6 ms·

Glad I clicked this. It’s been a rough ride for many and its getting rougher for many more. We’re gonna need all the best of humanity we can get.

nikofeyn 7y ago
i don't mean to be pessimistic, but my worry is that after this is "over", everyone will go on and on about how it's the best of humanity that got us through this. but in reality, it's the worst of humanity that caused this and our under-preparedness. we should really look inward and say "we can do and could have done better" and not pat ourselves on the back too much. our over-population and further encroachment on wildlife will further increase chances of zoonotic disease spread, on top of all the other problems of climate change, socioeconomic inequality, repercussions of sudden disasters both human and natural, etc. we have got to start taking our place on this planet seriously and not as a privilege and also not over-congratulating ourselves when we scrape by once again. we cannot continue to ignore people saying, with mountains of evidence, that events will happen. and we cannot sustain growth at all costs economies and policies. but your point is good. we gotta get through this first and maintain a sense of calm and hope. but we really have got to take a step back and re-evaluate when this passes in whatever form it does.
- goatherders 7y ago
  Settle down. "The worst of humanity caused this?" It's a virus and our medical system has limits. Shit happens. We react and (hopefully) come out well on the other side. You say overpopulation is a problem? Fine. Give me a practical and ethical solution. You say encroachment on wildlife? Ok, fine. Please provide a practical and ethical solution. We, as people, live on this planet. By and large people are doing the best they can. Should we do more for the environment? Of course. But suggesting that disease as a result of overpopulation is our fault without offering a practical solution adds nothing to the dialog.
  - nikofeyn 7y ago
    > Settle down. ... It's a virus and our medical system has limits. Shit happens. We react and (hopefully) come out well on the other side. so your response is to just throw our hands up in the air and say "shit happens"? how is that productive in any way? that's exactly how we got here. this article is a good read: http://nautil.us/issue/83/intelligence/the-man-who-saw-the-pandemic-coming http://nautil.us/issue/83/intelligence/the-man-who-saw-the-p... just because there are viruses existing in the world doesn't mean we should be cavalier with them. over-population and our encroachment on wildlife is what's leading to the increasing rate of transfers of zoonotic viruses. > You say overpopulation is a problem? Fine. Give me a practical and ethical solution. > You say encroachment on wildlife? Ok, fine. Please provide a practical and ethical solution. you seem to imply that there is literally no point in talking about these problems? as if we couldn't possibly come up with practical and ethical solutions? it isn't an argument to say "unless you have a detailed solution at this moment then the problem isn't a problem". a problem without a solution is still a problem. your argument is petulant. > But suggesting that disease as a result of overpopulation is our fault without offering a practical solution adds nothing to the dialog. it's not my suggestion. it's experts' conclusions based strongly upon evidence. it does further the dialog. viruses of this nature, and other issues facing humanity, have happened and will continue to happen at increasing rates. there is no need to have such a huge human population other than narcissism and selfishness. there is no need to eat certain animals. there are not a lot of reasons for much of the stuff we do other than we do it because we can. (however, a lot of interactions with animals with increase naturally simply due to our expansion into their habitat.) how in the world does it further the dialog to say shit happens and we live on this planet and do our best?
    - goatherders 7y ago
      I'll say it again: offer a practical solution and I'll listen. I certainly am not burying my head in the sand and I recognize we as a species have expedited these issues. Point granted. But tell me what's next? Dont link to articles from academics and theoretical posits. Tell me what we actually DO without mandated birth control, resource allowance/ration... I get that we are part of the problem. But that's going to happen again. We can be aggravated that the ignorant population wont get in line or we can talk actual practical solutions. I'm game for a dialog. You go first.

nikofeyn 7y ago

i don't mean to be pessimistic, but my worry is that after this is "over", everyone will go on and on about how it's the best of humanity that got us through this. but in reality, it's the worst of humanity that caused this and our under-preparedness. we should really look inward and say "we can do and could have done better" and not pat ourselves on the back too much. our over-population and further encroachment on wildlife will further increase chances of zoonotic disease spread, on top of all the other problems of climate change, socioeconomic inequality, repercussions of sudden disasters both human and natural, etc. we have got to start taking our place on this planet seriously and not as a privilege and also not over-congratulating ourselves when we scrape by once again. we cannot continue to ignore people saying, with mountains of evidence, that events will happen. and we cannot sustain growth at all costs economies and policies. but your point is good. we gotta get through this first and maintain a sense of calm and hope. but we really have got to take a step back and re-evaluate when this passes in whatever form it does.

goatherders 7y ago
Settle down. "The worst of humanity caused this?" It's a virus and our medical system has limits. Shit happens. We react and (hopefully) come out well on the other side. You say overpopulation is a problem? Fine. Give me a practical and ethical solution. You say encroachment on wildlife? Ok, fine. Please provide a practical and ethical solution. We, as people, live on this planet. By and large people are doing the best they can. Should we do more for the environment? Of course. But suggesting that disease as a result of overpopulation is our fault without offering a practical solution adds nothing to the dialog.
- nikofeyn 7y ago
  > Settle down. ... It's a virus and our medical system has limits. Shit happens. We react and (hopefully) come out well on the other side. so your response is to just throw our hands up in the air and say "shit happens"? how is that productive in any way? that's exactly how we got here. this article is a good read: http://nautil.us/issue/83/intelligence/the-man-who-saw-the-pandemic-coming http://nautil.us/issue/83/intelligence/the-man-who-saw-the-p... just because there are viruses existing in the world doesn't mean we should be cavalier with them. over-population and our encroachment on wildlife is what's leading to the increasing rate of transfers of zoonotic viruses. > You say overpopulation is a problem? Fine. Give me a practical and ethical solution. > You say encroachment on wildlife? Ok, fine. Please provide a practical and ethical solution. you seem to imply that there is literally no point in talking about these problems? as if we couldn't possibly come up with practical and ethical solutions? it isn't an argument to say "unless you have a detailed solution at this moment then the problem isn't a problem". a problem without a solution is still a problem. your argument is petulant. > But suggesting that disease as a result of overpopulation is our fault without offering a practical solution adds nothing to the dialog. it's not my suggestion. it's experts' conclusions based strongly upon evidence. it does further the dialog. viruses of this nature, and other issues facing humanity, have happened and will continue to happen at increasing rates. there is no need to have such a huge human population other than narcissism and selfishness. there is no need to eat certain animals. there are not a lot of reasons for much of the stuff we do other than we do it because we can. (however, a lot of interactions with animals with increase naturally simply due to our expansion into their habitat.) how in the world does it further the dialog to say shit happens and we live on this planet and do our best?
  - goatherders 7y ago
    I'll say it again: offer a practical solution and I'll listen. I certainly am not burying my head in the sand and I recognize we as a species have expedited these issues. Point granted. But tell me what's next? Dont link to articles from academics and theoretical posits. Tell me what we actually DO without mandated birth control, resource allowance/ration... I get that we are part of the problem. But that's going to happen again. We can be aggravated that the ignorant population wont get in line or we can talk actual practical solutions. I'm game for a dialog. You go first.