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That is not what I have said anywhere in this thread.

by toasterlovin 7y ago

NikolaeVarius 7y ago
>> So my point remains: no one in the west had direct experience of a pandemic.
- toasterlovin 7y ago
  From Wikipedia (pandemic and epidemic entries): > A pandemic (from Greek πᾶν pan "all" and δῆμος demos "people") is a disease epidemic that has spread across a large region, for instance multiple continents, or worldwide. > An epidemic (from Greek ἐπί epi "upon or above" and δῆμος demos "people") is the rapid spread of disease to a large number of people in a given population within a short period of time. AIDS does not meet those definitions, unless you restrict “given population” to mean male homosexuals or recipients of blood transfusions.
  - Retric 7y ago
    AIDS cases have been to every country in the world which easily satisfies as a pandemic. Epidemic is different with Covid19 not yet qualifying. What’s useful about separating the ideas is discovering the root cause. Scurvy used to be epidemic among sailers, making it easier to find the root cause and treatments. Highly localized diseases generally have a specific local cause.
    - toasterlovin 7y ago
      AIDS has not spread very rapidly. It has taken nearly 4 decades to reach its current spread. Covid has the potential to infect most people in the span of 12-18 months. It’s categorically different. And AIDS is easily avoided!
      - Retric 7y ago
        Rate of spread has nothing to do with the definition of pandemic. It took literally thousands of years for Smallpox to reach the America’s, but it achieved worldwide spread before eradication. Malaria on the other hand has also killed hundreds of millions of people but as it’s a tropical disease with 93% of the cases occurring in Africa it’s not a pandemic. Again person to person spread results in pandemics, making a definition based on geographic spread useful.
        toasterlovin 7y ago
        The definition of epidemic that I quoted above uses the word “rapid” and the phrase “short period of time”. The definition of pandemic requires there to be an epidemic. Those are not my invention, they are from Wikipedia!
        Retric 7y ago
        Rapid as in a large number of cases a week, thus “within a short period of time.” Not rapid as in how long the disease existed. The malaria epidemic is thousands of years old, nobody cares how quickly it spread 20 thousands years ago. Edit: Excluding academic intrest. PS: And by Covid 19 not qualifying as an epidemic I meant it’s not an epidemic in every country. It however is an epidemic in several countries and will likely become an epidemic in most if not all country’s very quickly.
        gindely 7y ago
        Malaria is not a tropical disease, although it's been eradicated in most tropical areas and not yet eradicated in most non-tropical areas. The reason malaria is not a pandemic isn't the fact that it's been eradicated in some areas, but the fact that it's endemic. Only epidemic diseases can be pandemics; endemic disease (e.g. seasonal flu) cannot be. This is by definition. Epidemics and pandemics relate to some change from the previous situation whereas endemic diseases refer to stability. This informs our policy responses.
        7y ago
  - danans 7y ago
    > AIDS does not meet those definitions, unless you restrict “given population” to mean male homosexuals or recipients of blood transfusions. All the heterosexual people worldwide who were infected with HIV by their partners might beg to differ.
    - toasterlovin 7y ago
      Even there, the spread has not been rapid or in a short period of time, which are both part of the definition of epidemic which I mentioned above. AIDS has taken decades to reach its current prevalence.

That is not what I have said anywhere in this thread.

NikolaeVarius 7y ago

>> So my point remains: no one in the west had direct experience of a pandemic.

toasterlovin 7y ago
From Wikipedia (pandemic and epidemic entries): > A pandemic (from Greek πᾶν pan "all" and δῆμος demos "people") is a disease epidemic that has spread across a large region, for instance multiple continents, or worldwide. > An epidemic (from Greek ἐπί epi "upon or above" and δῆμος demos "people") is the rapid spread of disease to a large number of people in a given population within a short period of time. AIDS does not meet those definitions, unless you restrict “given population” to mean male homosexuals or recipients of blood transfusions.
- Retric 7y ago
  AIDS cases have been to every country in the world which easily satisfies as a pandemic. Epidemic is different with Covid19 not yet qualifying. What’s useful about separating the ideas is discovering the root cause. Scurvy used to be epidemic among sailers, making it easier to find the root cause and treatments. Highly localized diseases generally have a specific local cause.
  - toasterlovin 7y ago
    AIDS has not spread very rapidly. It has taken nearly 4 decades to reach its current spread. Covid has the potential to infect most people in the span of 12-18 months. It’s categorically different. And AIDS is easily avoided!
    - Retric 7y ago
      Rate of spread has nothing to do with the definition of pandemic. It took literally thousands of years for Smallpox to reach the America’s, but it achieved worldwide spread before eradication. Malaria on the other hand has also killed hundreds of millions of people but as it’s a tropical disease with 93% of the cases occurring in Africa it’s not a pandemic. Again person to person spread results in pandemics, making a definition based on geographic spread useful.
      - toasterlovin 7y ago
        The definition of epidemic that I quoted above uses the word “rapid” and the phrase “short period of time”. The definition of pandemic requires there to be an epidemic. Those are not my invention, they are from Wikipedia!
        Retric 7y ago
        Rapid as in a large number of cases a week, thus “within a short period of time.” Not rapid as in how long the disease existed. The malaria epidemic is thousands of years old, nobody cares how quickly it spread 20 thousands years ago. Edit: Excluding academic intrest. PS: And by Covid 19 not qualifying as an epidemic I meant it’s not an epidemic in every country. It however is an epidemic in several countries and will likely become an epidemic in most if not all country’s very quickly.
      - gindely 7y ago
        Malaria is not a tropical disease, although it's been eradicated in most tropical areas and not yet eradicated in most non-tropical areas. The reason malaria is not a pandemic isn't the fact that it's been eradicated in some areas, but the fact that it's endemic. Only epidemic diseases can be pandemics; endemic disease (e.g. seasonal flu) cannot be. This is by definition. Epidemics and pandemics relate to some change from the previous situation whereas endemic diseases refer to stability. This informs our policy responses.
        7y ago
- danans 7y ago
  > AIDS does not meet those definitions, unless you restrict “given population” to mean male homosexuals or recipients of blood transfusions. All the heterosexual people worldwide who were infected with HIV by their partners might beg to differ.
  - toasterlovin 7y ago
    Even there, the spread has not been rapid or in a short period of time, which are both part of the definition of epidemic which I mentioned above. AIDS has taken decades to reach its current prevalence.