4 ms·

> no offense Of course no offense. You don't have a history of the most brutal systematic slavery in history and the ensuing racism that persists to this day.

> no offense Of course no offense. You don't have a history of the most brutal systematic slavery in history and the ensuing racism that persists to this day. European subjugation and mockery of Africa is older and has left wounds that have had more time to heal. The wounds are still fresh in the US and they keep being reopened, so it's of course natural for them to still hurt in the US.

pvaldes 7y ago
Not each time that a black character appears in a book is about slavery.
- jordigh 7y ago
  No, but every time a black character is drawn as a racist caricature with giant lips and a bone in their hair, it's a racist caricature which was systematically used in the US and other countries to hurtfully mock black people. There's a long history of such racist stereotypes in American and European culture. It's not benign. There are other ways to draw black people in comic books that doesn't have to rely on hurtful stereotypes.
  - pvaldes 7y ago
    There are many ways to draw people, and Uderzo had theirs. Asterix is short, has a big nose and promotes drugs abuse, Obelix is dumb and will hurt the feelings of fat people, he eats wild boars and vegan children could feel unconfortable or pick up dangerous ideas reading this comics. Ideafix chase cats in a flagrant case of animal cruelty... Is just a parody. Please calm yourself. I'm really tired of this dark soup of neopuritanism, SJW and porcelain people. By the way, who are you to tell me how I must to draw an human figure?. Has returned Maoism or Degenerate art? Do you know what other artists create images depicting black people with big lips and different types of hair ornaments? All african artists. If you don't like the comics, just don't read it. The solution is really simple.
    - jordigh 7y ago
      Does a racist caricature exist? Does racism itself exist? If it does, what does it look like? If you don't think the pickaninny or the mammy are racist, I have no idea what you think racism looks like. The pickaninny and the mammy were part of minstrel shows and lots of other pernicious hurtful portrayals. Nobody has ever complained about the other characters in Astérix because there is no history of black people systematically enslaving whites and then making ridiculous shows and cartoons about the enslaved whites. Of course white people aren't offended by how white people draw themselves. Uderzo didn't even invent the style in which he drew black people. He's just copying the same racist caricatures that existed long before he did.
      - DoreenMichele 7y ago
        I'm sorry for what you have been through, are still going through and all that. I spent some years homeless and I post as openly female on HN, which at least historically was overwhelmingly male. I do my best to educate people here (about homelessness, being a woman online, etc) and I try to keep it as conversational as possible. People who want to be good and want to see themselves as good don't react well to being attacked and accused. It tends to close minds and, with it, doors. I'm not trying to attack you nor criticize you. I'm hoping to empower you with a better methodology. Long experience tells me you probably won't see it that way. I don't plan to argue with you about the choice I've made to comment here. Here's wishing you fair winds for your journey going forward.
      - pvaldes 7y ago
        > Does a racist caricature exist? Yes > Does racism itself exist? Yes > What does it look like? Stupid, unfunny, monochromatic and afraid to normalize the appearance of interracial couples, or to show black, jew, indian, or hispane characters in positive roles, or to depict different cultures and religions living together. Therefore, totally the opposite to this comics. If comics for you, mean only US schools and Steamboat Willy cartoons, then this is just a tunnel vision problem. Can be treated by exposition to different schools of cartoonists. In Europe there are some really big: Uderzo and collaborators, Hergé (Questionable first history, corrected later), Franquin, Peyo or Ibañez among other. Ibañez is undoubtely the wildest one; If you think Asterix it's politically incorrect you're going to freak out with this: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ERFdmt6NOGw https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ERFdmt6NOGw And yes, is for kids.
  - xaxsacsdaffbnk 7y ago
    PoC with large lips exist, presumably PoC using bones as ornaments also exist or used to exist. The story of Asterix takes place 2000 years ago.
throwaway5466 7y ago
I don't see why European artists should self-censor so as not to hurt the sensibilities of Americans just because your country was built on slavery and genocide. Sort out your wounds yourselves and let us live. (For the record, there are plenty of "black" characters (Numids, Nubians etc.) in Asterix and Baba is the only one with his characteristic. Many of the others are depicted favorably, as the other commenter said)
- jordigh 7y ago
  I'm not from the US. I just know what racism looks like, unlike, apparently, many Europeans.

pvaldes 7y ago

Not each time that a black character appears in a book is about slavery.

jordigh 7y ago
No, but every time a black character is drawn as a racist caricature with giant lips and a bone in their hair, it's a racist caricature which was systematically used in the US and other countries to hurtfully mock black people. There's a long history of such racist stereotypes in American and European culture. It's not benign. There are other ways to draw black people in comic books that doesn't have to rely on hurtful stereotypes.
- pvaldes 7y ago
  There are many ways to draw people, and Uderzo had theirs. Asterix is short, has a big nose and promotes drugs abuse, Obelix is dumb and will hurt the feelings of fat people, he eats wild boars and vegan children could feel unconfortable or pick up dangerous ideas reading this comics. Ideafix chase cats in a flagrant case of animal cruelty... Is just a parody. Please calm yourself. I'm really tired of this dark soup of neopuritanism, SJW and porcelain people. By the way, who are you to tell me how I must to draw an human figure?. Has returned Maoism or Degenerate art? Do you know what other artists create images depicting black people with big lips and different types of hair ornaments? All african artists. If you don't like the comics, just don't read it. The solution is really simple.
  - jordigh 7y ago
    Does a racist caricature exist? Does racism itself exist? If it does, what does it look like? If you don't think the pickaninny or the mammy are racist, I have no idea what you think racism looks like. The pickaninny and the mammy were part of minstrel shows and lots of other pernicious hurtful portrayals. Nobody has ever complained about the other characters in Astérix because there is no history of black people systematically enslaving whites and then making ridiculous shows and cartoons about the enslaved whites. Of course white people aren't offended by how white people draw themselves. Uderzo didn't even invent the style in which he drew black people. He's just copying the same racist caricatures that existed long before he did.
    - DoreenMichele 7y ago
      I'm sorry for what you have been through, are still going through and all that. I spent some years homeless and I post as openly female on HN, which at least historically was overwhelmingly male. I do my best to educate people here (about homelessness, being a woman online, etc) and I try to keep it as conversational as possible. People who want to be good and want to see themselves as good don't react well to being attacked and accused. It tends to close minds and, with it, doors. I'm not trying to attack you nor criticize you. I'm hoping to empower you with a better methodology. Long experience tells me you probably won't see it that way. I don't plan to argue with you about the choice I've made to comment here. Here's wishing you fair winds for your journey going forward.
    - pvaldes 7y ago
      > Does a racist caricature exist? Yes > Does racism itself exist? Yes > What does it look like? Stupid, unfunny, monochromatic and afraid to normalize the appearance of interracial couples, or to show black, jew, indian, or hispane characters in positive roles, or to depict different cultures and religions living together. Therefore, totally the opposite to this comics. If comics for you, mean only US schools and Steamboat Willy cartoons, then this is just a tunnel vision problem. Can be treated by exposition to different schools of cartoonists. In Europe there are some really big: Uderzo and collaborators, Hergé (Questionable first history, corrected later), Franquin, Peyo or Ibañez among other. Ibañez is undoubtely the wildest one; If you think Asterix it's politically incorrect you're going to freak out with this: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ERFdmt6NOGw https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ERFdmt6NOGw And yes, is for kids.
- xaxsacsdaffbnk 7y ago
  PoC with large lips exist, presumably PoC using bones as ornaments also exist or used to exist. The story of Asterix takes place 2000 years ago.

throwaway5466 7y ago

I don't see why European artists should self-censor so as not to hurt the sensibilities of Americans just because your country was built on slavery and genocide. Sort out your wounds yourselves and let us live. (For the record, there are plenty of "black" characters (Numids, Nubians etc.) in Asterix and Baba is the only one with his characteristic. Many of the others are depicted favorably, as the other commenter said)

jordigh 7y ago
I'm not from the US. I just know what racism looks like, unlike, apparently, many Europeans.