5 ms·

Don’t get me wrong, I’ve been a big proponent for highly accessible, rapid testing from the get-go. But, I don’t know what the benefit of a 15 minute test is.

by 40four 7y ago

Don’t get me wrong, I’ve been a big proponent for highly accessible, rapid testing from the get-go. But, I don’t know what the benefit of a 15 minute test is. Can anyone tell me why this is any better than the already demonstrated, very accurate, testing methods already in place? Is it just a company IP type of thing? What does it matter that we can get a result before we leave the test site, versus a few hours after we go home, eat some lunch, and do a little work? Maybe I’m overthinking it. Great. Please, Abbot, manufacture these things as fast as freaking possible. Distribute them across the whole country in huge volume. But I can’t help feel like this article (on Abbot’s own website no less) is just a bunch of sales/ marketing BS. Honestly, it mostly just pisses me off that an American company as big & powerful as Abbot, didn’t have these things ready to go from the get go. There should have been thousands of these available to every Governor in the country at least a month ago. Maybe then, our leaders (in the USA) would have had the capacity to craft smarter policies. Instead almost every governor in the country just threw blind, blanket lockdowns over entire states. Never mind that rural areas were not experiencing the same rates of infection, or pressure on health care systems, as densely populated cities. They probably just didn’t have data pints they needed to decide. So they treated everyone the same. Much to the detriment of smaller, rural regions.

drewmol 7y ago
Consider how effective instant read temperature tests (thermometers) are in post lock down mitigation efforts right now. Abbot is doing something at least. This article is indeed marketing material though. It makes me wonder how quickly this form of testing could be deployed across populations if IP was not enforced. Edit: I agree with your other points, although currently I feel lucky to have a pretty good governor.
1998v2 7y ago
A 15 minute test could be more easily done before boarding a flight for example. I'm not sure if it is really necessary either but mentally I'm at the point where I think we should just fire all available bullets at this thing, as they become available.
- bamboozled 7y ago
  If you had a plane with 200 passengers and two machines at the gate, this would take an additional 25 minutes to board the flight to test everyone, assuming there is no prep, which I’m sure there is. So realistically probably an hour. It seems like a great idea in theory, but in practice? I’m not so sure. Considering you can have the disease and present no symptoms but be contagious, you’d have to test everyone. I guess it is better than nothing in some cases.
  - supportlocal4h 7y ago
    Are you joking? This test could be done in less than the time it took me to take off my belt, my shoes, half my clothes, then empty my pockets, then pose for the body scanner, then get the wand, then the pat down, then recover my belongings and re-dress. That was my last experience at the airport. You're complaining that a 15 minute covid test is just too much?
    - bamboozled 7y ago
      To start with, calm down! I am not complaining. I'm speculating on the usefulness of thi s given that there is already a fair bit of overhead with boarding a plane in 2020 as opposed to say getting on a train. There are a LOT of flights that happen each day, If you add up all the time combined, this would actually add a bit of overhead to an already rather long airport check-in process. Not to mention the obvious which is that, if flights are still running at full pace, well you still have a lot of potentially infected people gathering in a rather confined area (airport), which is not really a good idea anyway. This is obviously useful for something like triaging at a hospital, will wee see it at a check-in gate or at a bus stop? I doubt it. Also that's clearly a lie it will take less time than for you to take off your belt, it clearly says it takes up to 15 minutes for a result. Don't talk nonsense.
      - brokenkebab 7y ago
        Just two words: cost and benefit can help you to understand the value behind quicker tests. Flights are getting cancelled already, and some countries closed their airports at all. There are places where you can get stuck at a border crossing, or a roadblock if you have no proof of a recent medical checks. On this background any tests which add 15 min, or even 1 hr overhead sounds more like a solution, not a problem.
nkrumm 7y ago
This sort of rapid test (say, results in under 4 hours from collection) is useful in a few different acute situations: - Patients needing emergent surgery while also presenting with symptoms concerning for COVID-19. - Critical healthcare workers (physicians, nurses needing rule out and rapid return to work) - Patients presenting who may have contributed to exposure of other high risk individuals (to speed up time of tracing) Your other points are valid.
- 40four 7y ago
  Ok, good thinking. Those are all pretty good use cases for a 15 minute test, assuming they can actually achieve that. Maybe I’m just too sour and frustrated with the whole situation in the USA, and had to vent a little bit, my fault :( This does actually sound like nice technology where they can pump out test results from this little appliance sized device on site. Other rapid (result in hours) I’ve read about still require sending specimens to a remote lab. Let’s just hope they can manufacture them like crazy, and quickly get them to the health workers that need them most.
jdminhbg 7y ago
> But, I don’t know what the benefit of a 15 minute test is. At the risk of sounding snarky... Really? You can't think of any way in which a 5-15 min result is more valuable than a multi-hour/day result? We have governors setting up roadblocks at state borders to turn away out-of-state license plates; a quick test seems like it might help there. Then think about what that means for international flights.
- deleted 7y ago
  [deleted]
- 40four 7y ago
  Well, maybe I’ve come around after sleeping on it :) Sometimes I can’t resist an angry rant right before bed. @mkrumm schooled me on multiple valid use cases and, I think, outlined how these things will actually be used. They seem to allow medical professionals to be able to make rapid, urgent decisions, about specific patients or cases. Most likely in emergency situations. I doubt they can be used assembly line style to process large volumes of tests, so I’m afraid things like testing a whole plane flight or a big group of people waiting at a roadblock are not very feasible.
supportlocal4h 7y ago
My elderly neighbor went to the ER complaining of shortness of breath and chest pain. They wouldn't do any heart tests until they got back the result of a covid test. They kept him for 5 days without treatment. After 5 days the test came back negative. A 15 minute test sounds good to me if it can be done on site and not shipped away for analysis.
- JshWright 7y ago
  That's not how things are typically done (in fact, I'd be very surprised if it actually took place as described by your neighbor). One of the ways to "rule out" COVID is to confirm it's something else. Someone with the symptoms you describe would, at the very least, get an EKG and some blood work to confirm it wasn't a heart attack.
- 40four 7y ago
  Poor guy, that doesn’t sound like a correct way to treat someone, but I am not a doctor. This is probably where this device will shine. On site, no remote lab, and allows healthcare workers to make rapid decisions for emergency situations.
loeg 7y ago
Honestly just extra capacity is valuable? Regardless of whether it's also faster.
dwarfcadaver 7y ago
Blanket lockdowns are designed to dissuade city people fleeing to the countryside. Rural areas need to be perceived as unappealing or at least having similar situations as urban/suburban areas.
fragmede 7y ago
Think at scale. Ignoring the very real human benefits because humans are impatient, a system where a single job run takes an order of magnitude less time to run has a much, much higher throughput overall, with much lower penalty when there are errors. And tired over-worked humans make mistakes. Given the extreme shortage we are under, I'd expect any of the room-sized Roche machines to be running 24/7 if there is no other bottleneck like reagents. The quicker the test, the more tests per hour or per day can be run.
erikstarck 7y ago
Here’s a scenario. Every morning and evening when you brush your teeth, you also do your covid-test. It’s that simple and that cheap. If everyone could do that we can live with this virus. We don’t have to run and hide from it in our homes. We can go back to a normal life, while waiting for a vaccine that can take years.
KaiserPro 7y ago
So in the UK in the some paediatric wards, there is a 15 min flu tester. This is useful because it forms part of triage. You come in, to ER/A&E, do the test along with the history. When you get seen by a doctor you have the results of the test and can plan accordingly. same goes here, as part of the history taking you can get a test to see if they have CV or something else.

by 40four 7y ago

drewmol 7y ago

Consider how effective instant read temperature tests (thermometers) are in post lock down mitigation efforts right now. Abbot is doing something at least. This article is indeed marketing material though. It makes me wonder how quickly this form of testing could be deployed across populations if IP was not enforced. Edit: I agree with your other points, although currently I feel lucky to have a pretty good governor.

1998v2 7y ago

A 15 minute test could be more easily done before boarding a flight for example. I'm not sure if it is really necessary either but mentally I'm at the point where I think we should just fire all available bullets at this thing, as they become available.

bamboozled 7y ago
If you had a plane with 200 passengers and two machines at the gate, this would take an additional 25 minutes to board the flight to test everyone, assuming there is no prep, which I’m sure there is. So realistically probably an hour. It seems like a great idea in theory, but in practice? I’m not so sure. Considering you can have the disease and present no symptoms but be contagious, you’d have to test everyone. I guess it is better than nothing in some cases.
- supportlocal4h 7y ago
  Are you joking? This test could be done in less than the time it took me to take off my belt, my shoes, half my clothes, then empty my pockets, then pose for the body scanner, then get the wand, then the pat down, then recover my belongings and re-dress. That was my last experience at the airport. You're complaining that a 15 minute covid test is just too much?
  - bamboozled 7y ago
    To start with, calm down! I am not complaining. I'm speculating on the usefulness of thi s given that there is already a fair bit of overhead with boarding a plane in 2020 as opposed to say getting on a train. There are a LOT of flights that happen each day, If you add up all the time combined, this would actually add a bit of overhead to an already rather long airport check-in process. Not to mention the obvious which is that, if flights are still running at full pace, well you still have a lot of potentially infected people gathering in a rather confined area (airport), which is not really a good idea anyway. This is obviously useful for something like triaging at a hospital, will wee see it at a check-in gate or at a bus stop? I doubt it. Also that's clearly a lie it will take less time than for you to take off your belt, it clearly says it takes up to 15 minutes for a result. Don't talk nonsense.
    - brokenkebab 7y ago
      Just two words: cost and benefit can help you to understand the value behind quicker tests. Flights are getting cancelled already, and some countries closed their airports at all. There are places where you can get stuck at a border crossing, or a roadblock if you have no proof of a recent medical checks. On this background any tests which add 15 min, or even 1 hr overhead sounds more like a solution, not a problem.

nkrumm 7y ago

This sort of rapid test (say, results in under 4 hours from collection) is useful in a few different acute situations: - Patients needing emergent surgery while also presenting with symptoms concerning for COVID-19. - Critical healthcare workers (physicians, nurses needing rule out and rapid return to work) - Patients presenting who may have contributed to exposure of other high risk individuals (to speed up time of tracing) Your other points are valid.

40four 7y ago
Ok, good thinking. Those are all pretty good use cases for a 15 minute test, assuming they can actually achieve that. Maybe I’m just too sour and frustrated with the whole situation in the USA, and had to vent a little bit, my fault :( This does actually sound like nice technology where they can pump out test results from this little appliance sized device on site. Other rapid (result in hours) I’ve read about still require sending specimens to a remote lab. Let’s just hope they can manufacture them like crazy, and quickly get them to the health workers that need them most.

jdminhbg 7y ago

> But, I don’t know what the benefit of a 15 minute test is. At the risk of sounding snarky... Really? You can't think of any way in which a 5-15 min result is more valuable than a multi-hour/day result? We have governors setting up roadblocks at state borders to turn away out-of-state license plates; a quick test seems like it might help there. Then think about what that means for international flights.

deleted 7y ago
[deleted]
40four 7y ago
Well, maybe I’ve come around after sleeping on it :) Sometimes I can’t resist an angry rant right before bed. @mkrumm schooled me on multiple valid use cases and, I think, outlined how these things will actually be used. They seem to allow medical professionals to be able to make rapid, urgent decisions, about specific patients or cases. Most likely in emergency situations. I doubt they can be used assembly line style to process large volumes of tests, so I’m afraid things like testing a whole plane flight or a big group of people waiting at a roadblock are not very feasible.

supportlocal4h 7y ago

My elderly neighbor went to the ER complaining of shortness of breath and chest pain. They wouldn't do any heart tests until they got back the result of a covid test. They kept him for 5 days without treatment. After 5 days the test came back negative. A 15 minute test sounds good to me if it can be done on site and not shipped away for analysis.

JshWright 7y ago
That's not how things are typically done (in fact, I'd be very surprised if it actually took place as described by your neighbor). One of the ways to "rule out" COVID is to confirm it's something else. Someone with the symptoms you describe would, at the very least, get an EKG and some blood work to confirm it wasn't a heart attack.
40four 7y ago
Poor guy, that doesn’t sound like a correct way to treat someone, but I am not a doctor. This is probably where this device will shine. On site, no remote lab, and allows healthcare workers to make rapid decisions for emergency situations.

loeg 7y ago

Honestly just extra capacity is valuable? Regardless of whether it's also faster.

dwarfcadaver 7y ago

Blanket lockdowns are designed to dissuade city people fleeing to the countryside. Rural areas need to be perceived as unappealing or at least having similar situations as urban/suburban areas.

fragmede 7y ago

Think at scale. Ignoring the very real human benefits because humans are impatient, a system where a single job run takes an order of magnitude less time to run has a much, much higher throughput overall, with much lower penalty when there are errors. And tired over-worked humans make mistakes. Given the extreme shortage we are under, I'd expect any of the room-sized Roche machines to be running 24/7 if there is no other bottleneck like reagents. The quicker the test, the more tests per hour or per day can be run.

erikstarck 7y ago

Here’s a scenario. Every morning and evening when you brush your teeth, you also do your covid-test. It’s that simple and that cheap. If everyone could do that we can live with this virus. We don’t have to run and hide from it in our homes. We can go back to a normal life, while waiting for a vaccine that can take years.

KaiserPro 7y ago

So in the UK in the some paediatric wards, there is a 15 min flu tester. This is useful because it forms part of triage. You come in, to ER/A&E, do the test along with the history. When you get seen by a doctor you have the results of the test and can plan accordingly. same goes here, as part of the history taking you can get a test to see if they have CV or something else.