5 ms·

Neither of these concerns affect Google Cloud Platform. 1) Google has not cancelled any GCP product that I know of, and 2) GCP has excellent support with fast S

by ghayes 7y ago

Neither of these concerns affect Google Cloud Platform. 1) Google has not cancelled any GCP product that I know of, and 2) GCP has excellent support with fast SLA-timed responses from support personnel. Additionally, Google, the org., recently decided to redouble efforts to grow GCP.

robk 7y ago
People can't separate this out
jedberg 7y ago
It doesn't matter though. Until they fix their product trust issues for the rest of their business, people will always conflate them.
- rossjudson 7y ago
  I understand what you're saying, but it can be frustrating at times. "I got a counterfeit product on Amazon, therefore I won't trust AWS".
  - jlawer 7y ago
    Sure, but when I got a counterfeit product on amazon I called them and got it fixed quickly and relatively painlessly.
  - wolfgke 7y ago
    > "I got a counterfeit product on Amazon, therefore I won't trust AWS". This is actually a good argument. I can easily imagine that this could become a problem for Amazon in the future.
    - crankylinuxuser 7y ago
      It's not just "I bought a counterfeit item on Amazon".. But instead: "Amazon continues to allow counterfeits to pervade. I cannot trust them with anything important."
    - anon102010 7y ago
      This was an issue - SES email deliverability out of Amazon was poor for a while before they got their head straight around supporting spammers. Haven't kept up, but it may still be lower than folks paying more attention despite amazon's size and skill.
  - vikramkr 7y ago
    Yeah that's legitimate. "Amazon doesn't care enough to make sure counterfeits are struck down, continuing to put people at risk. Why wouldn't that corporate culture and lack of concern for the well being of the customer transfer over to AWS? What if I'm hosting with someone that'll leave big security holes or oversell capabilities just to drive sales at the expense of quality?" Trust is trust, and if amazon can't be trusted to behave well in one context, over time, that erodes people's trust in the platform to behave well in other contexts. Thats what's going on with Google - they killed reader, and it's the same company, why are we magically expecting different behavior in cloud? It might not be warranted, but that's irrelevant. Trust is earned, and Google isn't entitled to it, they have to earn it. Doesn't matter how they lost it, market forces are market forces, they need to get it back
    - lhoff 7y ago
      I think that doesn't weight as much in people's opinion because the counterfeit problem only came uo in the last couple years. AWS hat already a good reputation by then.
      - vikramkr 7y ago
        Yep. Amazon search has built that trust of Amazon (although plenty of retail companies refuse to use AWS because of the retail competition). But there was a time when Google was universally the coolest company in the room - and I'd be interested to see how deep the trust well goes with amazon. The one thing with amazon you can trust is that they want to make money, and cloud makes them money, so they're at least not gonna pull the plug on you.
jeltz 7y ago
They may have changed their policies since 2018, but they used to close accounts with no warning. https://medium.com/@serverpunch/why-you-should-not-use-google-cloud-75ea2aec00de https://medium.com/@serverpunch/why-you-should-not-use-googl...
libria 7y ago
I've brought this up a few times, but the Prediction API was deprecated: https://web.archive.org/web/20200112103521/https://cloud.google.com/prediction/ https://web.archive.org/web/20200112103521/https://cloud.goo... I understand Google heavily rewards new product launches with promotions. Is that part of company culture not at all within the GCP org? I don't know, I'm asking. People aren't conflating GCP with the rest of Google. They're just unaware of any markedly different promotion incentives in that org.
imron 7y ago
> Neither of these concerns affect Google Cloud Platform. 1) Google has not cancelled any GCP product that I know of, Of course it affects GCP, because due to their existing reputation, people think “Google has not cancelled any GCP product yet”
- vikramkr 7y ago
  Not sure why you're being downvoted. It's absolutely valid. Trust is trust, and if you can't trust the organization to behave in the correct way in one situation why would you expect them to behave in a correct way and a different situation if it's the same organization? Same culture same compensation. they're not entitled to trust, they have to earn it, and it doesn't matter how they lost it, it's their job to get it back, not ours to see the good in their hearts or whatever
vikramkr 7y ago
These concerns do affect the platform since clearly on HN, a technical forum, the trust issues engineers have with Google are a serious consideration. Sure they haven't cancelled anything yet, the concern though is that very few people have faith that Google won't cancel things in the future.
- dodobirdlord 7y ago
  > Sure they haven't cancelled anything yet Counting app engine, it's been like 12 years. I think people can give it a rest. The concern was silly to begin with, and even as a joke it's been played out. This entire zeitgeist was memed into existence by a couple of people on twitter, and then found fertile soil on HN where people will take any excuse to circlejerk. Continuing to participate at this point is embarrassing.
blago 7y ago
It's not just about GCP and cancelations. By now I associate Google with high maintenance, constant and unnecessary change (great for Google, but nothing in it for me), no maintenance and bugfixes, and neverending re-writes. I feel exploited. I feel like I am the product. This might work when providing a free service to the public but we, developers, are not the general public. As condescending and cliche as it may sound, we don't like our time wasted. Google's free services should be a magnet to entice, a funnel to capture and channel our hearts and minds, not the developer repellant they have become. The fact that someone has to spell this is out is a testament to how out of touch Google has become with its traditional base - developers.
fooster 7y ago
"GCP has excellent support with fast SLA-timed responses from support personnel" You have to be kidding me. Their payed support is terrible. We recently had a problem with occasional timeouts contacting the GCE container registry which causes our autoscaling groups to sometimes fail to start new nodes. I shit you not but this one of the selected support answers (after many prior back and forth). Obviously, this issue is still ongoing after many days. "Thank you for your information. I have searched our internal documentation about any service outage and any network issues open recently, And so far I can’t find any explanation of your issue. However, I found the following instruction [1] where describe how to run a local copy of the Google Docker Registry. In addition, also attached the docs where described about how to set up a private Docker registry [2]. If above instruction does not work then please let me know and I will be happy to help you. [1] https://stackoverflow.com/questions/27243294/unable-to-pull-google-appengine-go-docker-image/27265038#27265038 https://stackoverflow.com/questions/27243294/unable-to-pull-... [2] https://www.digitalocean.com/community/tutorials/how-to-set-up-a-private-docker-registry-on-ubuntu-14-04" https://www.digitalocean.com/community/tutorials/how-to-set-... Seriously? Run a private registry? We don't run a private registry because we don't want to deal with that stuff.

by ghayes 7y ago

robk 7y ago

People can't separate this out

jedberg 7y ago

It doesn't matter though. Until they fix their product trust issues for the rest of their business, people will always conflate them.

rossjudson 7y ago
I understand what you're saying, but it can be frustrating at times. "I got a counterfeit product on Amazon, therefore I won't trust AWS".
- jlawer 7y ago
  Sure, but when I got a counterfeit product on amazon I called them and got it fixed quickly and relatively painlessly.
- wolfgke 7y ago
  > "I got a counterfeit product on Amazon, therefore I won't trust AWS". This is actually a good argument. I can easily imagine that this could become a problem for Amazon in the future.
  - crankylinuxuser 7y ago
    It's not just "I bought a counterfeit item on Amazon".. But instead: "Amazon continues to allow counterfeits to pervade. I cannot trust them with anything important."
  - anon102010 7y ago
    This was an issue - SES email deliverability out of Amazon was poor for a while before they got their head straight around supporting spammers. Haven't kept up, but it may still be lower than folks paying more attention despite amazon's size and skill.
- vikramkr 7y ago
  Yeah that's legitimate. "Amazon doesn't care enough to make sure counterfeits are struck down, continuing to put people at risk. Why wouldn't that corporate culture and lack of concern for the well being of the customer transfer over to AWS? What if I'm hosting with someone that'll leave big security holes or oversell capabilities just to drive sales at the expense of quality?" Trust is trust, and if amazon can't be trusted to behave well in one context, over time, that erodes people's trust in the platform to behave well in other contexts. Thats what's going on with Google - they killed reader, and it's the same company, why are we magically expecting different behavior in cloud? It might not be warranted, but that's irrelevant. Trust is earned, and Google isn't entitled to it, they have to earn it. Doesn't matter how they lost it, market forces are market forces, they need to get it back
  - lhoff 7y ago
    I think that doesn't weight as much in people's opinion because the counterfeit problem only came uo in the last couple years. AWS hat already a good reputation by then.
    - vikramkr 7y ago
      Yep. Amazon search has built that trust of Amazon (although plenty of retail companies refuse to use AWS because of the retail competition). But there was a time when Google was universally the coolest company in the room - and I'd be interested to see how deep the trust well goes with amazon. The one thing with amazon you can trust is that they want to make money, and cloud makes them money, so they're at least not gonna pull the plug on you.

jeltz 7y ago

They may have changed their policies since 2018, but they used to close accounts with no warning. https://medium.com/@serverpunch/why-you-should-not-use-google-cloud-75ea2aec00de https://medium.com/@serverpunch/why-you-should-not-use-googl...

libria 7y ago

I've brought this up a few times, but the Prediction API was deprecated: https://web.archive.org/web/20200112103521/https://cloud.google.com/prediction/ https://web.archive.org/web/20200112103521/https://cloud.goo... I understand Google heavily rewards new product launches with promotions. Is that part of company culture not at all within the GCP org? I don't know, I'm asking. People aren't conflating GCP with the rest of Google. They're just unaware of any markedly different promotion incentives in that org.

imron 7y ago

> Neither of these concerns affect Google Cloud Platform. 1) Google has not cancelled any GCP product that I know of, Of course it affects GCP, because due to their existing reputation, people think “Google has not cancelled any GCP product yet”

vikramkr 7y ago
Not sure why you're being downvoted. It's absolutely valid. Trust is trust, and if you can't trust the organization to behave in the correct way in one situation why would you expect them to behave in a correct way and a different situation if it's the same organization? Same culture same compensation. they're not entitled to trust, they have to earn it, and it doesn't matter how they lost it, it's their job to get it back, not ours to see the good in their hearts or whatever

vikramkr 7y ago

These concerns do affect the platform since clearly on HN, a technical forum, the trust issues engineers have with Google are a serious consideration. Sure they haven't cancelled anything yet, the concern though is that very few people have faith that Google won't cancel things in the future.

dodobirdlord 7y ago
> Sure they haven't cancelled anything yet Counting app engine, it's been like 12 years. I think people can give it a rest. The concern was silly to begin with, and even as a joke it's been played out. This entire zeitgeist was memed into existence by a couple of people on twitter, and then found fertile soil on HN where people will take any excuse to circlejerk. Continuing to participate at this point is embarrassing.

blago 7y ago

It's not just about GCP and cancelations. By now I associate Google with high maintenance, constant and unnecessary change (great for Google, but nothing in it for me), no maintenance and bugfixes, and neverending re-writes. I feel exploited. I feel like I am the product. This might work when providing a free service to the public but we, developers, are not the general public. As condescending and cliche as it may sound, we don't like our time wasted. Google's free services should be a magnet to entice, a funnel to capture and channel our hearts and minds, not the developer repellant they have become. The fact that someone has to spell this is out is a testament to how out of touch Google has become with its traditional base - developers.

fooster 7y ago

"GCP has excellent support with fast SLA-timed responses from support personnel" You have to be kidding me. Their payed support is terrible. We recently had a problem with occasional timeouts contacting the GCE container registry which causes our autoscaling groups to sometimes fail to start new nodes. I shit you not but this one of the selected support answers (after many prior back and forth). Obviously, this issue is still ongoing after many days. "Thank you for your information. I have searched our internal documentation about any service outage and any network issues open recently, And so far I can’t find any explanation of your issue. However, I found the following instruction [1] where describe how to run a local copy of the Google Docker Registry. In addition, also attached the docs where described about how to set up a private Docker registry [2]. If above instruction does not work then please let me know and I will be happy to help you. [1] https://stackoverflow.com/questions/27243294/unable-to-pull-google-appengine-go-docker-image/27265038#27265038 https://stackoverflow.com/questions/27243294/unable-to-pull-... [2] https://www.digitalocean.com/community/tutorials/how-to-set-up-a-private-docker-registry-on-ubuntu-14-04" https://www.digitalocean.com/community/tutorials/how-to-set-... Seriously? Run a private registry? We don't run a private registry because we don't want to deal with that stuff.