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New coronavirus stable for hours on surfaces
- haydn3 7y agoAren't most viruses stable for hours on surfaces?
- davidw 7y agoYikes. Say you buy a box of cereal from the store... is there any good way to disinfect it, or just let it sit in the garage for a few days?
- krobbn 7y agoI don't think there is an easy way to disinfect it, maybe wipe it down with some lysol wipes if you have some. I guess your best bet is to just wash your hands thoroughly after going grocery shopping, and before and after eating.
- KCUOJJQJ 7y agoI'll only buy food that is in containers and clean the containers with a cloth with soapy water. Hopefully, soapy water is suitable. If I'm lucky I'll be able to get methylated spirit in the grocery store to make methylated spirit 70%. This concentration is mentioned in [1]. I could then fill up the empty bottles of surface disinfection spray that I've collected in the last year. [1] https://www.pphsn.net/Activities/PICNet/SECTION_7.pdf https://www.pphsn.net/Activities/PICNet/SECTION_7.pdf , page 101
- RL_Quine 7y agoWe've just be quarantining packages. They get shoveled into the garage and sit there for at least 3 days before opening. Seems like a pretty small convenience hit to stay safe.
- lliamander 7y agoWe quarantine packages as well, although I've read that the SARS2 only lasts for about an hour on cardboard.
- gautamnarula 7y agoI've seen 24 hours on cardboard[1] The best appears to be copper, which is 4 hours[1] which is why I bought some copper tape online and wrapped shared touch surfaces in my apartment with it (though be careful to avoid getting cuts when you grip it). 1. https://www.npr.org/sections/health-shots/2020/03/14/811609026/the-new-coronavirus-can-live-on-surfaces-for-2-3-days-heres-how-to-clean-them https://www.npr.org/sections/health-shots/2020/03/14/8116090...
- lliamander 7y agoAh, thanks for the info!
- pengaru 7y agoThings that can tolerate it without getting ruined/spoiled will sanitize much quicker in direct sunlight.
- noodlenotes 7y agoMost disinfectants only claim to work on hard, non-porous surfaces.
- sfj 7y agoI wonder how well sunlight works?
- _bxg1 7y agoI made one last trip to the grocery store on Friday. Wiped the handle and bottom of the cart, but I'm just crossing my fingers that the items I bought were safe. Included lots of individual fruits, so not really feasible to sterilize. I'm in Texas, so hopefully it wasn't prevalent enough yet. Not sure what I'll do when I have to make another trip in a couple weeks if we're still in quarantine.
- jennyyang 7y agowash the fruits with a little bit of dish soap, soap is enough to disrupt the virus.
- deleted 7y ago[deleted]
- KCUOJJQJ 7y ago>Not sure what I'll do when I have to make another trip in a couple weeks if we're still in quarantine. Maybe we can develop good ideas? What about these ideas: * Vitamin/mineral pills * fruit juice / pureed fruit/vegetables (for secondary plant substances) * Visiting the grocery store when few customers are there * Apply cream to your hands. I always wash my hands often. They can become dry and tiny wounds occur. If lemon juice hurts your hands then it's bad. Germs can get into the tiny wounds. * Additionally, wear plastic gloves.
- johntash 7y ago> * Visiting the grocery store when few customers are there This is becoming hard with a lot of grocery stores reducing their hours now. Our local store is only open 8-8 vs 24hours normally; I'd love to go around 10 or 11pm like we normally do.
- earthtourist 7y agoI've been: 1. Opening cereal/cracker/other boxes with gloves on, taking out the bag inside the box, and recycling the box. I figure the interior bag hasn't been touched in days, typically, if it was ever touched by human hands. 2. For other things, like bread, I've been moving the bread into clean ziploc bags. 3. Washing things like Apples and plastic milk jugs with soap and water. Feels pretty paranoid but seems to make sense right now.
- davidw 7y agoFor some reason lately, the title of that book keeps popping into my head: "Only the Paranoid Survive".
- zaaakk 7y agoSure, except the mortality rate is nowhere near 100% and you will likely acquire the virus or it’s descendants at some point unless you continue washing your cereal boxes forever.
- cecja 7y agoScared of a cereal box but running around in the same jeans for 2 weeks. Sorry but that kind of behaviour and even worse the proudly presenting it on the internet is double + retarded. It's not helping you and YOU (YES YOU) ARE CAUSING PANIC FOR PEOPLE. You are not helping. Disconnect your internet and stfu.
- deleted 7y ago[deleted]
- laurex 7y ago"Up to 24 hours on cardboard" - makes me wonder what the likelihood is of mail and package delivery being shut down soon?
- davidw 7y agoNot likely, as it's a lot easier to do some basics like take a temp of your delivery people at the beginning/end of their shifts. And there's only one person, so you could do some contact tracing if you were some kind of modern country - unlike those unable to test hardly anyone. So it seems a bit better than a free for all at the supermarket? I just got the mail, with gloves, and left it in the garage. Same thing with an Amazon package yesterday.
- scottlegrand2 7y agoYou're not the only one leaving stuff in the garage. but for some of the big-ticket items or food items I have doused the box in Lysol spray and let it sit for 10 minutes and then opened it. but I read somewhere that the half-life of this thing in direct sunlight is 2.5 minutes so after an hour or so it's pretty much gone if that's true.
- wool_gather 7y agoThis isn't new information except that it's being highlighted directly by the NIH, instead of news orgs reporting on the preprint. There also doesn't seem to be any attempt at reproduction so far. So, good information to have, but we can't take the numbers as literal and absolute -- more like a lower bound.
- creato 7y agoIt also isn't necessarily sufficient for the virus surviving on surfaces to be able to infect someone. If the virus needs to find its way into your lungs to infect you, and it is part of some surface matter that doesn't aerosolize easily, then the virus surviving on surfaces may not be able to actually infect people.
- isbjorn16 7y agoI don't know that aerosolize is the problem so much as people putting their booger hooks up around their mucus membranes around their face - after touching other surfaces, that is. (edited to add that bit, since that's the important part)
- prostheticvamp 7y agoPeople touch the surface, then their faces. Inhaled aerosols are not a significant component of how this virus spreads. Touched surfaces with viral films, and inhaled droplets, are.
- creato 7y agoThis is a direct contradiction to what the CDC has been saying from the beginning, and continues to say: > The virus is thought to spread mainly from person-to-person. > - Between people who are in close contact with one another (within about 6 feet). > - Through respiratory droplets produced when an infected person coughs or sneezes. > These droplets can land in the mouths or noses of people who are nearby or possibly be inhaled into the lungs. And: > It may be possible that a person can get COVID-19 by touching a surface or object that has the virus on it and then touching their own mouth, nose, or possibly their eyes, but this is not thought to be the main way the virus spreads. https://www.cdc.gov/coronavirus/2019-ncov/prepare/transmission.html https://www.cdc.gov/coronavirus/2019-ncov/prepare/transmissi...
- wila 7y agoUgh, this is the type of story that makes me want to run around with Purell or something similar and clean everything like Sheldon does. What if I touch my keyboard with dirty hands... it's not like I never type? Time to clean the mouse and keyboard ;)
- runawaybottle 7y agoWhat about Purell gloves? Would that be possible? We’d all sort of be cleaning everything everywhere if it was possible (the disinfectant would have be to be kind of dry or dry quickly, while still letting you grip).
- symplee 7y agoI thought about this too. Imagine a glove that had thousands of micro pores (like your skin) that would secrete a tiny droplet of Purell. But not enough to be wet. Just enough to create a layer of evaporating sanitizer between the glove and the surface. Possibly pressure activated so it's not secreting all the time.
- runawaybottle 7y agoAnd just to add to the brainstorm, just googled some ‘dry disinfectant spray’. Now I’m not saying make a full on Iron Man glove, but a pressure activated release of the spray could keep things dry. Plus we’d essentially be distributing the job of cleaning everything to everyone. Or maybe it’s finally time for self disinfecting door knobs/faucets/lights/buttons.
- PaulDavisThe1st 7y agoi trust that you're aware the soap is more effective and efficient at destroying the virus than alchohol at the concentrations found in e.g. Purell ?
- sundvor 7y ago... and smartphone.
- bb2018 7y agoDoes anyone have a good explanation for the statistics of these types of data. For instance, I've heard keep six feet away. However, I assume six feet is the distance where the chance of contracting is <0.1%, at five feet it is 1%, etc. etc. Nothing is black and white. Is the chance of contracting it from a surface meaningful? Or simply the equivalent to "it is possible to catch it from someone 15 feet away even if extremely slim"
- crispinb 7y agoI don't have stats or references, but I heard on a pretty reputable podcast a couple of days ago that physical contact appears to be the biggest single vector for SARS-CoV-2. Hence the huge emphasis on hand washing.
- arkitaip 7y agoAnd here I thought that hand washing was recommended like crazy to prevent people from getting the virus into their mouth, eyes and nose. The lack of accurate information is maddening.
- lutorm 7y agoI think that's what the grandparent is referring to: "physical contact" as opposed to "in aerosols". I don't think they meant actual physical contact with infected people.
- IAmGraydon 7y agoWhat makes you think that isn’t accurate?
- crispinb 7y agoYes - that's what I mean. Virus gets onto hands via touching objects & surfaces, and from there to face. Also (to be fair) if you want to increase your chances of getting accurate info you probably need to go to more credentialled sources than some random guy reporting on an unnamed podcast in an HN comment ;)
- 3D22611099 7y agoYikes this is horrifying. I'm currently quarantining a family member in my guest room, whom I don't know if they have a common cold or not. I'm wondering if just letting my ozone machine (5,000mg/hr) run after they're done in shared rooms, such as the bathroom etc. — unoccupied of course— would be enough to keep things sanitized. This is all incredibly stressing.
- empath75 7y agoRealistically, everyone in the house with an infected person is going to catch it. You’re breathing the same air if nothing else.
- aksss 7y agoDidn't some study recently say that in China a key practice for containment was removing infected family members from households and placing them in quarantine? I'm a little skeptical of self-isolating in a home with other people. You're all in it together at that point. I'm not sure "everyone in the house will catch it", but probably everyone will be exposed.
- freeqaz 7y agoCOVID-19 CDC guidelines recommend droplet precautions[0], which means that the disease doesn't spread via the air. It spreads via droplets when you cough/sneeze. It's still bad, but it does mean that sharing air isn't a hazard by default. If it was airborne, they would recommend different precautions[1]. [0]: https://www.who.int/csr/disease/coronavirus_infections/prevention_control/en/ https://www.who.int/csr/disease/coronavirus_infections/preve... [1]: http://www.wikidifference.com/difference-between-airborne-and-droplet-precautions/ http://www.wikidifference.com/difference-between-airborne-an...
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- swader999 7y agoYeah it spreads by breathing in air up to three hours. Read this study. Droplets as well. Washing hands is critical but so is proper mask that is fit.
- themantra514 7y ago254NM UVC light lamps might be a good solution for packaging. Make sure they are made by a reputable manufacturer, and that you get them from a reputable distributor that tests for proper maximum UVC efficiency.
- Frost1x 7y agoCurious, what's special about 254 nm? Is that a proven effective wavelength for killing bacteria/viruses for some reason? Was wondering if places like Amazon considered adding UV lamps into the process to reduce contamination potential.
- duskwuff 7y ago254 nm is the emission peak of a low-pressure mercury lamp. Anything in that range will have a germicidal effect, but this happens to be a cheap and effective way of generating UV.
- ericb 7y agoI'm curious about the intensity and length of time needed to break down viruses with this light. Just wondering if there's some a possibility to use a "light bomb" to sanitize a room--set a light on a pole in the middle of the room. Leave the room and close the door, then trigger it for some length of time. Just an idle musing I had.
- swader999 7y agoI've got that in my main furnace duct and with two portable air purifier/filter machines.
- kingpiss 7y agoI hope I get it soon just to get it over with.
- decebalus1 7y agoAnecdotal evidence shows that you can get reinfected.
- dpbriggs 7y agoThere's a couple ways that 'reinfection' could be reported right? - The test may have had a false negative - The viral load was low due to anti-virals, and subsequently re-surged once off them - The person has a compromised immune system and cannot form proper immunity.
- outworlder 7y agoSARS immunity was short-lived. Less than one year. Even in healthy individuals.
- dpbriggs 7y agoThat's unfortunate. I did not know that
- cecja 7y agoThere was no paper no study not even a report. It's just an urban legend. Today a chinese paper got released in which they tested it on 4 resos apes. After 28 days and a shot of the virus with a 10e6 viral load. Showed no reinfection. That's the only scientfic study we have right now.
- maximente 7y agoyou probably will, or already have. about half of Diamond Princess cruise ship passengers tested positive but were asymptomatic. edit: of course that could have been the latent period at the beginning - not saying they all /stayed/ asymptomatic, just that it may already have arrived.
- themark 7y ago"In the stability study the two viruses behaved similarly, which unfortunately fails to explain why COVID-19 has become a much larger outbreak." I am hoping that the similarity extends to SARS v1's sensitivity to temperature.
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- dillonmckay 7y agoHow much chlorine is required to kill it in water?
- outworlder 7y agohttps://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/15847934 https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/15847934
- dillonmckay 7y agoThat is SARS-CoV, not SARS-CoV-2. Anything newer than 15 years ago?
- koolba 7y ago> The scientists found that severe acute respiratory syndrome coronavirus 2 (SARS-CoV-2) was detectable in aerosols for up to three hours, up to four hours on copper, up to 24 hours on cardboard and up to two to three days on plastic and stainless steel. New rule is gonna be 48 hour quarantine for any packages.
- gautamnarula 7y agoI've started wrapping shared touch surfaces (doorknobs, handles, etc) in my apartment with copper tape. It's pretty cheap ($12 for 66ft on Amazon). You do need to be careful about gripping the surfaces though, because the sharp edges in the copper foil can cause small cuts which would actually make you more susceptible to viral infection.
- bamboozled 7y agoWhy not just spray it with some alcohol occasionally ? I think at some point we need to not make this an environmental disaster from over consumption of disposable items.
- voisin 7y agoI think he is kidding.
- bamboozled 7y agoWho would know anymore, the whole thing is getting rather silly, from hoarding food to toilet paper etc to wearing plastic bottles over your head. It's really starting to get a bit out of hand.
- DoreenMichele 7y agoThey may not be. Copper is antimicrobial and sometimes gets used in hospitals for things like railings because it helps prevent the spread of infection.
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- symplee 7y agoThere's a referenced journal article on the Coronavirus Wikipedia page [0] that says other coronaviruses can survive up to 9 days [1]. Can anyone corroborate? [0] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/2019%E2%80%9320_coronavirus_pandemic#Transmission https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/2019%E2%80%9320_coronavirus_pa... [1] https://www.journalofhospitalinfection.com/article/S0195-6701(20)30046-3/fulltext https://www.journalofhospitalinfection.com/article/S0195-670...
- antsoul 7y agoYour article [1] is more or less a review from what was known before Covid-19. It feels like a "worst case to expect". OP's article is really about Covid-19, having been tested on some specific surfaces.
- hajile 7y agoGovernment: cough into your elbow Also Government: elbow bump instead of handshake There seems to be a lot of contradicting stuff out there (and perhaps some "feel like you're doing something" stuff too). It'll take a lot of time before a consensus is actually reached.
- nokcha 7y agoContaminated hands are much more dangerous than contaminated elbows because people frequently touch their face with their hands.
- mrfusion 7y agoSomeone should really rethink the gas pump handle in light of recent events. Make it copper? Or how about a UV light shining on it when it’s hung up.
- rv-de 7y agoIn yesterday's update #15 on corona with Prof Christian Drosten [1] he is asked about this study and voices scepticism regarding its reliability. They publish a transcript for every episode. For this one it isn't available yet. Otherwise I'd c/p the section. 1: https://www.ndr.de/nachrichten/info/15-Infizierte-werden-offenbar-immun,audio654608.html https://www.ndr.de/nachrichten/info/15-Infizierte-werden-off...
- rv-de 7y agoit was covered in episode #14: https://www.ndr.de/nachrichten/info/coronaskript128.pdf https://www.ndr.de/nachrichten/info/coronaskript128.pdf (page 2 of 5)
- robodale 7y agoI have a chlorine-based swimming pool. Should I live on my swimming pool? (Yes, I'm being sarcastic from the amount of paranoid questions being asked here).
- serf 7y ago>(Yes, I'm being sarcastic from the amount of paranoid questions being asked here). to what purpose? to deride the cautious, or the panicked? What's paranoid at this stage? There's a virus that spreads rapidly killing people around the world. Do you have some guidelines for us un-informed to easily sift through the paranoia like you can? (now THAT is sarcasm)
- eyeball 7y agowould a few hours in the oven at 150 work to sanitize a package? (assuming the contents can tolerate that, and i don't burn down my house with the cardboard igniting)