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> Yes, we need be wary of unnecessary intervention etc. but I'm just shocked to read this kind of stuff. You are shocked that I think people ought to be compen

> Yes, we need be wary of unnecessary intervention etc. but I'm just shocked to read this kind of stuff. You are shocked that I think people ought to be compensated for the income lost due to government order? I am shocked that you think it is okay for the government to take people's property and liberty without even thinking of compensation, as they are mandated to do by law.

choward 7y ago
> I am shocked that you think it is okay for the government to take people's property and liberty What property are you referring to? What about the money they took from me to fund the Iraq War? And you think the government should compensate when they take away liberty? Do you have any idea what the NSA has done since 9/11? I never voted to have my 4th amendment rights taken away and I've never been compensated. Earlier you said > I mean, the government shut down the economy, not the virus. That seems to be the entire basis of your argument. First of all, the government didn't "shut down the economy". They responded to a pandemic. What other action could they have taken? Pretty much any action will have an effect on the economy. So what? This isn't new. What about when a hurricane is coming or something else that causes forced evacuations? Or when people aren't allowed back to their homes immediately after? They could have saved their property if the government didn't intervene, right? Does the government owe them money? Companies should be responsible like citizens are expected to be. They shouldn't just always assume the happy path and then cry when a disaster happens because they weren't prepared. Always be prepared. You're profits may not accelerate as fast but that's not my problem. Businesses being dependent on loans being the norm has to stop. That's why our economy is so fragile.
jariel 7y ago
Most people would be shocked at the nonsensical premise. There's an existential threat to the nation (and globe), which has the potential to wipe out 5% of the population within weeks. (Assuming overwhelmed medical facilities, which will 100% happen without intervention, the death rate climbs to about 4-5% as we see in Italy). Literally millions of Americans dying in their homes, in the streets - all avoidable. 15% of Americans suffering ongoing health issues. This 'liberty ideology' is not only irrational because said 'economic property' will be destroyed anyhow unless the government does act assertively, but it's also completely missing the point, but we're also talking about human lives and existential calamity. Of course 'the goddam gubermint' is not some externalized entity - it's you. So if 'gubermint' needs to pay you for your material grievances, guess where they'll get the money? From you. So how about the government follow your advice: they pay us each $10 000 for our material property damage, but first, they tax us each $10 000 in order to be able to pay for said damages. See how that works?
- tathougies 7y ago
  Not everyone is losing 10k though? I am not losing anything from this. Im still employed and working. Others are not. Yes they ought to take income tax from people working during this time and give it to those who can't and those who've lost business income because of it. Besides, the real point of the stimulus is to give people cash needed now. This is a liquidity problem not a fundamental problem with the economy. Taxing people in the future to pay it back is not only a good thing, I think its the right thing. And the government should make a pretty decent return on it too This is not difficult to understand.

choward 7y ago

> I am shocked that you think it is okay for the government to take people's property and liberty What property are you referring to? What about the money they took from me to fund the Iraq War? And you think the government should compensate when they take away liberty? Do you have any idea what the NSA has done since 9/11? I never voted to have my 4th amendment rights taken away and I've never been compensated. Earlier you said > I mean, the government shut down the economy, not the virus. That seems to be the entire basis of your argument. First of all, the government didn't "shut down the economy". They responded to a pandemic. What other action could they have taken? Pretty much any action will have an effect on the economy. So what? This isn't new. What about when a hurricane is coming or something else that causes forced evacuations? Or when people aren't allowed back to their homes immediately after? They could have saved their property if the government didn't intervene, right? Does the government owe them money? Companies should be responsible like citizens are expected to be. They shouldn't just always assume the happy path and then cry when a disaster happens because they weren't prepared. Always be prepared. You're profits may not accelerate as fast but that's not my problem. Businesses being dependent on loans being the norm has to stop. That's why our economy is so fragile.

jariel 7y ago

Most people would be shocked at the nonsensical premise. There's an existential threat to the nation (and globe), which has the potential to wipe out 5% of the population within weeks. (Assuming overwhelmed medical facilities, which will 100% happen without intervention, the death rate climbs to about 4-5% as we see in Italy). Literally millions of Americans dying in their homes, in the streets - all avoidable. 15% of Americans suffering ongoing health issues. This 'liberty ideology' is not only irrational because said 'economic property' will be destroyed anyhow unless the government does act assertively, but it's also completely missing the point, but we're also talking about human lives and existential calamity. Of course 'the goddam gubermint' is not some externalized entity - it's you. So if 'gubermint' needs to pay you for your material grievances, guess where they'll get the money? From you. So how about the government follow your advice: they pay us each $10 000 for our material property damage, but first, they tax us each $10 000 in order to be able to pay for said damages. See how that works?

tathougies 7y ago
Not everyone is losing 10k though? I am not losing anything from this. Im still employed and working. Others are not. Yes they ought to take income tax from people working during this time and give it to those who can't and those who've lost business income because of it. Besides, the real point of the stimulus is to give people cash needed now. This is a liquidity problem not a fundamental problem with the economy. Taxing people in the future to pay it back is not only a good thing, I think its the right thing. And the government should make a pretty decent return on it too This is not difficult to understand.