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Jianruiying, the Special Forces of the Qing Dynasty
- 7thaccount 7y agoI always find certain weapons like the hook sword shown at the bottom to be interesting as they don't show up in other cultures, although the straight sword is pretty much available across the globe. Did it excel in some manner for the threats in China that were less relevant elsewhere? Maybe better armor in the west would have made it less relevant?
- saagarjha 7y agoCurved swords are quite common in Persian, Indian, Chinese, and Japanese cultures. They're not exclusively Chinese.
- Leary 7y agoEven the Europeans used curved swords: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sabre https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sabre Generally curved swords are better at slashing and straight swords better at thrusting, which is particularly useful against weak points in armors.
- bane 7y agoOP is talking about these https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hook_sword https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hook_sword
- credit_guy 7y agoI guess the OP meant this hook sword https://www.mandarinmansion.com/item/chinese-hook-sword https://www.mandarinmansion.com/item/chinese-hook-sword It does have a strange shape, and indeed I don't think I saw anything similar in other cultures.
- saagarjha 7y agoAh, that makes more sense. I was looking for a sword "near the bottom" of the article itself and saw just the curved sword; the hook sword was past the end.
- 7thaccount 7y agoAh, I shouldn't been more descriptive lol
- trianglem 7y agoThis is more of an axe than a sword.
- ckcheng 7y agoAre you looking at it backwards? I think the axe looking part is a guard for the hands. See how it's held: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hook_sword https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hook_sword
- Leary 7y agooh.. Well, here's a kinda similar European version https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bill_(weapon) https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bill_(weapon)
- chewxy 7y agoThis looks like a pre-Bat'leth.
- 7thaccount 7y agoI think Worf does have some smaller versions of these in an episode (one for each hand).
- 7thaccount 7y agoYes, I'm well aware that curved swords are common (scimitar, calvary saber, katana, wakizashi...etc), but that hook sword is just out there.
- dirtyid 7y agoI think op was referring to: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hook_sword https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hook_sword https://www.mandarinmansion.com/item/chinese-hook-sword https://www.mandarinmansion.com/item/chinese-hook-sword There's a fun fight with it in Crouching Tiger.
- deleted 7y ago[deleted]
- hangonhn 7y agoBTW the portraits near the end were painted by a Jesuit priest in the court of Qianlong named Giuseppe Castiglione. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Giuseppe_Castiglione_(Jesuit_painter) https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Giuseppe_Castiglione_(Jesuit_p... His works is a blending of both European and Chinese techniques.
- g8oz 7y agoThe article says the emperor compared his soldiers to the Solon cavalry. Does anyone know who/what that refers to? A quick Google search did not turn up anything.
- boudewijnrempt 7y agoFrom internal evidence from the article, they were also a people inside the Chinese empire. Nothing to do with the Greek Solon :-)
- depeterdekker 7y agoYes, the Solon were a subtribe of what were later called "Manchu". It is quite notable that while most tribes started to fall under the Manchu identity at some point, the Solon were often mentioned separately. They first resisted Qing empire-building fiercely, but once subjugated made some of the best warriors of the Qing. They were even feared still in the 1860s by the Taipings, in a time when most of the Qing army had become a caricature of itself. By the time the Qing fell, all Solon, Chinese, Korean, Russian, Mongolian, Hui and Manchu Bannermen were classified as "Manchu" and by now they are probably truly sinicized.
- yorwba 7y agohttps://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Solon_people https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Solon_people
- ilamont 7y agoWhat was expected to become a quick and decisive victory for the otherwise highly effective Qing army, ended in a stalemate. This was a constant theme throughout Chinese dynastic history -- leaders at the provincial or national level underestimating the military capabilities of tribal peoples/"barbarians," rebels, and smaller tributary states. The preceding Ming dynasty is littered with similar examples involving Japanese-led pirate bands on the coast and tribal groups to the north and west. The 15th-century Zhengtong Emperor decided to take part in crushing one border flare-up with the Mongols, and was even captured. The dynasty itself was ended by Manchu invaders in the mid-1600s. I don't believe the Ming ever trained a distinct/elite group of special forces as described in TFA, but innovative and effective generals were sometimes given special commands and employed new modes of training and tactics but using regular conscripted forces. The aforementioned Japanese-led pirates raiding the coast were vanquished in this way. I recommend 1587, A Year of No Significance: The Ming Dynasty in Decline by Ray Huang (a historian and former military officer) for anyone who is interested in this topic.
- ksec 7y ago>I don't believe the Ming ever trained a distinct/elite group of special forces as described in TFA Embroidered Uniform Guard https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Embroidered_Uniform_Guard https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Embroidered_Uniform_Guard
- hangonhn 7y agoBut that's not a problem unique to China. Historically people from stronger/wealthier nations have underestimated others in poorer nations, especially when the poorer country is on the defense. Mongols vs. Vietnam, UK vs. Maori, Japan vs. China (China took a beating but Japan thought they can win the war in 4 months and China's strategy did win out in the end at great cost.), Chinese nationalist vs. Chinese communists, France vs. Vietnam, US vs. Vietnam, China vs. Vietnam, USSR vs. Afghanistan, etc.
- jacobush 7y agoEveryone else vs someone else in Afghanistan...