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So irresponsible. Infection rates are the same. Symptoms are just mild in most cases. He should be ashamed of himself, but he won't be. [0] "Epidemiological Ch

So irresponsible. Infection rates are the same. Symptoms are just mild in most cases. He should be ashamed of himself, but he won't be. [0] "Epidemiological Characteristics of 2143 Pediatric Patients With 2019 Coronavirus Disease in China" https://pediatrics.aappublications.org/content/pediatrics/early/2020/03/16/peds.2020-0702.full.pdf https://pediatrics.aappublications.org/content/pediatrics/ea... [1] "Epidemiology and Transmission of COVID-19 in Shenzhen China: Analysis of 391 cases and 1,286 of their close contacts" https://www.medrxiv.org/content/10.1101/2020.03.03.20028423v2 https://www.medrxiv.org/content/10.1101/2020.03.03.20028423v...

cs02rm0 7y ago
Infection rates are the same. Symptoms are just mild in most cases. That's exactly and clearly what he meant, isn't it?
- hownottowrite 7y ago
  Absolutely not. He said they were immune which implies they cannot carry the infection. They absolutely can at the same rate as adults. This makes them vectors for further contagion just like everyone else.
  - lm28469 7y ago
    > which implies they cannot carry the infection. You might want to update your internal definition of "immune".
    - hownottowrite 7y ago
      I think my internal definition is just fine thanks. Immunity implies that the host body has developed antibodies to neutralize viral replication or interferons which straight up kill viruses. As a result, the presence of the virus is reduced, possibly to near zero. But that's not really the case here. You might be asymptomatic but still shedding virus just as much as someone on their deathbed. With respect to children, they still become infected at the same rate. They still provide a place for viral replication even if they are asymptomatic.
  - lliamander 7y ago
    Except that he then acknowledges children can still spread it to the elderly it the same tweet. Clearly he did not mean children could not pass on the infection.
    - jariel 7y ago
      I think it's clear what he meant to say, but he used a very poor choice of words. This is why we don't trust random thoughts by duderinos on Twitter and it's why we have people who specialize in communications.
      - lliamander 7y ago
        This is ridiculous. One merely need to read two sentences to understand exactly what Musk is saying. Trying to be pedantic about the meaning of immunity isn't helping. The error that Musk is making (and the one which BBC pointed out) was to downplay the fact that children can become seriously ill from this infection. The fact that severe disease is much less prevalent in younger patients does not mean it is entirely absent.
        jariel 7y ago
        That's an intelligent reading of the Tweet. Most people, even if they are intelligent, are not acting with their full logical faculties. We are busy, distracted, not always thinking, give to much credit, tired, read it poorly, not bothering, and many of us aren't so bright. Which is why words matter. Communication is a skill. Musk is actually a talented communicator but in a special way, not the kind we want during a crisis where information is important. Saying 'children are immune' is irresponsible, he should apologize and update the Tweet. To not do so is to fall into Trumpish communicating, which is bad.
  - cs02rm0 7y ago
    Cannot carry the infection? Ugh, I'll go with it. Still, there are other less literal interpretations. You can be immune from legal action, or immune from the effects of a global financial crash. When Musk says: ...but elderly with existing conditions are vulnerable. Family gatherings with close contact between kids & grandparents probably most risky. He clearly isn't saying kids cannot carry COVID-19. He's saying they're "essentially" immune from the symptoms.
zengid 7y ago
While that study just looks at children, I'm not sure if we can claim that "Infection rates are the same" between children and adults, if that's what you mean? Either way, I think the paper you cited is worth reading. Many people think children are all safe to this, but they do still get infected. What is truly important to pay attention to is that infants are vulnerable to this virus. As the father of an infant, I am very worried. As for Musk, he can say some dumb stuff like everyone. I just hope he follows through and helps manufacture ventilators with GM and other companies [0, 1]. We're going to be in for a lot of grief if we end up like Italy. [0] https://www.theverge.com/2020/3/21/21189184/gm-ventec-ventilators-tesla-musk-coronavirus https://www.theverge.com/2020/3/21/21189184/gm-ventec-ventil... [1] tesla not mentioned but GM is https://www.axios.com/coronavirus-trump-gm-medical-supplies-production-9a490add-0eb9-4c10-a647-3f57ae148028.html https://www.axios.com/coronavirus-trump-gm-medical-supplies-...
- hownottowrite 7y ago
  Correct, that particular study does not draw this conclusion but this one does: "Epidemiology and Transmission of COVID-19 in Shenzhen China: Analysis of 391 cases and 1,286 of their close contacts" https://www.medrxiv.org/content/10.1101/2020.03.03.20028423v2 https://www.medrxiv.org/content/10.1101/2020.03.03.20028423v...
mirekrusin 7y ago
The way data is presented you don’t know age group of those 3 critical, medically confirmed cases. They could be >15 years old.
- hownottowrite 7y ago
  True though there are other studies that suggest younger children are more likely than older children to present critical symptoms.

cs02rm0 7y ago

Infection rates are the same. Symptoms are just mild in most cases. That's exactly and clearly what he meant, isn't it?

hownottowrite 7y ago
Absolutely not. He said they were immune which implies they cannot carry the infection. They absolutely can at the same rate as adults. This makes them vectors for further contagion just like everyone else.
- lm28469 7y ago
  > which implies they cannot carry the infection. You might want to update your internal definition of "immune".
  - hownottowrite 7y ago
    I think my internal definition is just fine thanks. Immunity implies that the host body has developed antibodies to neutralize viral replication or interferons which straight up kill viruses. As a result, the presence of the virus is reduced, possibly to near zero. But that's not really the case here. You might be asymptomatic but still shedding virus just as much as someone on their deathbed. With respect to children, they still become infected at the same rate. They still provide a place for viral replication even if they are asymptomatic.
- lliamander 7y ago
  Except that he then acknowledges children can still spread it to the elderly it the same tweet. Clearly he did not mean children could not pass on the infection.
  - jariel 7y ago
    I think it's clear what he meant to say, but he used a very poor choice of words. This is why we don't trust random thoughts by duderinos on Twitter and it's why we have people who specialize in communications.
    - lliamander 7y ago
      This is ridiculous. One merely need to read two sentences to understand exactly what Musk is saying. Trying to be pedantic about the meaning of immunity isn't helping. The error that Musk is making (and the one which BBC pointed out) was to downplay the fact that children can become seriously ill from this infection. The fact that severe disease is much less prevalent in younger patients does not mean it is entirely absent.
      - jariel 7y ago
        That's an intelligent reading of the Tweet. Most people, even if they are intelligent, are not acting with their full logical faculties. We are busy, distracted, not always thinking, give to much credit, tired, read it poorly, not bothering, and many of us aren't so bright. Which is why words matter. Communication is a skill. Musk is actually a talented communicator but in a special way, not the kind we want during a crisis where information is important. Saying 'children are immune' is irresponsible, he should apologize and update the Tweet. To not do so is to fall into Trumpish communicating, which is bad.
- cs02rm0 7y ago
  Cannot carry the infection? Ugh, I'll go with it. Still, there are other less literal interpretations. You can be immune from legal action, or immune from the effects of a global financial crash. When Musk says: ...but elderly with existing conditions are vulnerable. Family gatherings with close contact between kids & grandparents probably most risky. He clearly isn't saying kids cannot carry COVID-19. He's saying they're "essentially" immune from the symptoms.

zengid 7y ago

While that study just looks at children, I'm not sure if we can claim that "Infection rates are the same" between children and adults, if that's what you mean? Either way, I think the paper you cited is worth reading. Many people think children are all safe to this, but they do still get infected. What is truly important to pay attention to is that infants are vulnerable to this virus. As the father of an infant, I am very worried. As for Musk, he can say some dumb stuff like everyone. I just hope he follows through and helps manufacture ventilators with GM and other companies [0, 1]. We're going to be in for a lot of grief if we end up like Italy. [0] https://www.theverge.com/2020/3/21/21189184/gm-ventec-ventilators-tesla-musk-coronavirus https://www.theverge.com/2020/3/21/21189184/gm-ventec-ventil... [1] tesla not mentioned but GM is https://www.axios.com/coronavirus-trump-gm-medical-supplies-production-9a490add-0eb9-4c10-a647-3f57ae148028.html https://www.axios.com/coronavirus-trump-gm-medical-supplies-...

hownottowrite 7y ago
Correct, that particular study does not draw this conclusion but this one does: "Epidemiology and Transmission of COVID-19 in Shenzhen China: Analysis of 391 cases and 1,286 of their close contacts" https://www.medrxiv.org/content/10.1101/2020.03.03.20028423v2 https://www.medrxiv.org/content/10.1101/2020.03.03.20028423v...

mirekrusin 7y ago

The way data is presented you don’t know age group of those 3 critical, medically confirmed cases. They could be >15 years old.

hownottowrite 7y ago
True though there are other studies that suggest younger children are more likely than older children to present critical symptoms.