5 ms·

Hahaha racing on an empty track in a car that’s built to handle like a go cart is nothing like the stress of a circuit race with other cars. I used to race my

Hahaha racing on an empty track in a car that’s built to handle like a go cart is nothing like the stress of a circuit race with other cars. I used to race my modified turbo 500hp and I can tell you that game racing is nada to real life racing. Even knowing that taking a risk can cost you $$$ or your life is stressful enough. With other cars on the track it’s many more variables to calculate and consider. So let’s not kid ourselves. The delta is larger than one can anticipate without even factoring the physical stresses.

BoorishBears 7y ago
I’m not a race car driver but I do track my car pretty often There are people out there who use simulators and very detailed data logging in their track cars to try and experiment with things like braking habits. Saying it’s “nothing alike” honestly feels like gate keeping. Obviously a video game played from your couch is not going to feel like hurtling thousands of pounds of metal around a track, but if you can’t drive in a sim, you’re probably not going to make it around the track. And before you scoff at such a low bar, there are plenty of people who enter a realistic sim, try and go full throttle with 0 counter steering, and immediately lose control Likewise, if you’re one of the best players in the world on a sim, you can probably hack it at commonly accessible levels of racing After all, why is everyone in this thread acting like F1 is the only kind of racing? There’s stuff like SCCA Road Racing series that won’t require you to withstand 5gs of braking force... - This is kind of like saying “nothing from a flight sim translates to flying” because the risk of dropping out of the sky to a horrible death isn’t there
- Retric 7y ago
  The article is about F1 so that’s the benchmark people are using. Other types of races have their own specific issues. NASCAR for example has lower absolute peak physical demands, but longer races turn into a much larger test of both physical and mental endurance. Given say 3 years to prepare I suspect many could make the jump, but it’s likely well below half.
  - BoorishBears 7y ago
    The article is about gamers also... The jump to F1 and even NASCAR is ridiculous... Again, SCCA is a 50,000 member organization. NASA is another large racing org. You should imagine that most NASCAR racers are not racing for the first time when they first enter a stock car, things like Spec Miata and even competitive go-karting are not any less “real” racing, to say otherwise is gatekeeping.
    - Retric 7y ago
      It’s not about how real the sports are, or even the level of competition. It’s about what abilities transfer. A world class marathon runner needs serious endurance like a world class biathlon athlete, but they don’t need very good vision. Physical abilities can be improved within a range, but once the competition gets good enough you need a baseline genetic competence to be competitive. As in you don’t need to be 6’10” to play in the NBA but you can’t be 3’2”. Further, being extremely tall reduces the difficulty in competing in the NBA. On example not mentioned, is professional F1/Indycar/NASCAR drivers benefit from being able to rapidly change visual focus in ways that video game players looking at flat screens don’t need to. On it’s own not a big deal, but that’s just one difference among many.
      - BoorishBears 7y ago
        Instead of having a circular argument where you continuously make the obvious point “simulators are simulations”, I’ll leave it at how is this any different from a flight sim, which are widely accepted as letting you get transferable skills. Realistic racing sims will give you skills that transfer to racing. Period. They will not give you _all_ the skills you need, they will not train your neck muscles to withstand 6gs, but they will let you understand the concept of a racing line, they will help you understand how shifting mid turn can unsettle a car even if they can’t replicate realistic shifting and a host of other useful lessons. What this thread seems hellbent on doing is pointing out the sim won’t give you all the skills needed to race. Well duh? Especially if you set the bar at skills needed to race at a level .000001% of people who even race will ever be exposed to. The average driver in any sort of competitive driving event (read: race) is probably doing something closer to a HPDE than an Indycar race...
- semerda 7y ago
  I'm sorry I should have been more clear that my car was built for the race track. Came on 2 bar of boost really hard and with a twin plate clutch meant only few people managed to drive it without stalling. A car built for the race track is not the same as your normal car. This is the difference I was trying to allude to. But yes if you have a stock car and you take it on a race track you'll most likely be ok as long as you follow the rules.
  - BoorishBears 7y ago
    ... yeah literally changes nothing. Bone stock vs track prepped literally makes no difference (for the record my car is as track prepped as it really needs to be for the events I run and my goals on consumables, coilovers, roll bar, upgraded intercooler, fuel injectors for E85, ultralight brake kit) I mean subie bros are out there running race clutches in street cars for no reason other than to say they do (even if they’ll never admit that). - None of this has anything at all to do with the fact simulators let you practice _a lot_ of very important lessons. Saying “nothing transfers” is 100% an ego play, because you’re really saying “oh yeah racing lines and all that textbook stuff is meaningless it’s all about if you can push it with the nerves of steel when you’ve got tens of thousands on the line in damages and possible injury” ... I mean there are people who unironically think that, but having those fundamentals that a sim can and will leapfrog you over someone starting from scratch. Even just learning the track layout and markers is an incredible advantage that you can find in a realistic sim (and the friend I mentioned who treats racing much more like a science project than I have the time or funds to does this) I mean, otherwise in what universe would someone be able to be compete in Spec Miata as their first door-to-door racing experience ever and not make a mess of literally everything: https://www.mazdamotorsports.com/2018/02/21/john-allen-translating-sim-racing-to-spec-miata/ https://www.mazdamotorsports.com/2018/02/21/john-allen-trans...
Double_a_92 7y ago
But would a real racing car driver be able to compete in the game? It's kinda obvious that the other way around wouldn't work very well, but what about this?

BoorishBears 7y ago

I’m not a race car driver but I do track my car pretty often There are people out there who use simulators and very detailed data logging in their track cars to try and experiment with things like braking habits. Saying it’s “nothing alike” honestly feels like gate keeping. Obviously a video game played from your couch is not going to feel like hurtling thousands of pounds of metal around a track, but if you can’t drive in a sim, you’re probably not going to make it around the track. And before you scoff at such a low bar, there are plenty of people who enter a realistic sim, try and go full throttle with 0 counter steering, and immediately lose control Likewise, if you’re one of the best players in the world on a sim, you can probably hack it at commonly accessible levels of racing After all, why is everyone in this thread acting like F1 is the only kind of racing? There’s stuff like SCCA Road Racing series that won’t require you to withstand 5gs of braking force... - This is kind of like saying “nothing from a flight sim translates to flying” because the risk of dropping out of the sky to a horrible death isn’t there

Retric 7y ago
The article is about F1 so that’s the benchmark people are using. Other types of races have their own specific issues. NASCAR for example has lower absolute peak physical demands, but longer races turn into a much larger test of both physical and mental endurance. Given say 3 years to prepare I suspect many could make the jump, but it’s likely well below half.
- BoorishBears 7y ago
  The article is about gamers also... The jump to F1 and even NASCAR is ridiculous... Again, SCCA is a 50,000 member organization. NASA is another large racing org. You should imagine that most NASCAR racers are not racing for the first time when they first enter a stock car, things like Spec Miata and even competitive go-karting are not any less “real” racing, to say otherwise is gatekeeping.
  - Retric 7y ago
    It’s not about how real the sports are, or even the level of competition. It’s about what abilities transfer. A world class marathon runner needs serious endurance like a world class biathlon athlete, but they don’t need very good vision. Physical abilities can be improved within a range, but once the competition gets good enough you need a baseline genetic competence to be competitive. As in you don’t need to be 6’10” to play in the NBA but you can’t be 3’2”. Further, being extremely tall reduces the difficulty in competing in the NBA. On example not mentioned, is professional F1/Indycar/NASCAR drivers benefit from being able to rapidly change visual focus in ways that video game players looking at flat screens don’t need to. On it’s own not a big deal, but that’s just one difference among many.
    - BoorishBears 7y ago
      Instead of having a circular argument where you continuously make the obvious point “simulators are simulations”, I’ll leave it at how is this any different from a flight sim, which are widely accepted as letting you get transferable skills. Realistic racing sims will give you skills that transfer to racing. Period. They will not give you _all_ the skills you need, they will not train your neck muscles to withstand 6gs, but they will let you understand the concept of a racing line, they will help you understand how shifting mid turn can unsettle a car even if they can’t replicate realistic shifting and a host of other useful lessons. What this thread seems hellbent on doing is pointing out the sim won’t give you all the skills needed to race. Well duh? Especially if you set the bar at skills needed to race at a level .000001% of people who even race will ever be exposed to. The average driver in any sort of competitive driving event (read: race) is probably doing something closer to a HPDE than an Indycar race...
semerda 7y ago
I'm sorry I should have been more clear that my car was built for the race track. Came on 2 bar of boost really hard and with a twin plate clutch meant only few people managed to drive it without stalling. A car built for the race track is not the same as your normal car. This is the difference I was trying to allude to. But yes if you have a stock car and you take it on a race track you'll most likely be ok as long as you follow the rules.
- BoorishBears 7y ago
  ... yeah literally changes nothing. Bone stock vs track prepped literally makes no difference (for the record my car is as track prepped as it really needs to be for the events I run and my goals on consumables, coilovers, roll bar, upgraded intercooler, fuel injectors for E85, ultralight brake kit) I mean subie bros are out there running race clutches in street cars for no reason other than to say they do (even if they’ll never admit that). - None of this has anything at all to do with the fact simulators let you practice _a lot_ of very important lessons. Saying “nothing transfers” is 100% an ego play, because you’re really saying “oh yeah racing lines and all that textbook stuff is meaningless it’s all about if you can push it with the nerves of steel when you’ve got tens of thousands on the line in damages and possible injury” ... I mean there are people who unironically think that, but having those fundamentals that a sim can and will leapfrog you over someone starting from scratch. Even just learning the track layout and markers is an incredible advantage that you can find in a realistic sim (and the friend I mentioned who treats racing much more like a science project than I have the time or funds to does this) I mean, otherwise in what universe would someone be able to be compete in Spec Miata as their first door-to-door racing experience ever and not make a mess of literally everything: https://www.mazdamotorsports.com/2018/02/21/john-allen-translating-sim-racing-to-spec-miata/ https://www.mazdamotorsports.com/2018/02/21/john-allen-trans...

Double_a_92 7y ago

But would a real racing car driver be able to compete in the game? It's kinda obvious that the other way around wouldn't work very well, but what about this?