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These "heroic professions" also share another common characteristic: they can do no wrong. Doctors? They self-regulate the size of labor supply in their fields

by mslate 16y ago

These "heroic professions" also share another common characteristic: they can do no wrong. Doctors? They self-regulate the size of labor supply in their fields, inflating their salaries. Why do you think we have a doctor shortage? You really think there aren't enough smart people to do the job? No, the AMA controls the number of med school graduates each year by limiting the number of accredited medical schools. They also lobby governments to legislate that nurses can't perform medical procedures (all towards the not-so-discrete goal of preserving their six-figure salaries). Teachers? They can't be fired thanks to tenure policies. This was the biggest issue with public schooling when I grew up, and [continues to be](http://www.nytimes.com/2010/04/16/nyregion/16rubber.html?_r=1&pagewanted=print http://www.nytimes.com/2010/04/16/nyregion/16rubber.html?_r=...). Survive three years and you have job security for life. If my workplace hired and fired based on seniority, we would have gone bankrupt years ago. Firefighters and policemen also can do no wrong--aside from amazing pensions they have great job security and the power to help those they know more than others in the event of disaster (e.g. Katrina). For every example of those in the "heroic professions" doing the right thing, you have the same careerism and self-preservation that those in private industry strive for. But in many people's eyes, they can do no wrong.

RBerenguel 16y ago
In part I agree with you. Tenure (which here in Spain is different: all public workers that got their job through examination can't be fired!) is a big problem. There are a lot of amazing teachers (I've had a lot in my life, since school through university), but there is a lot of lousy teachers (also had a lot of these) that do nothing and can't be fired. And the ones who love teaching (a few of my friends are math teachers) have to suffer more or less what the article says. Education always takes the blame, regardless of the quality of the teacher. Also, they have an increasing responsibility: parents no longer "educate" children (how to behave well, be quite, listen, be respective), it is something that now school teachers and HS teachers have to do, without any level of help from a lot of parents. A simple example, is that when a child gets some kind of "fine" (bad grade, a written note to her parents, whatever), most parents blame the teacher and don't believe "their little child" misbehaved.
- angus77 16y ago
  Are you sure that's "most parents"? The ones that have a good yell at their kids in the bedroom for their behaviour are the ones you won't hear about, and I suspect they're the majority. I know I don't expect schools to rear my children.
  - MediaBehavior 16y ago
    I don't know of a study that has quantified the "most" allegation. But what I have heard from relatives who teach (or resigned from teaching) in public schools is that a large enough number of parents take this approach and seem to come to the parent-teacher conference with the "my great kid is entitled to grade X" attitude... that teachers' authority/professionalism gets undermined. Even worse when administrative does not have your (teacher's) back. If you doubt that the Peter Principle still applies, spend some time in faculty meetings and check out the admins. There are exceptions, of course. But IMHO (observation) the "No more A-holes" rule is more honored in the breach than the observance.
vacri 16y ago
What you really mean is not "these professions can do no wrong", but "the media finds it difficult to blindly tar these professions the way it does to others". Doctors can do no wrong? Is that why malpractise has help skyrocket the cost of medicine in the US? Doctor shortage a machiavellian plan to keep salaries high? Pull the other one. Yes, I do think that there aren't enough people with the smarts and the motivation to be a doctor - in fact I think that there are less of them than actually are doctors. Policemen can do no wrong? Yes, in law courts they're seen that way, but I can guarantee you that plenty of people see police as doing plenty wrong. Police cop plenty of abuse. And Teachers can do no wrong? Tenure or not, teachers cop it from students, administration and parents. Firefighters can do no wrong? Meh, firefighters have the soft option. Cool toys and generally don't have to deal with the general public if they're not paramedics. Stick it to 'em :) But really, the 'can help friends in Katrina' argument you make is just desperately clutching at straws. Not sure how this is a prime motivator for emergency personnel (I know a few, and this is not why they work in their respective forces) or as a 'can do no wrong' argument.

by mslate 16y ago

RBerenguel 16y ago

In part I agree with you. Tenure (which here in Spain is different: all public workers that got their job through examination can't be fired!) is a big problem. There are a lot of amazing teachers (I've had a lot in my life, since school through university), but there is a lot of lousy teachers (also had a lot of these) that do nothing and can't be fired. And the ones who love teaching (a few of my friends are math teachers) have to suffer more or less what the article says. Education always takes the blame, regardless of the quality of the teacher. Also, they have an increasing responsibility: parents no longer "educate" children (how to behave well, be quite, listen, be respective), it is something that now school teachers and HS teachers have to do, without any level of help from a lot of parents. A simple example, is that when a child gets some kind of "fine" (bad grade, a written note to her parents, whatever), most parents blame the teacher and don't believe "their little child" misbehaved.

angus77 16y ago
Are you sure that's "most parents"? The ones that have a good yell at their kids in the bedroom for their behaviour are the ones you won't hear about, and I suspect they're the majority. I know I don't expect schools to rear my children.
- MediaBehavior 16y ago
  I don't know of a study that has quantified the "most" allegation. But what I have heard from relatives who teach (or resigned from teaching) in public schools is that a large enough number of parents take this approach and seem to come to the parent-teacher conference with the "my great kid is entitled to grade X" attitude... that teachers' authority/professionalism gets undermined. Even worse when administrative does not have your (teacher's) back. If you doubt that the Peter Principle still applies, spend some time in faculty meetings and check out the admins. There are exceptions, of course. But IMHO (observation) the "No more A-holes" rule is more honored in the breach than the observance.

vacri 16y ago

What you really mean is not "these professions can do no wrong", but "the media finds it difficult to blindly tar these professions the way it does to others". Doctors can do no wrong? Is that why malpractise has help skyrocket the cost of medicine in the US? Doctor shortage a machiavellian plan to keep salaries high? Pull the other one. Yes, I do think that there aren't enough people with the smarts and the motivation to be a doctor - in fact I think that there are less of them than actually are doctors. Policemen can do no wrong? Yes, in law courts they're seen that way, but I can guarantee you that plenty of people see police as doing plenty wrong. Police cop plenty of abuse. And Teachers can do no wrong? Tenure or not, teachers cop it from students, administration and parents. Firefighters can do no wrong? Meh, firefighters have the soft option. Cool toys and generally don't have to deal with the general public if they're not paramedics. Stick it to 'em :) But really, the 'can help friends in Katrina' argument you make is just desperately clutching at straws. Not sure how this is a prime motivator for emergency personnel (I know a few, and this is not why they work in their respective forces) or as a 'can do no wrong' argument.