5 ms·
Interestingly as I understand it part of the point is that by stealing the original you are able to create both better counterfeits and a market for them. Thin
by devindotcom 7y ago
Interestingly as I understand it part of the point is that by stealing the original you are able to create both better counterfeits and a market for them.
Think about it — obviously no one will buy a counterfeit "Starry Night" or whatever if it's hanging in a museum. But if it's stolen, all of a sudden there's the possibility that they can buy the original.
Not only that, but the counterfeit, created with extensive access to the original, is likely to be almost indistinguishable from it except by experts.
So the thieves steal the original, make a few copies, sell those for millions saying each is the original, then return the original to the museum. The best part is, the people who bought the counterfeits can't exactly go to the police. It's the perfect crime!
Sound crazy? This is what is speculated to have happened to the Mona Lisa some time ago.
The "Tony Soprano types" are probably more common - and perhaps less savvy - than you might expect. The type of person who thinks one can buy a hot van Gogh for a few million bucks is a pretty ripe target for counterfeiters.
- jagger27 7y agoCouldn’t museums and other art holders create their own authenticated market of accurate clones by giving copiers access?
- ISL 7y agoThe ethics of such a practice would be dubious at best.
- enriquto 7y agoWhy? This is just like selling high-quality prints of the paintings, which is already done and nobody complains about.
- jagger27 7y agoI don’t see why if they’re clearly indicated as clones.
- penagwin 7y agoIf the original is now public domain and the replica is not advertised as the original, I'm not sure what the ethical issue is? I do see a financial issue though, cheap clones are CHEAP - and if you want something that can nearly pass as authentic (which I'd argue is a work of art on it's own) you'd be looking at a very narrow market of buyers. Again, as long as replicas/clones are labeled as such and the original is in the public domain.
- yiyus 7y agoPerfect reproductions are a goal both for museums and researchers. See, for example: https://www.researchgate.net/publication/337848225_Gloss_Color_and_Topography_Scanning_for_Reproducing_a_Painting's_Appearance_Using_3D_Printing https://www.researchgate.net/publication/337848225_Gloss_Col...
- kube-system 7y agoNobody wants to pay a million bucks for an authenticated accurate clone. The entire idea of the fraud described above is that people think they're buying the original. Prints already exist, but nobody is paying big bucks for one.
- rwmj 7y agoWell people pay large sums for prints of the Great Wave, of which many thousands were made and are still being made. (Of course the trick is to know which prints are the earliest ones)
- bravoetch 7y agoThe trick is convincing people that earlier prints should be somehow worth more.
- rwmj 7y agoI think there's a genuine reason for them to be worth more since they are closer to the original painting. There's a fantastic (and long) series on Youtube about this: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jAhiMCSvtCc https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jAhiMCSvtCc
- gnopgnip 7y agoSome museums do sell prints of public domain art, or licensed reproductions including oil painting reproductions. https://shop.famsf.org/collections/monet-the-late-years-art-on-demand https://shop.famsf.org/collections/monet-the-late-years-art-... Not quite the same thing as an accurate clone
- Someone 7y agoYou can get 3D printed reproductions, too: - https://gizmodo.com/heres-how-to-get-your-own-picasso-for-under-200-1568706709 https://gizmodo.com/heres-how-to-get-your-own-picasso-for-un... - https://www.digitalmeetsculture.net/article/van-gogh-museum-the-relievo-collection/ https://www.digitalmeetsculture.net/article/van-gogh-museum-... (probably a bit higher in quality and price, but I can’t find a link for it) - https://www.vangoghmuseum.nl/en/business/van-gogh-museum-edition-collection https://www.vangoghmuseum.nl/en/business/van-gogh-museum-edi... (probably even better, but likely also very pricey)
- Talanes 7y agoInteresting that Starry Night is a bestseller for the start-up, but not available from the Van Gogh Museum in either collection.
- stevehawk 7y agoThe irony in that comment is that one of the Soprano actors is actually an artist (painter) and big art buff and scored big on finding a painting at a dealer that "didn't know what he had".. https://news.artnet.com/art-world/sopranos-actor-discovers-10-million-guercino-117651 https://news.artnet.com/art-world/sopranos-actor-discovers-1...
- lonelappde 7y agoThis is the plot of _From the Mixed Up Files of Ms Basil E Frankweiler_
- Igelau 7y agoAll I remember from that book was that the kids botched seperating their laundry. It was a real snoozer, but it planted a persistent seed of doubt whenever I have to do laundry.
- devindotcom 7y agoThat's funny. I know it shouldn't be, but it is always surprising when actors turn out to be very unlike those they portray. Infamous villains played by famously kind people, violent goons played by erudite and talented members of the arts community, etc.
- asdff 7y agoI don't know, being a baroque Italian art collector sounds just like Furio to me!
- will_pseudonym 7y ago(the actor that played Furio Giunta)
- elorant 7y agoIt's not that easy to sell counterfeit artwork. Anyone who's paying millions for an artwork will have the painting examined by a specialized consultant. The easiest way to spot a fake is to examine the pigments and whether a particular one was available by the time the artist lived. This is how the Rosales scandal was exposed in 2013.
- travisoneill1 7y agoWhere are you going to find a specialized consultant expert enough to judge if its fake who also doesn't know that the painting he is looking at was recently stolen from a museum?
- csomar 7y agoThese are oil paintings. I don't have much expertise in that but I think it'll be impossible to counterfeit the smallest details.
- jbc1 7y agoWhy do they need to not know that it was recently stolen from a museum?
- Zenbit_UX 7y agoTheir ignorance is not required, they certainly should be aware it was stolen if they're any good at their job. All you need is someone who's willing to accept cash.
- 7y ago
- detritus 7y agoThank you for posting this - I'd had pretty much the exact thought about creating a market for multiple copies earlier today when I first saw this story, and presumed (in my typically arrogant and self-regarding human fashion) that I'd had a somewhat novel thought. Of course I hadn't! :)