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One thing I found quite striking was that they started allowing "optional WFH". Slack, which not only makes one of the main tools used to enable distributed wor

One thing I found quite striking was that they started allowing "optional WFH". Slack, which not only makes one of the main tools used to enable distributed work, but the most popular one, didn't allow remote work?? It'll be interesting to see what changes come as they start eating their own dog food.

ornornor 7y ago
That’s what surprised me as well.
Niksko 7y ago
I'm sure WFH is allowed. However in companies I've worked for, it's usually expected that you're in the office most of the time, and that if you want to WFH it's either ad-hoc (package being delivered, home repairs, doctors appointment) or it's some scheduled day (eg. our team works from home every Wednesday, or Sally works from home on Thursdays). The optional here is probably just allowing for individual freedom. My company also had 'optional' WFH, then 'recommended' WFH, followed by total office shutdown on Tuesday. I'm not sure you could attract top tier tech talent if you forbade working from home. It's a perk that I really enjoy because it's very convenient, and if I don't feel like going in to the office for whatever reason I don't have to. If I interviewed at a company that forbade working from home (or had very strict rules around it) I'd have to really think twice about whether I would work there. To me, it speaks to a culture of valuing employees based on whether they're merely seen to be working, rather than their actual work output.
keiferski 7y ago
"Sell shovels, don't dig for gold."
- deleted 7y ago
  [deleted]
iEchoic 7y ago
I'm also curious about this. As a data point: we're fully remote and are in a similar product space @ Guilded (http://www.guilded.gg http://www.guilded.gg). One of our best early decisions was to use our product exclusively for all of our work communication. For us, this degree of dogfooding - which is really only possible at a fully-remote company - has been directly responsible for too many features and improvements to count. There's no better way to develop empathy for your users and a deep care for your products than to have your entire team rely on them for their most critical communications every single day. Not all companies build products that facilitate remote collaboration, but I think that remote work presents some unique opportunities for those that do.
- ec109685 7y ago
  Most companies aren’t fully remote, so dogfooding the common use of Slack seems smart, where it is still a useful tool even if you are slacking someone 5 feet away.
  - iEchoic 7y ago
    Yeah, that's an interesting point as well. Our product is for gamers, who are usually "remote" (if you can call it that), but Slack may trend towards over-fitting to highly-engaged, fully remote work if they were to do this.
  - ascorbic 7y ago
    This is very true. I recently moved from a mostly on-site company, where I thought we used Slack a lot, to a globally-distributed, fully-remote one where Slack is the primary form of communication. We use it very differently, as the volume is far higher and we have to deal with timezones. e.g. in my previous job, I found threads annoying and rarely used them as I found they meant messages got lost. In my new one it's a faux pas to not use threads except for in very low-volume channels, because otherwise its tough for people to catch up on channels.
baddox 7y ago
I’ve never thought of Slack as a tool primarily for remote work. I suspect the vast majority of their customers are non-remote companies.
- whateveracct 7y ago
  Most remote companies use Slack or some other IM message. But remote companies tend to have cultures of async communication, so they don't suffer from the problems described as much.
t0mas88 7y ago
We did the same. We normally have "office days" on Monday and Friday, for team meetings etc. and the other days are for everyone to decide what works for them. Most have one or two fixed WFH days. Due to Covid-19 we changed it first to "optional WFH" (but with a hint that it may be a good idea) on all days, then "please WFH", and now "mandatory WFH, unless absolutely impossible"
erikbye 7y ago
> It'll be interesting to see what changes come as they start eating their own dog food. They use Teams, actually.
sneak 7y ago
I was more surprised to see a major CEO hanging out with friends in a restaurant after the pandemic was declared. I’d been in isolation half a week by that point, and was wondering what “the masses” were still doing going out. I’m astounded to see that smart people were still out socializing by then.
- SuoDuanDao 7y ago
  I think startup CEOs in general have a different risk tolerance from other smart people...
  - Jgrubb 7y ago
    I have to assume they also have access to health care that most of us (Americans) can't imagine.
  - RHSeeger 7y ago
    And, if the only people they were putting at risk by being out and about was themselves, that would be fine. But that's not the case.
    - deleted 7y ago
      [deleted]
OJFord 7y ago
From one of the tweets: > In some senses, we were made for this. Slack’s not specifically a “work from home” tool; it’s more of a “create organizational agility” tool. But an all-at-once transition to remote work creates a lot of demand for organizational agility.
tablethnuser 7y ago
Slack is surprisingly anti remote work. They only offer it to incredibly senior roles. Everyone else has to jump through hoops and get approvals from many layers of middle management - it's one of those ask Mom / ask Dad policies that's designed to make sure no one gets an answer.
- EForEndeavour 7y ago
  Genuinely curious: what's your source for this claim? Are you a current or former employee, or did you hear this from one? If so, what position(s)?
  - asah 7y ago
    confirmed with friend who works there in middle mgmt...
deepakhj 7y ago
Zoom didn’t allow any wfh at all before this either and now they’re 100% remote.
kevindong 7y ago
In my (limited) experience, companies are initially resistant and look down upon people who dial into a meeting as opposed to attend in person. Having an official policy of permitting/encouraging WFH eases the pressure on employees to come into the office to attend meetings.

ornornor 7y ago

That’s what surprised me as well.

Niksko 7y ago

I'm sure WFH is allowed. However in companies I've worked for, it's usually expected that you're in the office most of the time, and that if you want to WFH it's either ad-hoc (package being delivered, home repairs, doctors appointment) or it's some scheduled day (eg. our team works from home every Wednesday, or Sally works from home on Thursdays). The optional here is probably just allowing for individual freedom. My company also had 'optional' WFH, then 'recommended' WFH, followed by total office shutdown on Tuesday. I'm not sure you could attract top tier tech talent if you forbade working from home. It's a perk that I really enjoy because it's very convenient, and if I don't feel like going in to the office for whatever reason I don't have to. If I interviewed at a company that forbade working from home (or had very strict rules around it) I'd have to really think twice about whether I would work there. To me, it speaks to a culture of valuing employees based on whether they're merely seen to be working, rather than their actual work output.

keiferski 7y ago

"Sell shovels, don't dig for gold."

deleted 7y ago
[deleted]

iEchoic 7y ago

I'm also curious about this. As a data point: we're fully remote and are in a similar product space @ Guilded (http://www.guilded.gg http://www.guilded.gg). One of our best early decisions was to use our product exclusively for all of our work communication. For us, this degree of dogfooding - which is really only possible at a fully-remote company - has been directly responsible for too many features and improvements to count. There's no better way to develop empathy for your users and a deep care for your products than to have your entire team rely on them for their most critical communications every single day. Not all companies build products that facilitate remote collaboration, but I think that remote work presents some unique opportunities for those that do.

ec109685 7y ago
Most companies aren’t fully remote, so dogfooding the common use of Slack seems smart, where it is still a useful tool even if you are slacking someone 5 feet away.
- iEchoic 7y ago
  Yeah, that's an interesting point as well. Our product is for gamers, who are usually "remote" (if you can call it that), but Slack may trend towards over-fitting to highly-engaged, fully remote work if they were to do this.
- ascorbic 7y ago
  This is very true. I recently moved from a mostly on-site company, where I thought we used Slack a lot, to a globally-distributed, fully-remote one where Slack is the primary form of communication. We use it very differently, as the volume is far higher and we have to deal with timezones. e.g. in my previous job, I found threads annoying and rarely used them as I found they meant messages got lost. In my new one it's a faux pas to not use threads except for in very low-volume channels, because otherwise its tough for people to catch up on channels.

baddox 7y ago

I’ve never thought of Slack as a tool primarily for remote work. I suspect the vast majority of their customers are non-remote companies.

whateveracct 7y ago
Most remote companies use Slack or some other IM message. But remote companies tend to have cultures of async communication, so they don't suffer from the problems described as much.

t0mas88 7y ago

We did the same. We normally have "office days" on Monday and Friday, for team meetings etc. and the other days are for everyone to decide what works for them. Most have one or two fixed WFH days. Due to Covid-19 we changed it first to "optional WFH" (but with a hint that it may be a good idea) on all days, then "please WFH", and now "mandatory WFH, unless absolutely impossible"

erikbye 7y ago

> It'll be interesting to see what changes come as they start eating their own dog food. They use Teams, actually.

sneak 7y ago

I was more surprised to see a major CEO hanging out with friends in a restaurant after the pandemic was declared. I’d been in isolation half a week by that point, and was wondering what “the masses” were still doing going out. I’m astounded to see that smart people were still out socializing by then.

SuoDuanDao 7y ago
I think startup CEOs in general have a different risk tolerance from other smart people...
- Jgrubb 7y ago
  I have to assume they also have access to health care that most of us (Americans) can't imagine.
- RHSeeger 7y ago
  And, if the only people they were putting at risk by being out and about was themselves, that would be fine. But that's not the case.
  - deleted 7y ago
    [deleted]

OJFord 7y ago

From one of the tweets: > In some senses, we were made for this. Slack’s not specifically a “work from home” tool; it’s more of a “create organizational agility” tool. But an all-at-once transition to remote work creates a lot of demand for organizational agility.

tablethnuser 7y ago

Slack is surprisingly anti remote work. They only offer it to incredibly senior roles. Everyone else has to jump through hoops and get approvals from many layers of middle management - it's one of those ask Mom / ask Dad policies that's designed to make sure no one gets an answer.

EForEndeavour 7y ago
Genuinely curious: what's your source for this claim? Are you a current or former employee, or did you hear this from one? If so, what position(s)?
- asah 7y ago
  confirmed with friend who works there in middle mgmt...

deepakhj 7y ago

Zoom didn’t allow any wfh at all before this either and now they’re 100% remote.

kevindong 7y ago

In my (limited) experience, companies are initially resistant and look down upon people who dial into a meeting as opposed to attend in person. Having an official policy of permitting/encouraging WFH eases the pressure on employees to come into the office to attend meetings.