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Our healthcare system is shit. Like. I don't care about what would happen to the economy if we took an action to fix this. We need to fix it.

gerland 7y ago
Belive me - it's not. There are not that many countries that have better health systems. I'm not saying yours is good, but the majority of them suck. If you look at the countries that have "better" systems, then try looking holistically. All of them are pretty much in a state of constant stagnation. They just suck up technological advancements from the US and most of theri effort goes to keeping those oveblown social utopias. In the mean time they still have to rely on cheap labor from overboard, often times completely uninsured.
- 616c 7y ago
  We are not a "believe me" kind of crowd last I checked. This is the kind of forum where many enjoy data and empiricism. Self-reflection on anecdata and personal bias is welcome as insightful when exploring data and interpretation. As someone who vaguely works in healthcare, I have asked for journals that compare information systems management for public healthcare systems of different countries with different approaches and measuring outcomes. Contractors and US agency employees alike in my limited experience cannot point me to any, and this is the domain I am interested in. I am sure it will count in this crisis and countless others. Do such periodicals exist? Anyone know? When people say US or country X has a sucky healthcare system even computer scientists don't seem to care for scientific measurement of policy and supporting IT systems to do that a high level (ie US Medicare and Medicaid, for a small example, don't run themselves).
  - gerland 7y ago
    Are we more of a "X is shit" crowd then? You cannot evaluate the health system based on the information management system itself. I would argue that you cannot evaluate HS on anything more than your anecdotal evidence. If you have a reliable model for HS then you pretty much have a model for the whole economy, since it's just so much intertwined. Last time I checked physics envy was still a thing. Deriving a functional model of HS from statistical data is a pipe dream since so much is based here on behaviour. I know that we have gone far with predicting behavours, but I would say that we are still not far enough. Also, I don't have any data to support it and I don't care.
beatgammit 7y ago
I think there are a ton of inefficiencies that could be fixed, but I don't think we need to risk destroying our economy to fix it. There are a lot of reasonable, incremental steps we can take. This is an older article[1] (2003), but I imagine the findings are only more relevant today. It compares the costs of the US healthcare system and Canada's, and there are huge discrepancies in price. Obviously the systems are very different, but I think we can trim the administration costs while keeping our privatized system. I'm not an expert, nor have I done a ton of research, but it seems that making costs transparent (and having instance pay advertised costs) would go a long way to cutting costs. Care providers do a lot of work to deal with insurance, so if we move that to insurance companies, they'll find ways to reduce their own costs and we can eliminate a lot of redundant jobs. Medical care providers should focus on medical care, insurance should focus on financial care, and individuals should shop for the best deal. Ideally, I only interact with my insurance when I need it, much like auto and home insurance. I don't tell my auto insurance every time I change the oil, so why do I do the same for health insurance and checkups? - [1] https://www.nejm.org/doi/full/10.1056/NEJMsa022033 https://www.nejm.org/doi/full/10.1056/NEJMsa022033

gerland 7y ago

Belive me - it's not. There are not that many countries that have better health systems. I'm not saying yours is good, but the majority of them suck. If you look at the countries that have "better" systems, then try looking holistically. All of them are pretty much in a state of constant stagnation. They just suck up technological advancements from the US and most of theri effort goes to keeping those oveblown social utopias. In the mean time they still have to rely on cheap labor from overboard, often times completely uninsured.

616c 7y ago
We are not a "believe me" kind of crowd last I checked. This is the kind of forum where many enjoy data and empiricism. Self-reflection on anecdata and personal bias is welcome as insightful when exploring data and interpretation. As someone who vaguely works in healthcare, I have asked for journals that compare information systems management for public healthcare systems of different countries with different approaches and measuring outcomes. Contractors and US agency employees alike in my limited experience cannot point me to any, and this is the domain I am interested in. I am sure it will count in this crisis and countless others. Do such periodicals exist? Anyone know? When people say US or country X has a sucky healthcare system even computer scientists don't seem to care for scientific measurement of policy and supporting IT systems to do that a high level (ie US Medicare and Medicaid, for a small example, don't run themselves).
- gerland 7y ago
  Are we more of a "X is shit" crowd then? You cannot evaluate the health system based on the information management system itself. I would argue that you cannot evaluate HS on anything more than your anecdotal evidence. If you have a reliable model for HS then you pretty much have a model for the whole economy, since it's just so much intertwined. Last time I checked physics envy was still a thing. Deriving a functional model of HS from statistical data is a pipe dream since so much is based here on behaviour. I know that we have gone far with predicting behavours, but I would say that we are still not far enough. Also, I don't have any data to support it and I don't care.

beatgammit 7y ago

I think there are a ton of inefficiencies that could be fixed, but I don't think we need to risk destroying our economy to fix it. There are a lot of reasonable, incremental steps we can take. This is an older article[1] (2003), but I imagine the findings are only more relevant today. It compares the costs of the US healthcare system and Canada's, and there are huge discrepancies in price. Obviously the systems are very different, but I think we can trim the administration costs while keeping our privatized system. I'm not an expert, nor have I done a ton of research, but it seems that making costs transparent (and having instance pay advertised costs) would go a long way to cutting costs. Care providers do a lot of work to deal with insurance, so if we move that to insurance companies, they'll find ways to reduce their own costs and we can eliminate a lot of redundant jobs. Medical care providers should focus on medical care, insurance should focus on financial care, and individuals should shop for the best deal. Ideally, I only interact with my insurance when I need it, much like auto and home insurance. I don't tell my auto insurance every time I change the oil, so why do I do the same for health insurance and checkups? - [1] https://www.nejm.org/doi/full/10.1056/NEJMsa022033 https://www.nejm.org/doi/full/10.1056/NEJMsa022033