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I thought this was about Switzerland... Just an opinion on a country that usually is ahead of others in smart decisions - they have almost 0 medical manufacturi

I thought this was about Switzerland... Just an opinion on a country that usually is ahead of others in smart decisions - they have almost 0 medical manufacturing here, and in past weeks were/are progressively getting screwed by ie Germany stopping trucks full of face masks and medical equipment at the border and forbidding them to come here. Outsourcing is not an issue only in US. Also, people in government responsible for raising alerts, closures etc. voted 2:1 to not do quarantine when Italy was already exploding with cases (mind you, regions super close to Suisse!). Why? Effin' economical concerns, meaning businesses stronghanding (probably corrupt) politicians to keep things running. So while people were already dying en masse 50km south from here, all the shops, restaurants and caffees were chock full of common folks were acting like nothing is going on. Somebody didn't realize that it will take much longer to get economy back afterwards... Hospitals desperately unprepared with equipment. Doctors working with plain stupid paper/cloth masks on emergencies, not having them swapped often. Leaving schools open for way too long. I could go on... I expected more from this country. I really did. Quick removal of any workers protection laws for doctors. I personally know few doctors that are already sick with Covid here, mainly because system fucked them hard with lack of equipment, and they are properly disappointed, desperate and furious. So don't be harsh on US government, I think basically almost all governments screwed up badly.

A4ET8a8uTh0 7y ago
This is the part that annoys me. Most people would agree that this particular virus presents a threat that should be addressed in a way that bypassed day to day considerations. But that is not the case. In US, the president openly says if it hurts economy too bad, we might as well roll the dice and see what happens. Very annoying given that the advice is likely coming from people who can cloister themselves if needed. Why does everything has to be calculated in terms of the dollar? Hell, a month ago poster here was advocating killong off bat a species to save 2T in imaginary assets. It feels like I am going on a rant here, so I apologize. The past few days have been bananas.
- m23khan 7y ago
  hang in there friend, we are all in this Together.
Rochus 7y ago
> they have almost 0 medical manufacturing here Well, that must be a very big zero. Have you ever heard of companies like Roche, Tecan, Hamilton or Ypsomed (just to name a few)?
- saiya-jin 7y ago
  Yeah, do your due diligence. All there is here are HQs with upper management, just enough to tax corporations here, and often some research. Manufacturing - almost zero, zilch, none. And if there is something, it can't manufacture anything without all parts supplied from outside (cheaper) countries. Of-topic a bit, but you know that 'swiss' army knives (victorinox, wenger) are manufactured piece by piece in Germany/Austria, and only final assembly is done en Suisse? Just enough work to pass the criteria to get the stamp 'swiss made', not a nanometer more. I understand it from cold corporate logic, it really minimizes the costs and they ask for premium price nevertheless due to that swiss tag. But as we see now, this approach hits the wall hard in certain, very real scenarios. At least they kept the milk industry with long term subsidies afloat. Go talk to Swiss doctors if you care, ideally in cantonal hospitals that will take most of the sick. Most of our friends are doctors in the biggest one in whole country, quite a few in emergencies. You will hear stories... None of the stuff I mention is in mainstream media, all act like all is under control from day 0. Talk about independent journalism.
  - Rochus 7y ago
    Well, I am Swiss and I consult some of the mentioned companies. These companies do most of their F&E in Switzerland and also some manufacturing. It's in no way just management. And Victorinox does manufacturing in Ibach and it's one of the most popular employers in Europe.
PeterStuer 7y ago
All screw up, but some screw up more persistently then others. What it clearly demoinstrates is that our socio-economic systems of choice clearly do not incentivize providing proper care for the people it is meant to serve. Some still act as if this was an unforeseen event. All of this was predicted years ago after the previous SARS outbreak and well documented by the scientific community, yet governments worldwide turned a blind eye. My own 'health' minister even went as far as destroying the strategic stockpile of FFP2 masks (yes, actually destroyed as they went over their 'best used before' , not that that turns them useless overnight) then aggressively 'saved' on all social and healthcare programs and decided not to refill the strategic stockpile. Her latest blunder: panic ordering a contingent of masks from some dodgy north-African dealer without doing any due diligence, and of course in the process not only getting conned out of 3.5 million euros, but having hospital staff waiting another week on adequate protection. It boggles the mind.
- saiya-jin 7y ago
  Maybe I didn't express myself properly at the end - I meant be pissed off, I sure as hell am, but these massive failures that will cost many lives can be found everywhere. I really did expect more, not strictly from politicians (they should just listen when SHTF), but many 'experts' with influential roles in government. In strictly just society, those with powers for this situation should be judged afterwards for their effectiveness, or lack of it. I wonder if we will see this in some form somewhere

A4ET8a8uTh0 7y ago

This is the part that annoys me. Most people would agree that this particular virus presents a threat that should be addressed in a way that bypassed day to day considerations. But that is not the case. In US, the president openly says if it hurts economy too bad, we might as well roll the dice and see what happens. Very annoying given that the advice is likely coming from people who can cloister themselves if needed. Why does everything has to be calculated in terms of the dollar? Hell, a month ago poster here was advocating killong off bat a species to save 2T in imaginary assets. It feels like I am going on a rant here, so I apologize. The past few days have been bananas.

m23khan 7y ago
hang in there friend, we are all in this Together.

Rochus 7y ago

> they have almost 0 medical manufacturing here Well, that must be a very big zero. Have you ever heard of companies like Roche, Tecan, Hamilton or Ypsomed (just to name a few)?

saiya-jin 7y ago
Yeah, do your due diligence. All there is here are HQs with upper management, just enough to tax corporations here, and often some research. Manufacturing - almost zero, zilch, none. And if there is something, it can't manufacture anything without all parts supplied from outside (cheaper) countries. Of-topic a bit, but you know that 'swiss' army knives (victorinox, wenger) are manufactured piece by piece in Germany/Austria, and only final assembly is done en Suisse? Just enough work to pass the criteria to get the stamp 'swiss made', not a nanometer more. I understand it from cold corporate logic, it really minimizes the costs and they ask for premium price nevertheless due to that swiss tag. But as we see now, this approach hits the wall hard in certain, very real scenarios. At least they kept the milk industry with long term subsidies afloat. Go talk to Swiss doctors if you care, ideally in cantonal hospitals that will take most of the sick. Most of our friends are doctors in the biggest one in whole country, quite a few in emergencies. You will hear stories... None of the stuff I mention is in mainstream media, all act like all is under control from day 0. Talk about independent journalism.
- Rochus 7y ago
  Well, I am Swiss and I consult some of the mentioned companies. These companies do most of their F&E in Switzerland and also some manufacturing. It's in no way just management. And Victorinox does manufacturing in Ibach and it's one of the most popular employers in Europe.

PeterStuer 7y ago

All screw up, but some screw up more persistently then others. What it clearly demoinstrates is that our socio-economic systems of choice clearly do not incentivize providing proper care for the people it is meant to serve. Some still act as if this was an unforeseen event. All of this was predicted years ago after the previous SARS outbreak and well documented by the scientific community, yet governments worldwide turned a blind eye. My own 'health' minister even went as far as destroying the strategic stockpile of FFP2 masks (yes, actually destroyed as they went over their 'best used before' , not that that turns them useless overnight) then aggressively 'saved' on all social and healthcare programs and decided not to refill the strategic stockpile. Her latest blunder: panic ordering a contingent of masks from some dodgy north-African dealer without doing any due diligence, and of course in the process not only getting conned out of 3.5 million euros, but having hospital staff waiting another week on adequate protection. It boggles the mind.

saiya-jin 7y ago
Maybe I didn't express myself properly at the end - I meant be pissed off, I sure as hell am, but these massive failures that will cost many lives can be found everywhere. I really did expect more, not strictly from politicians (they should just listen when SHTF), but many 'experts' with influential roles in government. In strictly just society, those with powers for this situation should be judged afterwards for their effectiveness, or lack of it. I wonder if we will see this in some form somewhere