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I can’t speak for other EU countries, but Germany has systematically neglected its network infrastructure over the last decade. Even in Berlin fast, reliable In

I can’t speak for other EU countries, but Germany has systematically neglected its network infrastructure over the last decade. Even in Berlin fast, reliable Internet is hard to come by. I often find my LTE turn into Edge at the blink of an eye. We should urge leaders (public and private) to do a better job and hold them accountable for bad policy.

downrightmike 7y ago
The USA paid $4 billion to get FTTH by 2004, didn't happen. ISPs still got the money. I'm honestly hoping Starlink shakes the ISPs to the ground.
- toomuchtodo 7y ago
  Support your local municipal fiber efforts. StarLink is cool, but pulling your own fiber financed with muni bonds at super low interest rates is available today. Returns are chasing safe yield, muni bonds are safe yield. https://muninetworks.org/communitymap https://muninetworks.org/communitymap These folks in the northern rural parts of England do it stupid cheap: https://b4rn.org.uk/ https://b4rn.org.uk/ Contacting your local community representation/government about this can be done from the comfort of your home during self-isolation.
  - gigatexal 7y ago
    There's dark fiber in my home town -- what would it take to run a muni isp and finally give Comcast and co the finger?
    - toomuchtodo 7y ago
      https://startyourownisp.com/ https://startyourownisp.com/ to start (it’s wireless last mile centric though). I will return with more links later when I’m back at my desktop and have access to my bookmarks. I ran a small ISP a lifetime ago, and have also helped others set them up.
      - gigatexal 7y ago
        past-tense -- would you do it again? There's a company already doing gigabit over wifi to homes but you run into line of sight issues -- if figure with all the dark fiber we would just patch into that
        toomuchtodo 7y ago
        As long as there are people without good internet options and I could break even, yes. I plan on doing this in the Eastern Tennessee mountains, but I am somewhat financially secure and work remotely, YMMV. Like any bootstrapped venture, make it a side gig until you reach a comfortably sustainable run rate and subscriber base. You’re not going to get rich as a private ISP, but it can be a comfortable small biz.
        gigatexal 7y ago
        Not losing money but being a viable alternative to the incumbents would be a huge win for me. I bet I would need to get some serious networking skills also, no?
- chrismeller 7y ago
  The US has a _lot_ more area to cover, though. Other than the "urban canyon" effect Berlin basically has no excuse.
  - q3k 7y ago
    The 'excuse' is that Berlin is a relatively old city with little over-air infrastructure and that the ex-national-monopolist (DTAG) doesn't not need to give access to its infrastructure (trenches, tunnels, posts, etc) to other ISPs. This is in contrast, for example, with how the ex-national-monopolist (Orange) operates in Poland - they have to give you access to their infrastructure trenches/tunnels, extremely cheap (around $25 per km per month), by law. The only thing that DTAG has to do is allow local loop access for unbundling - and this is why the biggest freedom of choice within the Internet market in Germany you see is that you can choose from 10 different ADSL ISPs. However, since they all use the same shitty old copper it's effectively zero choice.
the8472 7y ago
> Even in Berlin fast, reliable Internet is hard to come by. I often find my LTE turn into Edge at the blink of an eye. If you're talking about fast and reliable why are you looking at mobile internet then? Fiber beats a shared medium on a fundamental basis.
Proven 7y ago
"Germany" didn't neglect it. Companies who can't make a good ROI because the government won't let them, did. That's what even a mild form of Net Neutrality gets you - Obamacare for Internet access.

downrightmike 7y ago

The USA paid $4 billion to get FTTH by 2004, didn't happen. ISPs still got the money. I'm honestly hoping Starlink shakes the ISPs to the ground.

toomuchtodo 7y ago
Support your local municipal fiber efforts. StarLink is cool, but pulling your own fiber financed with muni bonds at super low interest rates is available today. Returns are chasing safe yield, muni bonds are safe yield. https://muninetworks.org/communitymap https://muninetworks.org/communitymap These folks in the northern rural parts of England do it stupid cheap: https://b4rn.org.uk/ https://b4rn.org.uk/ Contacting your local community representation/government about this can be done from the comfort of your home during self-isolation.
- gigatexal 7y ago
  There's dark fiber in my home town -- what would it take to run a muni isp and finally give Comcast and co the finger?
  - toomuchtodo 7y ago
    https://startyourownisp.com/ https://startyourownisp.com/ to start (it’s wireless last mile centric though). I will return with more links later when I’m back at my desktop and have access to my bookmarks. I ran a small ISP a lifetime ago, and have also helped others set them up.
    - gigatexal 7y ago
      past-tense -- would you do it again? There's a company already doing gigabit over wifi to homes but you run into line of sight issues -- if figure with all the dark fiber we would just patch into that
      - toomuchtodo 7y ago
        As long as there are people without good internet options and I could break even, yes. I plan on doing this in the Eastern Tennessee mountains, but I am somewhat financially secure and work remotely, YMMV. Like any bootstrapped venture, make it a side gig until you reach a comfortably sustainable run rate and subscriber base. You’re not going to get rich as a private ISP, but it can be a comfortable small biz.
        gigatexal 7y ago
        Not losing money but being a viable alternative to the incumbents would be a huge win for me. I bet I would need to get some serious networking skills also, no?
chrismeller 7y ago
The US has a _lot_ more area to cover, though. Other than the "urban canyon" effect Berlin basically has no excuse.
- q3k 7y ago
  The 'excuse' is that Berlin is a relatively old city with little over-air infrastructure and that the ex-national-monopolist (DTAG) doesn't not need to give access to its infrastructure (trenches, tunnels, posts, etc) to other ISPs. This is in contrast, for example, with how the ex-national-monopolist (Orange) operates in Poland - they have to give you access to their infrastructure trenches/tunnels, extremely cheap (around $25 per km per month), by law. The only thing that DTAG has to do is allow local loop access for unbundling - and this is why the biggest freedom of choice within the Internet market in Germany you see is that you can choose from 10 different ADSL ISPs. However, since they all use the same shitty old copper it's effectively zero choice.

the8472 7y ago

> Even in Berlin fast, reliable Internet is hard to come by. I often find my LTE turn into Edge at the blink of an eye. If you're talking about fast and reliable why are you looking at mobile internet then? Fiber beats a shared medium on a fundamental basis.

Proven 7y ago

"Germany" didn't neglect it. Companies who can't make a good ROI because the government won't let them, did. That's what even a mild form of Net Neutrality gets you - Obamacare for Internet access.