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> Just this morning, CNN was frothing at the mouth at Trump calling it the "China virus" -- I mean, yeah, it's a virus that came from China -- and they have an

by daeken 7y ago

> Just this morning, CNN was frothing at the mouth at Trump calling it the "China virus" -- I mean, yeah, it's a virus that came from China -- and they have an op-ed on how this term is stoking xenophobia. That's because it is. There have been many reports of harassment and assaults on Chinese Americans, and this kind of label doesn't go away. The term "Spanish Flu" is still used 100 years later, not because it originated there (it didn't -- it almost certainly originated in midwestern USA) but because the media paid more attention there. The terms we use matter.

dvt 7y ago
> That's because it is. There have been many reports of harassment and assaults on Chinese Americans This is an extreme, uncited, and frankly inflammatory extrapolation. There have been only a handful of such attacks -- I believe 5-ish (reported by The New Yorker and CNN). It's just the typical race-baiting we've seen that generates outrage clicks. Calling it the "China Virus" has no more societal impact (which is: minor at best) than the "Spanish Flu." Really, it just strengthens my point about the nonsense the media is peddling, instead of asking the populace to remain calm, take precautions, and stay safe.
- FireBeyond 7y ago
  > There have been only a handful of such attacks How many are an acceptable number? Or tolerable number?
  - XaoDaoCaoCao 7y ago
    You can't control every agent in the world. You literally have to have a tolerance for the existence of a few stupid ones.
    - munk-a 7y ago
      You can avoid stoking the flames and creating scapegoats. Just for reference when the Nazi party initially started to scapegoat Jewish and Romani people they used disease and hygiene concerns as an early way to paint people poorly and it's hellishly effective - blaming "mexicans taking jobs" is a pretty weak (relatively) scapegoating when compared to "mexican rapists" and trying to play to actors that may be causing a more personal harm. Painting the disease as being Chinese/Jewish/Romani is sort of the ultimate scapegoating - people feel personal pain from seeing sickness in their community and have no direct way to see that the attribution of that sickness to a people group is entirely bullsh. Dogwhistling for racism isn't an innocent action and deserves no understanding, it is hate filled and driven out of self-interest by those doing it.
      - dvt 7y ago
        > Just for reference when the Nazi party... This is an absolutely insane analogy -- not to mention grossly off-base. No one is scapegoating the Chinese people (or, even less so, Americans that happen to have Asian ancestry). Calling it the "Chinese Virus" simply points to its geographic source, i.e. Wuhan, China.
        huanwin 7y ago
        > insane analogy Yeah, Godwin's Law strikes again. Not everything is literally Hitler. > This is an extreme, uncited, and frankly inflammatory extrapolation. There have been only a handful of such attacks -- I believe 5-ish (reported by The New Yorker and CNN).[0] So nobody is doing this? Or have there been incidents that you yourself have previously acknowledged? I tried civilly engaging in discourse with you earlier[1]. But now it seems like you're arguing with people just to argue, not to actually discuss these topics. Also, you can correct people who are mistaken about where it originated without saying "Chinese flu". E.g. "actually, the coronavirus originated in China". I remarked on this to another user who said they just wanted to stick to the facts about its origins.[2] If you're intent on making sure China is regarded as the source and/or culprit, you can emphasize further by adding something like, "and that's why the majority of cases and deaths from [coronavirus/covid-19] were in China. It started there." And that can be said perfectly fine without "Chinese virus". [0]: https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=22621821 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=22621821 [1]: https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=22622069 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=22622069 [2]: https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=22622774 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=22622774
        dvt 7y ago
        No disrespect intended, but I don't get in debates with brand new anonymous HN accounts that have solely commented on threads that deal with the topic at hand.
        huanwin 7y ago
        A false exaggeration about me but an understandable policy. Thanks for giving me the benefit of the doubt regarding being a shill. Have a nice day.
- huanwin 7y ago
  Why are you looking to what you refer to as nonsense peddlers for evidence that there have been attacks? I actively avoid and dislike the media too, but that means I discount everything they say, not just the things I dislike. How about I provide some personal anecdata instead? My (Asian) parents -- who prefer Fox over CNN and vote right, in case anyone fears they're under the spell of frothing journalists -- have been more nervous about going about in public. My dad's car's mirror was smashed a couple nights ago. In a similar way that I'm not as deeply affected by the current economic environment as a low wage worker is, you're not as affected by the cultural perception as people like my family are. With that in mind, I ask that you acknowledge that such acts could very well be more common than the sensationalized ones that liberal media eagerly pounce upon, and thus more common than you personally might be aware of.

by daeken 7y ago

dvt 7y ago

> That's because it is. There have been many reports of harassment and assaults on Chinese Americans This is an extreme, uncited, and frankly inflammatory extrapolation. There have been only a handful of such attacks -- I believe 5-ish (reported by The New Yorker and CNN). It's just the typical race-baiting we've seen that generates outrage clicks. Calling it the "China Virus" has no more societal impact (which is: minor at best) than the "Spanish Flu." Really, it just strengthens my point about the nonsense the media is peddling, instead of asking the populace to remain calm, take precautions, and stay safe.

FireBeyond 7y ago
> There have been only a handful of such attacks How many are an acceptable number? Or tolerable number?
- XaoDaoCaoCao 7y ago
  You can't control every agent in the world. You literally have to have a tolerance for the existence of a few stupid ones.
  - munk-a 7y ago
    You can avoid stoking the flames and creating scapegoats. Just for reference when the Nazi party initially started to scapegoat Jewish and Romani people they used disease and hygiene concerns as an early way to paint people poorly and it's hellishly effective - blaming "mexicans taking jobs" is a pretty weak (relatively) scapegoating when compared to "mexican rapists" and trying to play to actors that may be causing a more personal harm. Painting the disease as being Chinese/Jewish/Romani is sort of the ultimate scapegoating - people feel personal pain from seeing sickness in their community and have no direct way to see that the attribution of that sickness to a people group is entirely bullsh. Dogwhistling for racism isn't an innocent action and deserves no understanding, it is hate filled and driven out of self-interest by those doing it.
    - dvt 7y ago
      > Just for reference when the Nazi party... This is an absolutely insane analogy -- not to mention grossly off-base. No one is scapegoating the Chinese people (or, even less so, Americans that happen to have Asian ancestry). Calling it the "Chinese Virus" simply points to its geographic source, i.e. Wuhan, China.
      - huanwin 7y ago
        > insane analogy Yeah, Godwin's Law strikes again. Not everything is literally Hitler. > This is an extreme, uncited, and frankly inflammatory extrapolation. There have been only a handful of such attacks -- I believe 5-ish (reported by The New Yorker and CNN).[0] So nobody is doing this? Or have there been incidents that you yourself have previously acknowledged? I tried civilly engaging in discourse with you earlier[1]. But now it seems like you're arguing with people just to argue, not to actually discuss these topics. Also, you can correct people who are mistaken about where it originated without saying "Chinese flu". E.g. "actually, the coronavirus originated in China". I remarked on this to another user who said they just wanted to stick to the facts about its origins.[2] If you're intent on making sure China is regarded as the source and/or culprit, you can emphasize further by adding something like, "and that's why the majority of cases and deaths from [coronavirus/covid-19] were in China. It started there." And that can be said perfectly fine without "Chinese virus". [0]: https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=22621821 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=22621821 [1]: https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=22622069 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=22622069 [2]: https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=22622774 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=22622774
        dvt 7y ago
        No disrespect intended, but I don't get in debates with brand new anonymous HN accounts that have solely commented on threads that deal with the topic at hand.
        huanwin 7y ago
        A false exaggeration about me but an understandable policy. Thanks for giving me the benefit of the doubt regarding being a shill. Have a nice day.
huanwin 7y ago
Why are you looking to what you refer to as nonsense peddlers for evidence that there have been attacks? I actively avoid and dislike the media too, but that means I discount everything they say, not just the things I dislike. How about I provide some personal anecdata instead? My (Asian) parents -- who prefer Fox over CNN and vote right, in case anyone fears they're under the spell of frothing journalists -- have been more nervous about going about in public. My dad's car's mirror was smashed a couple nights ago. In a similar way that I'm not as deeply affected by the current economic environment as a low wage worker is, you're not as affected by the cultural perception as people like my family are. With that in mind, I ask that you acknowledge that such acts could very well be more common than the sensationalized ones that liberal media eagerly pounce upon, and thus more common than you personally might be aware of.