthwhile. I appreciated it not being a subscription, precisely because nothing changed for me - I kept using the same software for a few years, knowing I was missing out on some bug fixes (but also knowing I could upgrade to get them reasonably cheap - it was a choice on my part). The JetBrains model is good because I'm able to keep using a version without paying for upgrades (but I have kept up anyway as the annual fee is so cheap for what I get). The points you've made are why I don't typically get software that is truly 'rental only' or hits your other points. That said, I've not run in to too many in the past few years that are affected by those issues any more. Are there some in particular you're thinking of that have those problems?
  - danieldk 7y ago
    Do JetBrains products still work if the company would go out of business or decided to undo the perpetual license? (I haven't upgraded my license since they switched to the subscription model.) [1] [1] It would probably be difficult contractually, but such things happen. See e.g. TextDrive hosting lifetime accounts.
Spooky23 7y ago
In the enterprise space, subscription is just higher cost maintenance with the additional risk of losing the functionality to some high stakes bullshit at renewal time or spending lots of time on some rat race to upgrade.
- adambyrtek 7y ago
  Enterprises love subscriptions for the same reasons why they prefer leases over capital expenditure. They look much better on the balance sheet and allow to spread the cost over time.
  - Spooky23 7y ago
    Oh sure, enterprise CFOs love them. They love money too, and software companies who aren't Microsoft, Oracle, etc should be wary. Your entire company could be rendered irrelevant by a minor modification to a subscription offering that is critical. Why should I absorb a $7 user/month subscription for 100,000 people ($8.4M) forever when I can spend $500k upfront and 20% of that ongoing to hire someone to build a functional solution using O365, GSuite or Oracle whatever? Look at Microsoft's behavior with O365. Many companies will be fully locked into Microsoft across voice, security and identity verticals based on tweaks to the O365/M365 licensing models. You need Azure AD to meet your email compliance requirements, but that's bundled with Intune, which in turn has a co-bundle with Defender ATP, etc.
danieldk 7y ago
I think subscriptions will be terrible for vendors in the end as well. First, because they have to compete with the likes of Office 365, which offers an Office Suite, 1TB cloud storage, and 60 Skype minutes (at least the used to) for little over 5 Euro per month. Subscriptions for more basic programs will look overpriced in comparison. Second, as subscriptions become the new normal, we will see services like Apple Arcade. I think Apple Arcade will eventually eat up a lot of revenue as casual gamers will move from purchasing games to the 'all you can eat' Arcade. If Apple Arcade turns out to be successful, what holds them from launching 'App Arcade' [1]? Vendors that don't get into the App Arcade will lose a lot of revenue, vendors that do get into App Arcade will have a steady source of income, but will also be completely at the mercy of Apple (or Microsoft). [1] I know there is SetApp, but anything that Apple launches has a lot more visibility. They also have more clout to get high profile applications in such a service.

mcgrath_sh 7y ago

The mental overhead of renting every piece of software I own would be exhausting, not to mention consistently expensive. Subscriptions come out of a different part of the my budget than purchases do, and it is an ongoing expense I have to factor is versus coming out of my funds once every few years, if I can afford it at that time. There are several pieces of software I would have gladly bought at 2-3 times their annual subscription rate, but instead simply moved on from. I get it. Software developers need to be paid, but I’m not renting every tool I want to use. I also understand I’m in the minority because I understand why there is a new version every few years and would gladly purchase those. Simply put, the overhead and uncertainty of a subscription model devalues the vast majority of software for me to make me find alternatives.

eskaytwo 7y ago
And it’s much easier to expense a one off purchase on tax than adding up all the recurring subscriptions. But yes, the cognitive load is a big one for me too.
- TeMPOraL 7y ago
  Same for me. I describe it in terms of relationship. Each subscription is another relationship with a third party that I otherwise don't care about, that I don't want to be in any ongoing relationship with. I just want to a) pay for the software, and b) use it to do the things I need done. Just like if I were buying a hammer.
  - mcgrath_sh 7y ago
    A power drill is my favorite analogy. If I drilled holes once every 18 months, I’d gladly rent from Home Depot. If I found myself doing a weekend project every month, I want to own a drill. That drill comes with the expectation that it has an 18-24 month warranty (support cycle) and if my power outlet (OS) doesn’t change after that, I expect the current drill (current version) to keep working, essentially, until the hardware dies. However, I do not expect Milwaukee to add a light or whatever new feature to the drill, or change the plug if my outlet changes. After that 18-24 month period, I expect that new features, breakage, etc will mean I buy a new drill. I know it is an imperfect metaphor, but it helps get my point across that valuing ownership doesn’t make someone cheap. It makes them unwilling to lease software.
Wowfunhappy 7y ago
I don't think you're in the minority.

pabs3 7y ago

How do you "subscribe" to open source software?

mwcampbell 7y ago
It's time for us to give up on the dream of having good software for free. That's what this whole thread is about. It's a wake-up call for us all. We have to pay for what we value.
- deleted 7y ago
  [deleted]
jtbayly 7y ago
How do you “buy” open source software?
chrisseaton 7y ago
How were you paying for open source software before? Were you paying for something like a Linux distribution? You can often do that on a subscription as well if you want to.

jtbayly 7y ago

There are definitely some benefits to subscriptions, but returning to the GP, it’s sort of like renting your nail gun. And your compressor. And your tool belt. And your screw driver. At some point it makes sense to own it and stop renting. Renting is very expensive.

indymike 7y ago

Nothing, at all. There is a downside: every invoice, every payment is a checkpoint where the customer can cancel.

taneq 7y ago

As a consumer of software there are three MAJOR problems with the subscription model: 1) If it's for a piece of software I use on an ongoing basis the cost often rapidly eclipses what I'd have paid for standalone software, and it never stops rising. 2) There's usually some awkwardly contrived cloud tie-in, purely to enforce subscriptions, which breaks the software if your internet connection or the supplier's servers are down. This adds a completely unnecessary external dependency. 3) You're entirely at the vendor's mercy if they decide to change the software. At the very least, you're subjected to constant small breakages of your workflow, and at worst they change some major feature that you depend on and put you out of business for days or weeks until you find a workaround. Edit: Also 4) The aforementioned awkward cloud tie-in often brings with it some gnarly privacy issues, with your sensitive files and private data being leeched off to the vendor's servers FoR YoUR ConVeNIeNcE.

mgkimsal 7y ago
I've found JetBrains and .. tele.. ? (screenflow) to both be decent compromises. Well... I guess screenflow isn't a rental - I upgraded through version 6 - I may upgrade to 9 now, as there's enough 'new' stuff (and I have a newer laptop) to make it worthwhile. I appreciated it not being a subscription, precisely because nothing changed for me - I kept using the same software for a few years, knowing I was missing out on some bug fixes (but also knowing I could upgrade to get them reasonably cheap - it was a choice on my part). The JetBrains model is good because I'm able to keep using a version without paying for upgrades (but I have kept up anyway as the annual fee is so cheap for what I get). The points you've made are why I don't typically get software that is truly 'rental only' or hits your other points. That said, I've not run in to too many in the past few years that are affected by those issues any more. Are there some in particular you're thinking of that have those problems?
- danieldk 7y ago
  Do JetBrains products still work if the company would go out of business or decided to undo the perpetual license? (I haven't upgraded my license since they switched to the subscription model.) [1] [1] It would probably be difficult contractually, but such things happen. See e.g. TextDrive hosting lifetime accounts.

Spooky23 7y ago

In the enterprise space, subscription is just higher cost maintenance with the additional risk of losing the functionality to some high stakes bullshit at renewal time or spending lots of time on some rat race to upgrade.

adambyrtek 7y ago
Enterprises love subscriptions for the same reasons why they prefer leases over capital expenditure. They look much better on the balance sheet and allow to spread the cost over time.
- Spooky23 7y ago
  Oh sure, enterprise CFOs love them. They love money too, and software companies who aren't Microsoft, Oracle, etc should be wary. Your entire company could be rendered irrelevant by a minor modification to a subscription offering that is critical. Why should I absorb a $7 user/month subscription for 100,000 people ($8.4M) forever when I can spend $500k upfront and 20% of that ongoing to hire someone to build a functional solution using O365, GSuite or Oracle whatever? Look at Microsoft's behavior with O365. Many companies will be fully locked into Microsoft across voice, security and identity verticals based on tweaks to the O365/M365 licensing models. You need Azure AD to meet your email compliance requirements, but that's bundled with Intune, which in turn has a co-bundle with Defender ATP, etc.

danieldk 7y ago

I think subscriptions will be terrible for vendors in the end as well. First, because they have to compete with the likes of Office 365, which offers an Office Suite, 1TB cloud storage, and 60 Skype minutes (at least the used to) for little over 5 Euro per month. Subscriptions for more basic programs will look overpriced in comparison. Second, as subscriptions become the new normal, we will see services like Apple Arcade. I think Apple Arcade will eventually eat up a lot of revenue as casual gamers will move from purchasing games to the 'all you can eat' Arcade. If Apple Arcade turns out to be successful, what holds them from launching 'App Arcade' [1]? Vendors that don't get into the App Arcade will lose a lot of revenue, vendors that do get into App Arcade will have a steady source of income, but will also be completely at the mercy of Apple (or Microsoft). [1] I know there is SetApp, but anything that Apple launches has a lot more visibility. They also have more clout to get high profile applications in such a service.