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Pet peeve of mine: as I understand it Discord labels each of its communities as "servers". That's why you've probably encountered youngins calling subreddits or

by simias 7y ago

Pet peeve of mine: as I understand it Discord labels each of its communities as "servers". That's why you've probably encountered youngins calling subreddits or group chats "servers" lately. That's obviously a misnomer since it's not like they're technically independent servers (as showcased by this crash). It's just vocabulary but for somebody like me who still hangs onto IRC even though it's been almost entirely displaced by proprietary and centralized solutions like Discord it really feels like they're rubbing it in. Just co-opting decentralized lingo with none of the actual features.

anaphor 7y ago
It might be a nod towards the terminology that Erlang/OTP uses, i.e. "gen_server". Discord is built on Elixir IIRC. http://erlang.org/documentation/doc-4.9.1/doc/design_principles/gen_server.html http://erlang.org/documentation/doc-4.9.1/doc/design_princip...
- chasers 7y ago
  And I think I read that each ‘server’ gen_server lives on one actual server.
  - floatboth 7y ago
    No, you can run thousands of gen_servers in one VM instance. This is like calling unix processes that listen on ports "servers", which is pretty common.
wgerard 7y ago
Wait until you see what Discord calls servers internally :) [0] Jokes aside, I don't think there's anything about the term "server" that implies independence. I can think of many centralized access points that are called "servers" but aren't independent. Hell, even racks aren't necessarily independent. I get what you're saying, but the term "server" can be pretty vaguely applied. 0: https://discordapp.com/developers/docs/resources/guild https://discordapp.com/developers/docs/resources/guild
- heymijo 7y ago
  > * I don't think there's anything about the term "server" that implies independence.* Communication is perception. Simian above, and myself grew up in an era where a server did indeed imply independence. Counterstrike servers, IRC servers, FTP servers, all independent things in these contexts. For others the perception may be different as I assume it is with anyone young who primarily encounters the word server in their Discord use.
  - wgerard 7y ago
    But that's kinda my point: CS servers weren't really independent. If Valve/Steam/VAC/etc. stopped working, CS servers were all down effectively.
    - sho_hn 7y ago
      And yet I'm convinced Discord chose this naming because it implies independence. It sounds a lot cooler to say "We got our own server" than "We started our own guild".
      - Wowfunhappy 7y ago
        Eh, I think they chose it because of the history of Minecraft, CS:GO, WOW, etc servers. Remember that Discord is intended for gaming.
      - tylerl 7y ago
        Discord replaced ventrillo and teamspeak for gaming communities. For those you actually ran a "server". Whether or not the company started out calling these accounts "servers" initially, that customer base sure did. It was the terminology customers were used to. They neither knew nor cared what the technical aspects were of having a separate server; it just what you called that thing that the team used to communicate.
        sho_hn 7y ago
cbdumas 7y ago
This is speculation, but I believe this is a vestige of when voice chat applications widely used by PC gamers like TeamSpeak and Ventrilo did actually rely on independent servers, usually paid for and administered by individuals (or guilds/clans). Back in the bad old days if you wanted to voice chat you had to know someone who could invite you to join a "server" (or set one up yourself), and I think the verbiage just kind of stuck.
- meowface 7y ago
  Correct, this is the origin of the term. Before cloud services like Discord, people had to set up servers specifically to run TeamSpeak, Ventrilo, or Mumble. Discord has now largely/almost entirely replaced those applications, and it's just a vestige like "roll down the window". The internal term of "guild" is more accurate, but no users actually call them that.
  - thaumasiotes 7y ago
    > it's just a vestige like "roll down the window" Not to disagree, but I don't really see how the old rotary handles suggested the term "roll down the window" either. What was rolling? If I were supposed to describe the old way without knowing an existing word for it, I'd say "crank" was the closest option.
    - deleted 7y ago
      [deleted]
    - catalogia 7y ago
      I never thought of it before, but it's interesting that building windows with hand cranks aren't "rolled open."
    - meowface 7y ago
      True, it wasn't "rolling" in the sense of the physical action you performed or even what the crank did, but the crank did move in a circular motion, and things that roll also move in a circular motion, so it makes a little bit of sense, even if it's not really rolling. Not sure why that term stuck.
BolexNOLA 7y ago
It’s because back in the day we actually did rely on our friends hosting servers when we used programs like ventrillo.

by simias 7y ago

anaphor 7y ago

It might be a nod towards the terminology that Erlang/OTP uses, i.e. "gen_server". Discord is built on Elixir IIRC. http://erlang.org/documentation/doc-4.9.1/doc/design_principles/gen_server.html http://erlang.org/documentation/doc-4.9.1/doc/design_princip...

chasers 7y ago
And I think I read that each ‘server’ gen_server lives on one actual server.
- floatboth 7y ago
  No, you can run thousands of gen_servers in one VM instance. This is like calling unix processes that listen on ports "servers", which is pretty common.

wgerard 7y ago

Wait until you see what Discord calls servers internally :) [0] Jokes aside, I don't think there's anything about the term "server" that implies independence. I can think of many centralized access points that are called "servers" but aren't independent. Hell, even racks aren't necessarily independent. I get what you're saying, but the term "server" can be pretty vaguely applied. 0: https://discordapp.com/developers/docs/resources/guild https://discordapp.com/developers/docs/resources/guild

heymijo 7y ago
> * I don't think there's anything about the term "server" that implies independence.* Communication is perception. Simian above, and myself grew up in an era where a server did indeed imply independence. Counterstrike servers, IRC servers, FTP servers, all independent things in these contexts. For others the perception may be different as I assume it is with anyone young who primarily encounters the word server in their Discord use.
- wgerard 7y ago
  But that's kinda my point: CS servers weren't really independent. If Valve/Steam/VAC/etc. stopped working, CS servers were all down effectively.
  - sho_hn 7y ago
    And yet I'm convinced Discord chose this naming because it implies independence. It sounds a lot cooler to say "We got our own server" than "We started our own guild".
    - Wowfunhappy 7y ago
      Eh, I think they chose it because of the history of Minecraft, CS:GO, WOW, etc servers. Remember that Discord is intended for gaming.
    - tylerl 7y ago
      Discord replaced ventrillo and teamspeak for gaming communities. For those you actually ran a "server". Whether or not the company started out calling these accounts "servers" initially, that customer base sure did. It was the terminology customers were used to. They neither knew nor cared what the technical aspects were of having a separate server; it just what you called that thing that the team used to communicate.
      - sho_hn 7y ago

cbdumas 7y ago

This is speculation, but I believe this is a vestige of when voice chat applications widely used by PC gamers like TeamSpeak and Ventrilo did actually rely on independent servers, usually paid for and administered by individuals (or guilds/clans). Back in the bad old days if you wanted to voice chat you had to know someone who could invite you to join a "server" (or set one up yourself), and I think the verbiage just kind of stuck.

meowface 7y ago
Correct, this is the origin of the term. Before cloud services like Discord, people had to set up servers specifically to run TeamSpeak, Ventrilo, or Mumble. Discord has now largely/almost entirely replaced those applications, and it's just a vestige like "roll down the window". The internal term of "guild" is more accurate, but no users actually call them that.
- thaumasiotes 7y ago
  > it's just a vestige like "roll down the window" Not to disagree, but I don't really see how the old rotary handles suggested the term "roll down the window" either. What was rolling? If I were supposed to describe the old way without knowing an existing word for it, I'd say "crank" was the closest option.
  - deleted 7y ago
    [deleted]
  - catalogia 7y ago
    I never thought of it before, but it's interesting that building windows with hand cranks aren't "rolled open."
  - meowface 7y ago
    True, it wasn't "rolling" in the sense of the physical action you performed or even what the crank did, but the crank did move in a circular motion, and things that roll also move in a circular motion, so it makes a little bit of sense, even if it's not really rolling. Not sure why that term stuck.

BolexNOLA 7y ago

It’s because back in the day we actually did rely on our friends hosting servers when we used programs like ventrillo.