7 ms·

I'm in Taiwan in day 6 of home quarantine right now. We get a call every morning to check up on our health. I don't mind it, it's a simple and effective metho

I'm in Taiwan in day 6 of home quarantine right now. We get a call every morning to check up on our health. I don't mind it, it's a simple and effective method and it gives me confidence in the government and society, knowing that everyone is taking the situation seriously. Once I'm out of quarantine, I can feel comfortable being outside living a normal life, knowing that all known potential carriers are contained.

bobbyd3 7y ago
How did they get your information for the daily call? Just curious. Is everyone required to submit contact information? Or did they already have the required contact info for daily health checkups?
- deleted 7y ago
  [deleted]
- RJIb8RBYxzAMX9u 7y ago
  When you enter, you're required to fill out a health declaration form, which asks for your contact info. IIRC, it's not cross-referenced with immigration database. Naturally, some were not filled out correctly, maliciously or not. Of the reported cases, police got involved to track down said persons, and they were fined depending on the severity of the infraction. I don't know if the form DB is now cross-checked with the immigration DB.
  - bobbyd3 7y ago
    Thank you for the thoughtful reply.
  - schee 7y ago
    Here's a quick concept graph https://imgur.com/a/XaQQ38Q https://imgur.com/a/XaQQ38Q
- barkingcat 7y ago
  There is a national registry - if you have a birth certificate, if you have a passport, if you file taxes, if you've used a government service (ever), if you visited dentist/doctor at any point in your life, they have linked those records. If you are visitor and if they need to, within a few hours of landing at an airport and arriving at your destination, you will get a phone call at your destination location/hotel, etc if the government needs to find you - Have you ever wondered why you fill out those landing / immigration cards that they give you on the plane? For the US and Canada, those are only formalities. For Taiwan, the cards get scanned in and then the authorities will call the number you put on that card to see if you're there or if you've checked into the hotel, for example. In regular times, this system is mostly used for things like catching overseas males dodging conscription for example, but the system is active already for times like these when it's critical to know where a person has gone after they leave the airport.
  - bobbyd3 7y ago
    Thank you for the thoughtful reply. It definitely helps to fill my knowledge gaps due to limited travel outside the US.
  - derefr 7y ago
    > the authorities will call the number you put on that card to see if you're there or if you've checked into the hotel So... what happens when you’re not there? I.e. if the government just can’t find you? Does this then translate to a police APB or something?
    - frankacter 7y ago
      "My phone, which is satellite-tracked by the Taiwan gov to enforce quarantine, ran out of battery at 7:30 AM. By 8:15, four different units called me. By 8:20, the police were knocking at my door." https://twitter.com/MiloHsieh/status/1241540231595044864?s=19 https://twitter.com/MiloHsieh/status/1241540231595044864?s=1...
      - derefr 7y ago
- x0ul 7y ago
  My Taiwanese friends told me about this a few weeks ago, they said that the cell phone is issued by the government.
- lifeformed 7y ago
  I had to do quarantine since I briefly left the country. When I came back, there was a quarantine line for everyone, where we gave them our contact info. After that, they sprayed us down and we got into a special quarantine taxi. The taxi ensures we only go home. We're not allowed to go anywhere else except to make a bathroom stop. If that happens, they call a number and a special janitor comes over to disinfect the bathroom.
- crispyambulance 7y ago
  The information problem is one thing, but having enough staff on hand to make thousands of regular phone calls and then even being able to respond to excursions (or phone power-off) in a matter of minutes... that's unimaginable for those of us in the USA. Are these civil servants that have been re-purposed from other jobs? Are they telco company employees?
bobbyd3 7y ago
For instance... do you need a government issued ID to get a SIM card for a cell phone?
- RaoulP 7y ago
  No, you don’t. As a tourist I could get a 30 day (unlimited data) SIM card with a phone number, over the counter. I detailed my experience in another comment.
  - eloisius 7y ago
    You showed them your passport. Locals have to show a national ID.
    - RaoulP 7y ago
      That's true. I misunderstood the original question.
RaoulP 7y ago
> Once I'm out of quarantine, I can feel comfortable being outside living a normal life, knowing that all known potential carriers are contained. I feel mostly the same. That’s what I’m looking forward to after this quarantine. I’m on day 6 as well - The lack of exercise or movement is the worst part.
agumonkey 7y ago
I personally am in the set of people that prefer proactive measures like that rather than waiting. I think confinement anxiety would become zero in your context.
beefok 7y ago
That sounds like the way forward, I wish things were working out that way here! (USA) Off-topic but, I just discovered your music on spotify a few weeks ago and can't stop listening to your albums, amazing stuff man!
- virtue3 7y ago
  ... Their music is legit good. Thanks for pointing that out!
- CliffStoll 7y ago
  Yes!
- lifeformed 7y ago
  What a coincidence! Thank you, glad you like it :)
- onetimemanytime 7y ago
  >>That sounds like the way forward, I wish things were working out that way here! (USA) The virus will go soon enough, one way or another, the surveillance state built for it, will not.
  - kilroy_jones 7y ago
    The surveillance state is already here, whether we like it or not.
bobbylarrybobby 7y ago
Just want to say the Dustforce soundtrack is one my favorite video game soundtracks of all time
- lifeformed 7y ago
  Thank you! :)
lifeformed 7y ago
Regarding the privacy aspect: I think it's a valid concern but this seems like the right pragmatic approach for this situation. I would be more comfortable if they made us use a tracking app on my phone instead, since the app has an express purpose and I can remove it afterwards. But the phone tracking method they are using instead is more robust and tried and true, so it makes since to use that. I guess the issue is not how they do it but if they should do it at all. I think freedom is a balance of what we want and what society needs. If we're living in a society, there's a degree of sacrifice in our personal freedom we must make sometimes. Things like vaccines, limits to speech, and taxes are examples of things that we agree are necessary to run a society that's better for everyone, at a personal cost to our own freedoms or resources. Finding that balance is tricky but I don't think that "maximize personal freedom always" is an approach that always leaves you better off. The other thing is how much trust you put in your society and the government. Taiwan's government had a rocky past, but it's on a good trajectory of strong personal freedom and democracy now. I can forgive them for using this power in this extreme circumstance, but after all this is done, I'd like to see them review this process and ensure there are the right safeguards and oversights in place.
- chrisco255 7y ago
  I'm not doing it and tens of millions would balk at the Federal government tracking like this. Sorry, that is way past the slippery slope to tyranny.
  - lern_too_spel 7y ago
    Would you rather they put you inside a physical fence?
    - chrisco255 7y ago
      No, I'd rather my Constitutional rights be respected. Individual liberty somehow made it through smallpox, malaria, polio, and AIDS without being destroyed and I see no reason why COVID-19 should be some exception to the rule. Privacy in the United States is a right, as deemed by the Supreme Court.
raphlinus 7y ago
Thanks for the first-hand report. I've been somewhat obsessed recently about the topic of how we might use tracking data to control the spread of the virus, including the experiences such as China, Taiwan, and Singapore, but have found not much English-language material. It seems to be slightly taboo to talk about. Off-topic, my son is a big fan. Neon Shore is one of his favorites, so I have that playing as I type.
- uranusjr 7y ago
  Can’t speak for China and Singapore, but it’s most definitely not taboo to yalk about this in Taiwan. There is not much compiled information in English (for various reasons I’m not getting into, but ultimately most are just not interested), but you can piece together the picture by following local news. I found taiwannews.com.tw a pretty good source in English.
batushka3 7y ago
Lot of western people admire and want efective containment like in far east. Thing is, the success of measures is driven by submisive asian sociaties. Tell italian, spaniard or any other european to stay at home - full streats and parks of 'feeling well it's not your business'. Now police catches and fines. Asians in the mean while put up their masks and done what instructed.
- Taniwha 7y ago
  We're ALL going into at least a month's quarantine here in NZ in 24 hrs - the government hasn't just sprung it on us, they've worked up to it over the past few weeks, they started putting people coming from some countries (China, Iran, Italy) into 2 weeks isolation, then everyone entering, now we're putting the entire country into at least a month's isolation. At the same time they've been making changes to support people who's jobs are going away (tourism is big, it's collapsed) and to keep businesses running (last week), mortgage holidays (today). It's not going to be easy, there's going to at least be a recession, and we're likely to be cut off in some form for far longer than a month. So yes you can do what China and other Asian countries have done in the West, but you do need real leaders capable of framing an issue so that the whole society can get behind it

bobbyd3 7y ago

How did they get your information for the daily call? Just curious. Is everyone required to submit contact information? Or did they already have the required contact info for daily health checkups?

deleted 7y ago
[deleted]
RJIb8RBYxzAMX9u 7y ago
When you enter, you're required to fill out a health declaration form, which asks for your contact info. IIRC, it's not cross-referenced with immigration database. Naturally, some were not filled out correctly, maliciously or not. Of the reported cases, police got involved to track down said persons, and they were fined depending on the severity of the infraction. I don't know if the form DB is now cross-checked with the immigration DB.
- bobbyd3 7y ago
  Thank you for the thoughtful reply.
- schee 7y ago
  Here's a quick concept graph https://imgur.com/a/XaQQ38Q https://imgur.com/a/XaQQ38Q
barkingcat 7y ago
There is a national registry - if you have a birth certificate, if you have a passport, if you file taxes, if you've used a government service (ever), if you visited dentist/doctor at any point in your life, they have linked those records. If you are visitor and if they need to, within a few hours of landing at an airport and arriving at your destination, you will get a phone call at your destination location/hotel, etc if the government needs to find you - Have you ever wondered why you fill out those landing / immigration cards that they give you on the plane? For the US and Canada, those are only formalities. For Taiwan, the cards get scanned in and then the authorities will call the number you put on that card to see if you're there or if you've checked into the hotel, for example. In regular times, this system is mostly used for things like catching overseas males dodging conscription for example, but the system is active already for times like these when it's critical to know where a person has gone after they leave the airport.
- bobbyd3 7y ago
  Thank you for the thoughtful reply. It definitely helps to fill my knowledge gaps due to limited travel outside the US.
- derefr 7y ago
  > the authorities will call the number you put on that card to see if you're there or if you've checked into the hotel So... what happens when you’re not there? I.e. if the government just can’t find you? Does this then translate to a police APB or something?
  - frankacter 7y ago
    "My phone, which is satellite-tracked by the Taiwan gov to enforce quarantine, ran out of battery at 7:30 AM. By 8:15, four different units called me. By 8:20, the police were knocking at my door." https://twitter.com/MiloHsieh/status/1241540231595044864?s=19 https://twitter.com/MiloHsieh/status/1241540231595044864?s=1...
    - derefr 7y ago
x0ul 7y ago
My Taiwanese friends told me about this a few weeks ago, they said that the cell phone is issued by the government.
lifeformed 7y ago
I had to do quarantine since I briefly left the country. When I came back, there was a quarantine line for everyone, where we gave them our contact info. After that, they sprayed us down and we got into a special quarantine taxi. The taxi ensures we only go home. We're not allowed to go anywhere else except to make a bathroom stop. If that happens, they call a number and a special janitor comes over to disinfect the bathroom.
crispyambulance 7y ago
The information problem is one thing, but having enough staff on hand to make thousands of regular phone calls and then even being able to respond to excursions (or phone power-off) in a matter of minutes... that's unimaginable for those of us in the USA. Are these civil servants that have been re-purposed from other jobs? Are they telco company employees?

bobbyd3 7y ago

For instance... do you need a government issued ID to get a SIM card for a cell phone?

RaoulP 7y ago
No, you don’t. As a tourist I could get a 30 day (unlimited data) SIM card with a phone number, over the counter. I detailed my experience in another comment.
- eloisius 7y ago
  You showed them your passport. Locals have to show a national ID.
  - RaoulP 7y ago
    That's true. I misunderstood the original question.

RaoulP 7y ago

> Once I'm out of quarantine, I can feel comfortable being outside living a normal life, knowing that all known potential carriers are contained. I feel mostly the same. That’s what I’m looking forward to after this quarantine. I’m on day 6 as well - The lack of exercise or movement is the worst part.

agumonkey 7y ago

I personally am in the set of people that prefer proactive measures like that rather than waiting. I think confinement anxiety would become zero in your context.

beefok 7y ago

That sounds like the way forward, I wish things were working out that way here! (USA) Off-topic but, I just discovered your music on spotify a few weeks ago and can't stop listening to your albums, amazing stuff man!

virtue3 7y ago
... Their music is legit good. Thanks for pointing that out!
CliffStoll 7y ago
Yes!
lifeformed 7y ago
What a coincidence! Thank you, glad you like it :)
onetimemanytime 7y ago
>>That sounds like the way forward, I wish things were working out that way here! (USA) The virus will go soon enough, one way or another, the surveillance state built for it, will not.
- kilroy_jones 7y ago
  The surveillance state is already here, whether we like it or not.

bobbylarrybobby 7y ago

Just want to say the Dustforce soundtrack is one my favorite video game soundtracks of all time

lifeformed 7y ago
Thank you! :)

lifeformed 7y ago

Regarding the privacy aspect: I think it's a valid concern but this seems like the right pragmatic approach for this situation. I would be more comfortable if they made us use a tracking app on my phone instead, since the app has an express purpose and I can remove it afterwards. But the phone tracking method they are using instead is more robust and tried and true, so it makes since to use that. I guess the issue is not how they do it but if they should do it at all. I think freedom is a balance of what we want and what society needs. If we're living in a society, there's a degree of sacrifice in our personal freedom we must make sometimes. Things like vaccines, limits to speech, and taxes are examples of things that we agree are necessary to run a society that's better for everyone, at a personal cost to our own freedoms or resources. Finding that balance is tricky but I don't think that "maximize personal freedom always" is an approach that always leaves you better off. The other thing is how much trust you put in your society and the government. Taiwan's government had a rocky past, but it's on a good trajectory of strong personal freedom and democracy now. I can forgive them for using this power in this extreme circumstance, but after all this is done, I'd like to see them review this process and ensure there are the right safeguards and oversights in place.

chrisco255 7y ago
I'm not doing it and tens of millions would balk at the Federal government tracking like this. Sorry, that is way past the slippery slope to tyranny.
- lern_too_spel 7y ago
  Would you rather they put you inside a physical fence?
  - chrisco255 7y ago
    No, I'd rather my Constitutional rights be respected. Individual liberty somehow made it through smallpox, malaria, polio, and AIDS without being destroyed and I see no reason why COVID-19 should be some exception to the rule. Privacy in the United States is a right, as deemed by the Supreme Court.

raphlinus 7y ago

Thanks for the first-hand report. I've been somewhat obsessed recently about the topic of how we might use tracking data to control the spread of the virus, including the experiences such as China, Taiwan, and Singapore, but have found not much English-language material. It seems to be slightly taboo to talk about. Off-topic, my son is a big fan. Neon Shore is one of his favorites, so I have that playing as I type.

uranusjr 7y ago
Can’t speak for China and Singapore, but it’s most definitely not taboo to yalk about this in Taiwan. There is not much compiled information in English (for various reasons I’m not getting into, but ultimately most are just not interested), but you can piece together the picture by following local news. I found taiwannews.com.tw a pretty good source in English.

batushka3 7y ago

Lot of western people admire and want efective containment like in far east. Thing is, the success of measures is driven by submisive asian sociaties. Tell italian, spaniard or any other european to stay at home - full streats and parks of 'feeling well it's not your business'. Now police catches and fines. Asians in the mean while put up their masks and done what instructed.

Taniwha 7y ago
We're ALL going into at least a month's quarantine here in NZ in 24 hrs - the government hasn't just sprung it on us, they've worked up to it over the past few weeks, they started putting people coming from some countries (China, Iran, Italy) into 2 weeks isolation, then everyone entering, now we're putting the entire country into at least a month's isolation. At the same time they've been making changes to support people who's jobs are going away (tourism is big, it's collapsed) and to keep businesses running (last week), mortgage holidays (today). It's not going to be easy, there's going to at least be a recession, and we're likely to be cut off in some form for far longer than a month. So yes you can do what China and other Asian countries have done in the West, but you do need real leaders capable of framing an issue so that the whole society can get behind it