4 ms·

The economy is going to get more broken each day this is affecting us, supply chains are going to break down, demand is going to sink, investment will grind to

The economy is going to get more broken each day this is affecting us, supply chains are going to break down, demand is going to sink, investment will grind to a halt. Huge amounts of wealth is going to be destroyed and people are going to suffer. Development is going to slow down further limiting our ability to respond to those problems. Meanwhile you are cheering for an emission rate blip and suggest it's worth hurting us even further ? That's going to do what exactly ? I'm surprised at how regressive the popular opinion is around here - I wouldn't expect it from people who are in the filed of problem solving with technology.

Fricken 7y ago
The consequences of not responding proactively to the environmental crisis is orders of magnitude more serious than the pandemic. I can't think of anything more regressive than willfully destroying the planet.
- rubber_duck 7y ago
  What does that mean ? Are you saying that the climate change issue is going to be fixed if we slow down emission rampup over the next year ? Mind sharing that analysis ? I don't think you realise how bad things are going to get as this panic drags on, think unemployment and poverty waves 2008 levels. I'm not saying climate change is irrelevant - I'm saying proposing to slow down economic activity to reduce emissions has no quantifiable or tangible benefit - it's basically wishful thinking - and the downsides are going to be very harsh
  - Fricken 7y ago
    I think you're measuring how bad things are relative to what is considered normal. Relative to normal, absolutely, the pandemic is terrible. I'm measuring how bad things are relative to how rightly fucked things can be, and climate change offers up a whole wenu of awesome things. Widespread crop failures, Ecosystem collapse, Food supply shortages, violent uprisings, Mass human migrations, Famines, the collapse of the global supply chain and upheavals in the global balance of power. How bad can it get, and when? I don't know exactly but 2020 is off to a very exciting start. 2 months ago The pandemic felt unreal to North America, even though the warnings were easy to read. Now it's real, and hopefully it's waking us up, as people, as governments, and as businesses as to how quickly, suddenly, and shockingly the unreal can become real. And I agree with you, the economic fallout is going to be terrible. There are many things to worry about, and one of the things I worry about is that thousands of small businesses are going to go under, and their employees, who are often young and living paycheck to paycheck won't have a job to go back to after this blows over. If this pandemic causes an economic heart attack, I'll see it like a middle aged guy keeling over trying to climb 2 flights of stairs. As in: hopefully that heart attack will scare you into a greater appreciation for taking care of yourself, and it is in fact a blessing in disguise. Or maybe all those businesses will go under and Gen-Z will have to work at the Amazon warehouses until they're 30. Difficult choices need to be made.
    - rubber_duck 7y ago
      >Widespread crop failures, Ecosystem collapse, Food supply shortages, violent uprisings, Mass human migrations, Famines, the collapse of the global supply chain and upheavals in the global balance of power. The reason I see the above solutions as regressive is because I believe these things have a high probability of occurring irregardless of emission control at this point. But the timeframe is longer - we're better off trying to prepare for the outcome of those scenarios - and technology is going to be a key component. If technological development collapses as a result of an economic collapse we are going to be majorly screwed emissions or not. Also I think the "reduce emissions" crowd is sucking all the air out in the discussion about handling climate change. Climate change is just one of the risk factor our society faces in this new era - viral infection spread, nuclear disasters, etc. society right now is very fragile and humans have a huge influence on our environment for the first time in history - the society must adapt and hoping things will go back to the good old days if we just stop doing things is very narrow-minded

Fricken 7y ago

The consequences of not responding proactively to the environmental crisis is orders of magnitude more serious than the pandemic. I can't think of anything more regressive than willfully destroying the planet.

rubber_duck 7y ago
What does that mean ? Are you saying that the climate change issue is going to be fixed if we slow down emission rampup over the next year ? Mind sharing that analysis ? I don't think you realise how bad things are going to get as this panic drags on, think unemployment and poverty waves 2008 levels. I'm not saying climate change is irrelevant - I'm saying proposing to slow down economic activity to reduce emissions has no quantifiable or tangible benefit - it's basically wishful thinking - and the downsides are going to be very harsh
- Fricken 7y ago
  I think you're measuring how bad things are relative to what is considered normal. Relative to normal, absolutely, the pandemic is terrible. I'm measuring how bad things are relative to how rightly fucked things can be, and climate change offers up a whole wenu of awesome things. Widespread crop failures, Ecosystem collapse, Food supply shortages, violent uprisings, Mass human migrations, Famines, the collapse of the global supply chain and upheavals in the global balance of power. How bad can it get, and when? I don't know exactly but 2020 is off to a very exciting start. 2 months ago The pandemic felt unreal to North America, even though the warnings were easy to read. Now it's real, and hopefully it's waking us up, as people, as governments, and as businesses as to how quickly, suddenly, and shockingly the unreal can become real. And I agree with you, the economic fallout is going to be terrible. There are many things to worry about, and one of the things I worry about is that thousands of small businesses are going to go under, and their employees, who are often young and living paycheck to paycheck won't have a job to go back to after this blows over. If this pandemic causes an economic heart attack, I'll see it like a middle aged guy keeling over trying to climb 2 flights of stairs. As in: hopefully that heart attack will scare you into a greater appreciation for taking care of yourself, and it is in fact a blessing in disguise. Or maybe all those businesses will go under and Gen-Z will have to work at the Amazon warehouses until they're 30. Difficult choices need to be made.
  - rubber_duck 7y ago
    >Widespread crop failures, Ecosystem collapse, Food supply shortages, violent uprisings, Mass human migrations, Famines, the collapse of the global supply chain and upheavals in the global balance of power. The reason I see the above solutions as regressive is because I believe these things have a high probability of occurring irregardless of emission control at this point. But the timeframe is longer - we're better off trying to prepare for the outcome of those scenarios - and technology is going to be a key component. If technological development collapses as a result of an economic collapse we are going to be majorly screwed emissions or not. Also I think the "reduce emissions" crowd is sucking all the air out in the discussion about handling climate change. Climate change is just one of the risk factor our society faces in this new era - viral infection spread, nuclear disasters, etc. society right now is very fragile and humans have a huge influence on our environment for the first time in history - the society must adapt and hoping things will go back to the good old days if we just stop doing things is very narrow-minded