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> I truly have no idea what will be left behind for me and my peers, when all of this is said and done. I'm in the same boat, as a new grad about to enter the

by vzidex 7y ago

> I truly have no idea what will be left behind for me and my peers, when all of this is said and done. I'm in the same boat, as a new grad about to enter the labour market with a computer engineering degree. While the situation may seem impossible, once this is all said and done we will still have each other - with everyone the wiser having witnessed the collapse of our current ridiculous system. We're two weeks into isolation and layoffs where I live, and I'm already seeing lots of graffiti and posters about rent strikes. One day the boomers will die, penniless because their wealth only exists in an overly-engineered financial system, and the young will be left to rebuild a more intelligent and caring society.

smolder 7y ago
I don't think it will be so straight forward as that. Power is handed down, and people who have power generally don't want to give it up.
- vzidex 7y ago
  This is a good point, but I've been getting the feeling that the working class is getting more and more fed up with our conditions as we're squeezed for every last dollar of surplus value. At the end of the day "the people in power" have power because the masses allow them to. If enough people refuse to participate in the system then the system will fall apart - e.g. the state only has the capacity to process so many evictions. This pandemic has been the greatest catalyst for class consciousness that I've seen in my life, and I think it has the potential to reshape our society after it's over.
  - dakna 7y ago
    I agree that this might catalyze awareness. But the people in power know they need the mass acceptance to stay in power. Which is why every new medium that reaches a big enough audience is infiltrated with agenda pushing content. It is absolutely critical to divide the masses to stay in power. It doesn't matter which side, as long as you have one side to identify with and another side to blame in this post-factum society. The percentage of people dropping out of the belief systems and trying to rationalize again is IMHO too small for large scale effects to not allow the people in power to continue. Its a handful of swing states that matter. That being said, I have more hope for smaller, local circles, because then the partisan lines get blurry due to a common local identity.
  - Ididntdothis 7y ago
    Remember this joke? ‘A banker, a worker, and an immigrant are sitting at a table with 20 cookies. ‘The banker takes 19 cookies and warns the worker: “Watch out, the immigrant is going to take your cookie away.”’ If the ruling class plays it right the working class will go after each other instead of the ruling class. And so far they seem to do really well.
    - vzidex 7y ago
      Hah! I've never actually heard that joke but it's a good one. And yes, that is definitely what they'll do - every time something major happens in our society I've observed the mass media following the playbook from Chomsky's "Manufacturing Consent" almost exactly. That being said, every "big event" is an opportunity for mass radicalization of the working class and these "big events" are happening more and more often. It's like the quote from the IRA: "We only have to be lucky once. You will have to be lucky always".
      - Ididntdothis 7y ago
        Electing Trump was already a response to these events but unfortunately people chose a billionaire who mainly cares about themselves. The Russian revolution and the nazis were also a response to events but in either case the people made bad choices....
mmcgaha 7y ago
Serious? Good luck with that because in 30 years the 25 year old know-it-alls will be saying the same thing about your generation. The cycle never ends.
Ididntdothis 7y ago
“the young will be left to rebuild a more intelligent and caring society.” Make sure they really do this. The boomers started out with “love and peace” before they turned to “greed is good”. I can easily imagine the next generation to create an even tougher society if they aren’t careful.
jki275 7y ago
Ah the misguided enthusiasm of youth. You'll grow up, don't worry. It will amaze you how much smarter your "boomer" parents get as you get older.
- vzidex 7y ago
  > Ah the misguided enthusiasm of youth. OK boomer. My dad has fond memories of the socialist regime he grew up under, and my mom has worked incredibly hard to provide for our family given the difficulties she's faced in life. Just because you ended up jaded and subscribed to the garbage system which we have to participate in doesn't mean my generation will too.
  - jki275 7y ago
    Not a "boomer". Misguided as usual. As you grow up, you will, as I said, realize how much smarter all those people you dismiss actually were than you believed. The world is a complex place. The "old people are dumb and we should throw out everything they built" mantra is a silly trivialization of reality, one that every generation believes fervently as children, and one that the intelligent ones reject when they find out what the world is really like. You haven't gotten there yet. Don't worry.
    - kaesar14 7y ago
      That doesn't mean that the system as it exists is good. The system as it exists isn't perfect. Maybe listening to those coming at it with a fresh perspective gleaned from youth would benefit society a bit.
      - jki275 7y ago
        Well of course not -- if you find the perfect society, don't join it, you might screw it up! Same goes for me of course, none of us are perfect!
- dang 7y ago
  This crosses into personal attack. Please don't do that, regardless of what someone else posted. I'm sure you meant it in an avuncular way, but that doesn't translate so well on the internet. https://news.ycombinator.com/newsguidelines.html https://news.ycombinator.com/newsguidelines.html
dang 7y ago
Please don't post flamebait to HN. Generational flamewar is particularly unwelcome here. You've done this repeatedly: https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=21725642 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=21725642 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=21597613 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=21597613 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=21594517 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=21594517 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=22705734 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=22705734 and we've warned you before: https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=21732554 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=21732554. Continuing will get you banned, so please don't. https://news.ycombinator.com/newsguidelines.html https://news.ycombinator.com/newsguidelines.html

by vzidex 7y ago

smolder 7y ago

I don't think it will be so straight forward as that. Power is handed down, and people who have power generally don't want to give it up.

vzidex 7y ago
This is a good point, but I've been getting the feeling that the working class is getting more and more fed up with our conditions as we're squeezed for every last dollar of surplus value. At the end of the day "the people in power" have power because the masses allow them to. If enough people refuse to participate in the system then the system will fall apart - e.g. the state only has the capacity to process so many evictions. This pandemic has been the greatest catalyst for class consciousness that I've seen in my life, and I think it has the potential to reshape our society after it's over.
- dakna 7y ago
  I agree that this might catalyze awareness. But the people in power know they need the mass acceptance to stay in power. Which is why every new medium that reaches a big enough audience is infiltrated with agenda pushing content. It is absolutely critical to divide the masses to stay in power. It doesn't matter which side, as long as you have one side to identify with and another side to blame in this post-factum society. The percentage of people dropping out of the belief systems and trying to rationalize again is IMHO too small for large scale effects to not allow the people in power to continue. Its a handful of swing states that matter. That being said, I have more hope for smaller, local circles, because then the partisan lines get blurry due to a common local identity.
- Ididntdothis 7y ago
  Remember this joke? ‘A banker, a worker, and an immigrant are sitting at a table with 20 cookies. ‘The banker takes 19 cookies and warns the worker: “Watch out, the immigrant is going to take your cookie away.”’ If the ruling class plays it right the working class will go after each other instead of the ruling class. And so far they seem to do really well.
  - vzidex 7y ago
    Hah! I've never actually heard that joke but it's a good one. And yes, that is definitely what they'll do - every time something major happens in our society I've observed the mass media following the playbook from Chomsky's "Manufacturing Consent" almost exactly. That being said, every "big event" is an opportunity for mass radicalization of the working class and these "big events" are happening more and more often. It's like the quote from the IRA: "We only have to be lucky once. You will have to be lucky always".
    - Ididntdothis 7y ago
      Electing Trump was already a response to these events but unfortunately people chose a billionaire who mainly cares about themselves. The Russian revolution and the nazis were also a response to events but in either case the people made bad choices....

mmcgaha 7y ago

Serious? Good luck with that because in 30 years the 25 year old know-it-alls will be saying the same thing about your generation. The cycle never ends.

Ididntdothis 7y ago

“the young will be left to rebuild a more intelligent and caring society.” Make sure they really do this. The boomers started out with “love and peace” before they turned to “greed is good”. I can easily imagine the next generation to create an even tougher society if they aren’t careful.

jki275 7y ago

Ah the misguided enthusiasm of youth. You'll grow up, don't worry. It will amaze you how much smarter your "boomer" parents get as you get older.

vzidex 7y ago
> Ah the misguided enthusiasm of youth. OK boomer. My dad has fond memories of the socialist regime he grew up under, and my mom has worked incredibly hard to provide for our family given the difficulties she's faced in life. Just because you ended up jaded and subscribed to the garbage system which we have to participate in doesn't mean my generation will too.
- jki275 7y ago
  Not a "boomer". Misguided as usual. As you grow up, you will, as I said, realize how much smarter all those people you dismiss actually were than you believed. The world is a complex place. The "old people are dumb and we should throw out everything they built" mantra is a silly trivialization of reality, one that every generation believes fervently as children, and one that the intelligent ones reject when they find out what the world is really like. You haven't gotten there yet. Don't worry.
  - kaesar14 7y ago
    That doesn't mean that the system as it exists is good. The system as it exists isn't perfect. Maybe listening to those coming at it with a fresh perspective gleaned from youth would benefit society a bit.
    - jki275 7y ago
      Well of course not -- if you find the perfect society, don't join it, you might screw it up! Same goes for me of course, none of us are perfect!
dang 7y ago
This crosses into personal attack. Please don't do that, regardless of what someone else posted. I'm sure you meant it in an avuncular way, but that doesn't translate so well on the internet. https://news.ycombinator.com/newsguidelines.html https://news.ycombinator.com/newsguidelines.html

dang 7y ago

Please don't post flamebait to HN. Generational flamewar is particularly unwelcome here. You've done this repeatedly: https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=21725642 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=21725642 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=21597613 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=21597613 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=21594517 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=21594517 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=22705734 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=22705734 and we've warned you before: https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=21732554 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=21732554. Continuing will get you banned, so please don't. https://news.ycombinator.com/newsguidelines.html https://news.ycombinator.com/newsguidelines.html