5 ms·

Taiwan, which has one of the best medical systems in the world, is heavily reliant on civil society -- which is many things, but one of which is heavy participa

Taiwan, which has one of the best medical systems in the world, is heavily reliant on civil society -- which is many things, but one of which is heavy participation by unpaid volunteers. Social capital is a real thing and a valuable thing.

Traster 7y ago
One of the problems the UK has is that "The Big Society" was used as a political punchline for the best part of the last decade.
- e40 7y ago
  Similar to the problem in the US, where one party has been talking about how incompetent government is. For decades. And working to ensure that it is (so parts of it can be privatized). Now, look at it, when we need it.
  - cbHXBY1D 7y ago
    *Two parties since the advent of Third Way-ism.
  - DuskStar 7y ago
    > where one party has been talking about how incompetent government is. For decades. And working to ensure that it is (so parts of it can be privatized). I'd be much more likely to accept that this was causative if not for the existence of San Francisco and other one-party cities that nonetheless exemplify incompetent governance.
    - andromeduck 7y ago
      I feel the same. SF turned me into a libertarian/neoliberal.
  - lordlimecat 7y ago
    >where one party has been talking about how incompetent government is You ever been to a DMV? Or seen someone treated at the VA? Or heard how patents are issued at the Patent Office? The government is good at some things. It's really, really bad at others, and has zero accountability most of the time.
    - e40 7y ago
      The CA DMV is a model of efficiency. Really. Never had issues with it, in the last 2 decades. Yes, people like to complain about it, but I've been amazed how well they do what they do.
- m4r35n357 7y ago
  I think you mean since Thatcher.
mistermann 7y ago
The pre-existence of a volunteer (or other flavors) culture in a society may also contribute to superior widespread compliance with the various directives issues by governments. Asian countries seemed to have reacted better in this case - undoubtedly a major chunk of that was due to prior outbreaks in that region, but is that the only variable that contributed to the outcome?
- tanilama 7y ago
  The Asian countries that faired better in this pandemic for now are all Confucian societies, and the undertone of such societies is the top-down conformist culture.
- TheSpiceIsLife 7y ago
  I don’t believe anyone here has claimed there is only one variable that explains any countries better or worse ability with regard to this pandemic, or anything for that matter. Edit to add: okay, so a sibling comment claims the reason is a Confucian, culture. But that’s narrow, everything is always multi-factorial. It’s good to see and discuss one aspect, but not at the expense of other considerations.
  - mistermann 7y ago
    > I don’t believe anyone here has claimed there is only one variable that explains any countries better or worse ability with regard to this pandemic, or anything for that matter. I don't believe I said "anyone here has claimed there is only one variable that explains any countries better or worse ability with regard to this pandemic." I propose that something very interesting is going on here, at the object level. I also propose, more speculatively and provocatively, that something very interesting is also happening at the meta-level: a reluctance to discuss the phenomenon. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Blind_men_and_an_elephant https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Blind_men_and_an_elephant
    - TheSpiceIsLife 7y ago
      That's fair. I just didn't really see where you were coming as a reply to the original comment, where you'd written "prior outbreaks ... only variable" and the parent comment was talking about "civil society (and) social capital".

Traster 7y ago

One of the problems the UK has is that "The Big Society" was used as a political punchline for the best part of the last decade.

e40 7y ago
Similar to the problem in the US, where one party has been talking about how incompetent government is. For decades. And working to ensure that it is (so parts of it can be privatized). Now, look at it, when we need it.
- cbHXBY1D 7y ago
  *Two parties since the advent of Third Way-ism.
- DuskStar 7y ago
  > where one party has been talking about how incompetent government is. For decades. And working to ensure that it is (so parts of it can be privatized). I'd be much more likely to accept that this was causative if not for the existence of San Francisco and other one-party cities that nonetheless exemplify incompetent governance.
  - andromeduck 7y ago
    I feel the same. SF turned me into a libertarian/neoliberal.
- lordlimecat 7y ago
  >where one party has been talking about how incompetent government is You ever been to a DMV? Or seen someone treated at the VA? Or heard how patents are issued at the Patent Office? The government is good at some things. It's really, really bad at others, and has zero accountability most of the time.
  - e40 7y ago
    The CA DMV is a model of efficiency. Really. Never had issues with it, in the last 2 decades. Yes, people like to complain about it, but I've been amazed how well they do what they do.
m4r35n357 7y ago
I think you mean since Thatcher.

mistermann 7y ago

The pre-existence of a volunteer (or other flavors) culture in a society may also contribute to superior widespread compliance with the various directives issues by governments. Asian countries seemed to have reacted better in this case - undoubtedly a major chunk of that was due to prior outbreaks in that region, but is that the only variable that contributed to the outcome?

tanilama 7y ago
The Asian countries that faired better in this pandemic for now are all Confucian societies, and the undertone of such societies is the top-down conformist culture.
TheSpiceIsLife 7y ago
I don’t believe anyone here has claimed there is only one variable that explains any countries better or worse ability with regard to this pandemic, or anything for that matter. Edit to add: okay, so a sibling comment claims the reason is a Confucian, culture. But that’s narrow, everything is always multi-factorial. It’s good to see and discuss one aspect, but not at the expense of other considerations.
- mistermann 7y ago
  > I don’t believe anyone here has claimed there is only one variable that explains any countries better or worse ability with regard to this pandemic, or anything for that matter. I don't believe I said "anyone here has claimed there is only one variable that explains any countries better or worse ability with regard to this pandemic." I propose that something very interesting is going on here, at the object level. I also propose, more speculatively and provocatively, that something very interesting is also happening at the meta-level: a reluctance to discuss the phenomenon. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Blind_men_and_an_elephant https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Blind_men_and_an_elephant
  - TheSpiceIsLife 7y ago
    That's fair. I just didn't really see where you were coming as a reply to the original comment, where you'd written "prior outbreaks ... only variable" and the parent comment was talking about "civil society (and) social capital".