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Yes. Also, first home owner's grants increased prices. Reduced interest rates increased house prices. Perhaps the great covid-19 WFH experiment will (partially)

Yes. Also, first home owner's grants increased prices. Reduced interest rates increased house prices. Perhaps the great covid-19 WFH experiment will (partially) undermine the housing geography monopoly. Would socialist free housing, utilities, food, medical care, education might work better than UBI? What incentives would make capitalism provide them?

Fjolsvith 7y ago
Capitalism can't provide housing, utilities, food, medical care and education for free. People would just quit their job if they got all that with no effort. Then how would the government be able to pay for the free stuff if it wasn't able to tax workers? Edit: It occurred to me the government could lock people up in work camps in order to be able to tax them.
- boomboomsubban 7y ago
  >Edit: It occurred to me the government could lock people up in work camps in order to be able to tax them So people end up in a situation where they are forced to work in order to survive, the same situation they are in now.
  - Fjolsvith 7y ago
    Ah, but in Capitalism, they can choose not to work.
    - boomboomsubban 7y ago
      You could have the choice to refuse the UBI and end up in a similar position to homeless today, though most homeless did not make a choice not to work.
      - Fjolsvith 7y ago
        But, could you choose to not be one of the taxpayers to fund UBI? I say if you want to do UBI, add a checkbox on the tax return where a person can choose to donate $1000 to the UBI program out of their tax refund. Let the UBI recipients all have an equal share of the funds collected from that checkbox.
        boomboomsubban 7y ago
        If you don't make any income, you aren't paying for it. You can have your issues with UBI, but "the government could force you to work to pay taxes" isn't any scarier than the current situation, where not working can just kill you. Your opt in situation couldn't be considered UBI.
        Fjolsvith 7y ago
        Then why should I have to pay $1000 in taxes to get $1000 UBI?
- cycomanic 7y ago
  > Capitalism can't provide housing, utilities, food, medical care and education for free. > People would just quit their job if they got all that with no effort. Citation needed. All previous experiments on ubi have shown the opposite. You are just painting a boogeyman, without evidence to back it up.
  - hyperpallium 7y ago
    People still work in countries with free medical care and education. I think the effect on motivation is the central issue of UBI. There might need to be an adjustment. I know for myself, it can be helpful to be compelled to do something that I've been putting off. Sometimes, people don't feel they have a reason to act, but having to go to work can help. It prevents inactivity and isolation. Perhaps a focus on mental health and intrinsic motivation will be the answer. But I think most will naturally aim at higher goals than survival... as they do now.
  - Fjolsvith 7y ago
    I was talking about the list of Socialistic welfare handouts the parent said should be free, not UBI.

Fjolsvith 7y ago

Capitalism can't provide housing, utilities, food, medical care and education for free. People would just quit their job if they got all that with no effort. Then how would the government be able to pay for the free stuff if it wasn't able to tax workers? Edit: It occurred to me the government could lock people up in work camps in order to be able to tax them.

boomboomsubban 7y ago
>Edit: It occurred to me the government could lock people up in work camps in order to be able to tax them So people end up in a situation where they are forced to work in order to survive, the same situation they are in now.
- Fjolsvith 7y ago
  Ah, but in Capitalism, they can choose not to work.
  - boomboomsubban 7y ago
    You could have the choice to refuse the UBI and end up in a similar position to homeless today, though most homeless did not make a choice not to work.
    - Fjolsvith 7y ago
      But, could you choose to not be one of the taxpayers to fund UBI? I say if you want to do UBI, add a checkbox on the tax return where a person can choose to donate $1000 to the UBI program out of their tax refund. Let the UBI recipients all have an equal share of the funds collected from that checkbox.
      - boomboomsubban 7y ago
        If you don't make any income, you aren't paying for it. You can have your issues with UBI, but "the government could force you to work to pay taxes" isn't any scarier than the current situation, where not working can just kill you. Your opt in situation couldn't be considered UBI.
        Fjolsvith 7y ago
        Then why should I have to pay $1000 in taxes to get $1000 UBI?
cycomanic 7y ago
> Capitalism can't provide housing, utilities, food, medical care and education for free. > People would just quit their job if they got all that with no effort. Citation needed. All previous experiments on ubi have shown the opposite. You are just painting a boogeyman, without evidence to back it up.
- hyperpallium 7y ago
  People still work in countries with free medical care and education. I think the effect on motivation is the central issue of UBI. There might need to be an adjustment. I know for myself, it can be helpful to be compelled to do something that I've been putting off. Sometimes, people don't feel they have a reason to act, but having to go to work can help. It prevents inactivity and isolation. Perhaps a focus on mental health and intrinsic motivation will be the answer. But I think most will naturally aim at higher goals than survival... as they do now.
- Fjolsvith 7y ago
  I was talking about the list of Socialistic welfare handouts the parent said should be free, not UBI.