7 ms·

What vanity projects?

by chipperyman573 7y ago

npongratz 7y ago
Removing useful ports to shave off a tenth of a millimeter.
ProAm 7y ago
Removing ports from MBPs for one.
- unlinked_dll 7y ago
  That's been a trend across all laptops for awhile now. You're lucky to get a mini display port or mini hdmi these days.
- bambataa 7y ago
  I have a non-touchbar MBP with just two USB-C ports and nothing else. Two, on the same side, and one is always used for charging. So one free port on a pro laptop. I still can’t understand how they ever thought it was acceptable. Why bother moving to USB-C if you’re going to cripple their usefulness?
  - robotresearcher 7y ago
    > I still can’t understand how they ever thought it was acceptable. > I have a non-touchbar MBP. You or your employer bought it. This leads them to believe it was acceptable. [edit: this comment was pedantic and unhelpful. I do understand what the parent meant. See another comment down thread.]
    - pmichaud 7y ago
      I don't think this is a nuanced enough way to think about it. Most of the reason I still use my macbook and basically the only reason I'd consider buying a new one when the time comes is "soft lock in". I'm not literally stuck, but I'd have to carefully consider how to do literally everything differently, and learn whole different workflows and software packages and keyboard shortcuts. I'd have to consider how various other hardware would or would not work with it. Etc. Orrrr... I could get a macbook that has a lot of annoying shit about it and just deal with it. And sure, you could say that is the definition of "acceptable"--after all, on the balance, I "prefer" to just deal with it. But I'm saying that there's a qualitative difference (that you'll see in the long term prospects of the company if they don't get their shit together) between deciding something is the best option vs feeling stuck with something.
      - robotresearcher 7y ago
        Yeah, I hear you. Some products get the value proposition really great (MBP 15" and MBA 13" both circa 2015), and some you can just settle for. I totally understand how different those buying experiences feel. The new MBA seems to be well received by reviewers.
    - bambataa 7y ago
      Yes, technically, but I was replacing a (superior) older MBP that got water damage and that was what they had available. I was abroad, needed a replacement for some contract work and didn't have time to dick around setting up a new Linux environment. These days it's purely a question of whether the convenience of the Apple walled garden is sufficient to offset their hardware choices.
  - lonelappde 7y ago
    You got the low end "pro" version. The 4-port version was on offer. What do you need the extra ports for? Monitors have USB hubs.
scarface74 7y ago
The $10,000 Gold first generation Apple Watch, the trash can Mac Pro, the 12” MacBook, and the dumpster fire last generation keyboards.
- mmhsieh 7y ago
  I liked the 12 inch MB models. Not a lot of good choices in the ultraportables category and 12 is where it's at for me.
- aczerepinski 7y ago
  I disagree on the 12" MacBook. My wife has one and I think it's a fantastic product. With only 0.2 lbs separating the Air and Pro right now, I don't think both lines really need to exist. If they had kept iterating on the ultra-light MacBook it would be such a great product to recommend to parents, etc.
  - kirstenbirgit 7y ago
    I think it's a big shame they're not making the 12" anymore. It's a perfect computer for lounging around on the sofa or on the go. The new Air actually feels a lot more heavy and cumbersome compared to it.
    - mmhsieh 7y ago
      I just made the switch recently; the larger volume of the new 13" and the increased mass really creates a discernible different in the moment of inertia. Subtle difference that makes me miss the 12".
  - andrekandre 7y ago
    yep, the first iterations of the macbook 12 were pretty awful but the last generation is actually quite a competent computer 4k display @ 60hz works fine through usb-c up to 16GB ram up to dual core i7 no fan keyboard is improved over the first generation i can run clion, xcode, docker, quiet a few safari tabs, terminals and other apps at the same time... the only thing is large compiled of course take a long time, but for lighter workloads, for people that are on the go a lot (like me ^^) it’s quite good imo
dmitriid 7y ago
- Touchbar - Keyboard - Shaving off more and more millimetres off notebooks when no one was asking for at the expense of functionality - The disaster that is Apple's current approach to software design - Mice that have to be charged from the bottom - Apple pencil that can only be charged by sticking it into iPad's lightning port - Moving audio jack the the right on the laptops when 99% of world's headphones have cables coming out of the left ear Just off the top of my head, things I've been annoyed in the past year.
- _raoulcousins 7y ago
  Is the audio jack an apple thing? I'm on a four year old Dell and it's on the right.
  - dmitriid 7y ago
    In MacBooks it used to always be on the left. And then they switched to the right when they introduced USB-C models.
- tobr 7y ago
  > 99% of world's headphones have cables coming out of the left ear Is this number intended as a factual statement or hyperbole? I’ve only ever used headphones with cables going to both ears, to neither ear, or ones where you can plug it in on either side.
  - Tyr42 7y ago
    I've had 4 or 5 headphones, and only the really cheap computer lab ones had the wire split in front. The rest all have the wire going to the left ear, then a wire overtop to right ear. I've never seen one which you can plug it in on either side. I'm in Canada if that helps.
yoz-y 7y ago
I think there are three: the golden watch, the coffee table book and the Apple Park. Although the park seems to have worked out really well in the end.
- thelittleone 7y ago
  Soldering SSD to MacBook Pro motherboard. Eliminating the ability to remove it when logic board dies and retrieve data with a Simple USB adapter.
  - frandroid 7y ago
    Is that Ive or Cook though
    - mbreese 7y ago
      Probably was due to their obsession with making things as thin as possible (Ive). Internal connectors take up more space than direct soldering. But, it’s also probably easier to manufacture (Cook), because you don’t have to have a person manually plug in a cable/ribbon. But on the balance, I’d guess that the decision to remove internal ports was all about thinness.
  - raverbashing 7y ago
    Well, even if you could, I think Full Disk Encryption is on the T2 chip now. No way of reading the drive even if you remove it.
    - ThePowerOfFuet 7y ago
      That's a different issue than the lack of expandability.
  - hoorayimhelping 7y ago
    I don't think that's vanity, I think they made a conscious tradeoff in service of thinner computers. It's a good tradeoff in my opinion: the thinness of the computer has more of an impact on my average day to day usage than being able to remove a faulty logic board.
linguae 7y ago
I think these are references to Apple's change in software design once Jony Ive became in charge of human interface design in late 2012 as well as the 2013 Mac Pro and the 2016 MacBook Pro. From a software standpoint, I've noticed a change in the quality and feel of Apple products since OS X Yosemite, and it hasn't been for the better. I found (and still find) Photos.app to be a downgrade from iPhoto, and I'm also finding less fit-and-finish in Apple's software overall, though it still remains more polished to me than Windows 10 or Linux desktops. It's a far cry from the days where Apple was obsessed with UI design, both in terms of form and faction, from the days of the early Macintosh all the way through the Snow Leopard era. The keyboard fiasco regarding the 2016 MacBook Pro is well-known. Regarding the 2013 Mac Pro, I'm actually typing this on a 2013 Mac Pro; it's not a bad computer at all by any means, but Apple severely miscalculated this machine's capability of getting regular refreshes due to thermal issues that they admitted to in 2017. Had it been a one-off model similar to the 20th Anniversary Macintosh, then its reputation would have been better. But this miscalculation, as well as Apple's unwillingness to correct course until their announcement in 2017, meant that the Mac Pro went for six years without upgrades, an eternity in the computer industry. All of these issues, combined with other problems that may or may not have anything to do with Jony Ive (e.g., the lack of upgrades in the Mac Mini, the lack of user-serviceability in many Mac models, the price gouging for RAM and storage upgrades at purchase time) have eroded the reputation of the Mac brand and has caused some Mac users to switch to either Hackintoshes, Windows, or Linux. With that being said, I've been more impressed with Apple's Mac upgrades lately. While I'm still bummed that Apple didn't make a $2,999 or $3,499 entry-level 2019 Mac Pro, the $5,999 Mac Pro appears to be a solid Mac desktop, and I'm glad that Apple listened to its customers in the creative professional market who need machines like that to do their work. I'm also glad that Apple has corrected course regarding its laptop keyboards, and the 2020 MacBook Air looks like a compelling buy. I might end up buying one later this year to replace my aging 2013 MacBook Air.
basch 7y ago
The replies may be a long list of hardware snafus, however Apples largest hurdle to complete dominance is their lack of cloud services, their subpar cloud services (compared to Google and Microsoft), their refusal to allow users to set competing services as default (change is in the air?), their confusing and cumbersome iterations of the same concept (Photos especially), and the duality of iOS/MacOS vs Windows 10. They are making the same mistake Microsoft made for too long, where Microsoft wanted all Microsoft software to drive sales of Windows licenses. - Apple has few top tier "services." Music is one, the app store is another they do offer. Maps has somewhat caught up to be good enough, but if I were a google maps user I wouldnt choose to switch. Photos and Device Backup are a mess. - Apple should take being a software services company more seriously. If buying Adobe is out of the question, they need some kind of paid revenue stream such as Adobe Creative Cloud or Office 365, something that non-Apple users will buy and use. One of the smartest thing Apple ever did was release the iPad and make it work with Windows. Apple needs that gateway drug that draws non apple users back in without forcing a hardware purchase. - I can use Google Photos on Windows, OneDrive on Android. Apple forcing an all or nothing into their ecosystem incentivizes me to choose nothing. AppleTV on Samsung tvs was a smart play, make more of them.
LgWoodenBadger 7y ago
$1k display stand $400 casters without locks camera-bump sticking out of iPhone that makes it rock on a flat surface

What vanity projects?

npongratz 7y ago

Removing useful ports to shave off a tenth of a millimeter.

ProAm 7y ago

Removing ports from MBPs for one.

unlinked_dll 7y ago
That's been a trend across all laptops for awhile now. You're lucky to get a mini display port or mini hdmi these days.
bambataa 7y ago
I have a non-touchbar MBP with just two USB-C ports and nothing else. Two, on the same side, and one is always used for charging. So one free port on a pro laptop. I still can’t understand how they ever thought it was acceptable. Why bother moving to USB-C if you’re going to cripple their usefulness?
- robotresearcher 7y ago
  > I still can’t understand how they ever thought it was acceptable. > I have a non-touchbar MBP. You or your employer bought it. This leads them to believe it was acceptable. [edit: this comment was pedantic and unhelpful. I do understand what the parent meant. See another comment down thread.]
  - pmichaud 7y ago
    I don't think this is a nuanced enough way to think about it. Most of the reason I still use my macbook and basically the only reason I'd consider buying a new one when the time comes is "soft lock in". I'm not literally stuck, but I'd have to carefully consider how to do literally everything differently, and learn whole different workflows and software packages and keyboard shortcuts. I'd have to consider how various other hardware would or would not work with it. Etc. Orrrr... I could get a macbook that has a lot of annoying shit about it and just deal with it. And sure, you could say that is the definition of "acceptable"--after all, on the balance, I "prefer" to just deal with it. But I'm saying that there's a qualitative difference (that you'll see in the long term prospects of the company if they don't get their shit together) between deciding something is the best option vs feeling stuck with something.
    - robotresearcher 7y ago
      Yeah, I hear you. Some products get the value proposition really great (MBP 15" and MBA 13" both circa 2015), and some you can just settle for. I totally understand how different those buying experiences feel. The new MBA seems to be well received by reviewers.
  - bambataa 7y ago
    Yes, technically, but I was replacing a (superior) older MBP that got water damage and that was what they had available. I was abroad, needed a replacement for some contract work and didn't have time to dick around setting up a new Linux environment. These days it's purely a question of whether the convenience of the Apple walled garden is sufficient to offset their hardware choices.
- lonelappde 7y ago
  You got the low end "pro" version. The 4-port version was on offer. What do you need the extra ports for? Monitors have USB hubs.

scarface74 7y ago

The $10,000 Gold first generation Apple Watch, the trash can Mac Pro, the 12” MacBook, and the dumpster fire last generation keyboards.

mmhsieh 7y ago
I liked the 12 inch MB models. Not a lot of good choices in the ultraportables category and 12 is where it's at for me.
aczerepinski 7y ago
I disagree on the 12" MacBook. My wife has one and I think it's a fantastic product. With only 0.2 lbs separating the Air and Pro right now, I don't think both lines really need to exist. If they had kept iterating on the ultra-light MacBook it would be such a great product to recommend to parents, etc.
- kirstenbirgit 7y ago
  I think it's a big shame they're not making the 12" anymore. It's a perfect computer for lounging around on the sofa or on the go. The new Air actually feels a lot more heavy and cumbersome compared to it.
  - mmhsieh 7y ago
    I just made the switch recently; the larger volume of the new 13" and the increased mass really creates a discernible different in the moment of inertia. Subtle difference that makes me miss the 12".
- andrekandre 7y ago
  yep, the first iterations of the macbook 12 were pretty awful but the last generation is actually quite a competent computer 4k display @ 60hz works fine through usb-c up to 16GB ram up to dual core i7 no fan keyboard is improved over the first generation i can run clion, xcode, docker, quiet a few safari tabs, terminals and other apps at the same time... the only thing is large compiled of course take a long time, but for lighter workloads, for people that are on the go a lot (like me ^^) it’s quite good imo

dmitriid 7y ago

- Touchbar - Keyboard - Shaving off more and more millimetres off notebooks when no one was asking for at the expense of functionality - The disaster that is Apple's current approach to software design - Mice that have to be charged from the bottom - Apple pencil that can only be charged by sticking it into iPad's lightning port - Moving audio jack the the right on the laptops when 99% of world's headphones have cables coming out of the left ear Just off the top of my head, things I've been annoyed in the past year.

_raoulcousins 7y ago
Is the audio jack an apple thing? I'm on a four year old Dell and it's on the right.
- dmitriid 7y ago
  In MacBooks it used to always be on the left. And then they switched to the right when they introduced USB-C models.
tobr 7y ago
> 99% of world's headphones have cables coming out of the left ear Is this number intended as a factual statement or hyperbole? I’ve only ever used headphones with cables going to both ears, to neither ear, or ones where you can plug it in on either side.
- Tyr42 7y ago
  I've had 4 or 5 headphones, and only the really cheap computer lab ones had the wire split in front. The rest all have the wire going to the left ear, then a wire overtop to right ear. I've never seen one which you can plug it in on either side. I'm in Canada if that helps.

yoz-y 7y ago

I think there are three: the golden watch, the coffee table book and the Apple Park. Although the park seems to have worked out really well in the end.

thelittleone 7y ago
Soldering SSD to MacBook Pro motherboard. Eliminating the ability to remove it when logic board dies and retrieve data with a Simple USB adapter.
- frandroid 7y ago
  Is that Ive or Cook though
  - mbreese 7y ago
    Probably was due to their obsession with making things as thin as possible (Ive). Internal connectors take up more space than direct soldering. But, it’s also probably easier to manufacture (Cook), because you don’t have to have a person manually plug in a cable/ribbon. But on the balance, I’d guess that the decision to remove internal ports was all about thinness.
- raverbashing 7y ago
  Well, even if you could, I think Full Disk Encryption is on the T2 chip now. No way of reading the drive even if you remove it.
  - ThePowerOfFuet 7y ago
    That's a different issue than the lack of expandability.
- hoorayimhelping 7y ago
  I don't think that's vanity, I think they made a conscious tradeoff in service of thinner computers. It's a good tradeoff in my opinion: the thinness of the computer has more of an impact on my average day to day usage than being able to remove a faulty logic board.

linguae 7y ago

I think these are references to Apple's change in software design once Jony Ive became in charge of human interface design in late 2012 as well as the 2013 Mac Pro and the 2016 MacBook Pro. From a software standpoint, I've noticed a change in the quality and feel of Apple products since OS X Yosemite, and it hasn't been for the better. I found (and still find) Photos.app to be a downgrade from iPhoto, and I'm also finding less fit-and-finish in Apple's software overall, though it still remains more polished to me than Windows 10 or Linux desktops. It's a far cry from the days where Apple was obsessed with UI design, both in terms of form and faction, from the days of the early Macintosh all the way through the Snow Leopard era. The keyboard fiasco regarding the 2016 MacBook Pro is well-known. Regarding the 2013 Mac Pro, I'm actually typing this on a 2013 Mac Pro; it's not a bad computer at all by any means, but Apple severely miscalculated this machine's capability of getting regular refreshes due to thermal issues that they admitted to in 2017. Had it been a one-off model similar to the 20th Anniversary Macintosh, then its reputation would have been better. But this miscalculation, as well as Apple's unwillingness to correct course until their announcement in 2017, meant that the Mac Pro went for six years without upgrades, an eternity in the computer industry. All of these issues, combined with other problems that may or may not have anything to do with Jony Ive (e.g., the lack of upgrades in the Mac Mini, the lack of user-serviceability in many Mac models, the price gouging for RAM and storage upgrades at purchase time) have eroded the reputation of the Mac brand and has caused some Mac users to switch to either Hackintoshes, Windows, or Linux. With that being said, I've been more impressed with Apple's Mac upgrades lately. While I'm still bummed that Apple didn't make a $2,999 or $3,499 entry-level 2019 Mac Pro, the $5,999 Mac Pro appears to be a solid Mac desktop, and I'm glad that Apple listened to its customers in the creative professional market who need machines like that to do their work. I'm also glad that Apple has corrected course regarding its laptop keyboards, and the 2020 MacBook Air looks like a compelling buy. I might end up buying one later this year to replace my aging 2013 MacBook Air.

basch 7y ago

The replies may be a long list of hardware snafus, however Apples largest hurdle to complete dominance is their lack of cloud services, their subpar cloud services (compared to Google and Microsoft), their refusal to allow users to set competing services as default (change is in the air?), their confusing and cumbersome iterations of the same concept (Photos especially), and the duality of iOS/MacOS vs Windows 10. They are making the same mistake Microsoft made for too long, where Microsoft wanted all Microsoft software to drive sales of Windows licenses. - Apple has few top tier "services." Music is one, the app store is another they do offer. Maps has somewhat caught up to be good enough, but if I were a google maps user I wouldnt choose to switch. Photos and Device Backup are a mess. - Apple should take being a software services company more seriously. If buying Adobe is out of the question, they need some kind of paid revenue stream such as Adobe Creative Cloud or Office 365, something that non-Apple users will buy and use. One of the smartest thing Apple ever did was release the iPad and make it work with Windows. Apple needs that gateway drug that draws non apple users back in without forcing a hardware purchase. - I can use Google Photos on Windows, OneDrive on Android. Apple forcing an all or nothing into their ecosystem incentivizes me to choose nothing. AppleTV on Samsung tvs was a smart play, make more of them.

LgWoodenBadger 7y ago

$1k display stand $400 casters without locks camera-bump sticking out of iPhone that makes it rock on a flat surface