5 ms·

I turned down Microsoft when they recruited me in college. Wow, what a great decision. Now, I run a software firm where no one has an office, everyone pairs (i

I turned down Microsoft when they recruited me in college. Wow, what a great decision. Now, I run a software firm where no one has an office, everyone pairs (including owners and interns), we have a /slightly/ better ratio than 1 test per 100 SLOC, etc.

deleted 16y ago
[deleted]
adbge 16y ago
> we have a /slightly/ better ratio than 1 test per 100 SLOC, etc. Has TDD really resulted in this becoming a status symbol? :P
- listrophy 16y ago
  Wow, I got blasted on this comment. So, there was a reason why I didn't start spouting our exact LOT/LOC ratio: I have no idea what it is. No one at our office does. That's not the important part. My point is that, on average, one test per 100 LOC is almost definitely not covering much of the logic. I mean... if you have one happy-path test and one expected failing test per block of code, you have one testing context per 200 lines. Two hundred lines!
- nostrademons 16y ago
  Problem is that all status symbols in the programming world are meaningless, so in the absence of any useful metrics, we latch onto useless ones. Tests/LOC at least measures something, even if it is imperfect. It's probably better than measuring LOC themselves, which are often a long term cost for the company, not a benefit.
  - stuhacking 16y ago
    but, Tests/LLOC seems to state even less than LLOC. LLOC gives an indication of the complexity of the application (or a component). All Tests/LLOC seems to state is that some lines of code exist and potentially, some test cases are testing them.
    - nostrademons 16y ago
      It's also a measure of test granularity, i.e. for a module of given complexity, how many test cases cover it?
      - stuhacking 16y ago
        We can see what it measures. I'm just saying that it's a pretty nebulous metric when used out of context. Taking 2 numbers and condensing them into 1 (à la Megapixels) is an exercise in marketing.
    - paulcam 16y ago
      This is why code coverage numbers are a much better metric.
bmk2000 16y ago
I'm not understanding this comment. Which part of this post made you think that your decision was great? The fact that you started a software firm? the fact that no one has an office at your firm?
- kingsidharth 16y ago
  The fact that there is a culture; not cabins,
jpr 16y ago
Can't tell if trolling or not...

deleted 16y ago

[deleted]

adbge 16y ago

> we have a /slightly/ better ratio than 1 test per 100 SLOC, etc. Has TDD really resulted in this becoming a status symbol? :P

listrophy 16y ago
Wow, I got blasted on this comment. So, there was a reason why I didn't start spouting our exact LOT/LOC ratio: I have no idea what it is. No one at our office does. That's not the important part. My point is that, on average, one test per 100 LOC is almost definitely not covering much of the logic. I mean... if you have one happy-path test and one expected failing test per block of code, you have one testing context per 200 lines. Two hundred lines!
nostrademons 16y ago
Problem is that all status symbols in the programming world are meaningless, so in the absence of any useful metrics, we latch onto useless ones. Tests/LOC at least measures something, even if it is imperfect. It's probably better than measuring LOC themselves, which are often a long term cost for the company, not a benefit.
- stuhacking 16y ago
  but, Tests/LLOC seems to state even less than LLOC. LLOC gives an indication of the complexity of the application (or a component). All Tests/LLOC seems to state is that some lines of code exist and potentially, some test cases are testing them.
  - nostrademons 16y ago
    It's also a measure of test granularity, i.e. for a module of given complexity, how many test cases cover it?
    - stuhacking 16y ago
      We can see what it measures. I'm just saying that it's a pretty nebulous metric when used out of context. Taking 2 numbers and condensing them into 1 (à la Megapixels) is an exercise in marketing.
  - paulcam 16y ago
    This is why code coverage numbers are a much better metric.

bmk2000 16y ago

I'm not understanding this comment. Which part of this post made you think that your decision was great? The fact that you started a software firm? the fact that no one has an office at your firm?

kingsidharth 16y ago
The fact that there is a culture; not cabins,

jpr 16y ago

Can't tell if trolling or not...