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This is how I feel, precisely. There are real, human consequences to these price increasing theories. It will be felt by people who are, by a large margin, no
by EdgarVerona 7y ago
This is how I feel, precisely. There are real, human consequences to these price increasing theories. It will be felt by people who are, by a large margin, not the target audience of Hacker News. It'll be felt by people who have to choose between having basic healthcare supplies and paying rent, or eating.
Indeed, at that point I think rationing - either by the companies selling the product, or by the government (as we have done in times of crisis in the past) is in order. Would people be yelling about free markets like this if World War 2 happened today, and there was the kind of rationing we saw in those times? What would have happened to our country if people were so selfish back then?
- gwright 7y agoLetting the price float is the fastest way to discourage the hoarders and let the market come back to a sane equilibrium. By not allowing the price to float you can see that the result is empty shelves. The empty shelf is also a "real, human consequence".
- salawat 7y agoThe price float shouldn't happen. Furthermore, an alternative measure, social ostracization/legal pressure is being employed to remedy the situation. Existence is not the Market, and the Market does not take place in a void. You cannot reduce the world to a bunch of economic models, because at the end of the day, people will get tired of your Quant's BS and do something that generally doesn't end well for the person who ignores human nature.
- gwright 7y agoThe price float did not happen and what was the result? Empty shelves. Is that a satisfactory outcome from your standpoint?
- salawat 7y agoYes. Restocks will happen as quickly as possible, purchase limits will be put in place, and availability will be restored. Also, the privations created were entirely the results of these folks' poor behavior in terms of weighing the risks inherent to the logistics of their price gouging, and whether or not their sales platform would facilitate that behavior. Mayhaps they'd be well served returning their stock to the locations that actually have a local need for it seeing as otherwise, they'll have nuked the Market in their localities via a glut of supply. Their sacrifice in financially eating the cost of the extra relocation will undoubtedly weigh in on whether or not State's Attorneys General pursue prosecution, and to what degree. As a bonus, we all have a series of examples of what not to be that have soared into the limelight to remind us all that even if we are stuck in a pandemic, at least we weren't horrible enough to have to figure out what to do with more stock than we can feasibly sell or distribute for more than it cost to consolidate it into a single location because we were intending to pull one over on everyone else. Win/win. Supply goes home. Everyone reminded not to be a dick, and a few people have learned a very valuable lesson about logistics, society, the economy, and what not to do during an international fucking pandemic. Maybe no one else has to deal with the damage caused by asshole speculators.
- gwright 7y agoBut if the price floated the empty shelf situation would have been mitigated.
- UncleMeat 7y agoBut also a lot of people wouldn't be able to access supplies. In both cases a lot of people get screwed. In the "floating price" case it just isn't highly paid software engineers on HN.
- gwright 7y agoSo you prefer no one to have access to the items at any price (empty shelves), rather than a limited supply being available at a higher price? Why do you prefer that? Why do you think that individuals have no ability to adjust their personal spending such that they can purchase TP or hand sanitizer even at 2x, 3x or even 5x price points.
- cheerlessbog 7y agoOr just enforce limits and price increases and we all have TP.
- pdeuchler 7y agoThe recent spate of people worried about "empty shelves" is kind of funny to me, it's essentially admitting to the world that you have no idea how the world works and the smallest disruption to your daily bubble is rocking your world. The shelves are getting fully restocked every single morning. Go to your local Target/Walmart/Grocery store when they open if you don't believe me. Stores, suppliers, and producers have already begun rationing and metering out goods onto shelves explicitly because of people hoarding. The shelves being empty are a result of idiots running around trying to buy up everything they can, and stores reacting properly. The "free market" is already acting in response to those hoarders, they're discouraging it, and preventing it on a grand scale pretty effectively. Your complaint about "not allowing the price to float" is a complete non sequitur even if you're still the type to swallow free market ideology hook, line, sinker, because people buying in surplus isn't demand. It's just, well, hoarding. Coronavirus isn't going to cause people to be thirstier, hungrier, or need to wipe their ass more. People are just buying in advance. Without people fearing for a worldwide pandemic nobody would be willing to pay increased prices for these goods. So it's not actually about demand, it's about artificial scarcity driven by a global pandemic. Thus, price gouging tickets. But even if you don't buy any of that, the vast majority of our supply lines are JIT, so "empty shelves" aren't really a thing... what we'd really see is a dwindling of supply over a period of time. Which isn't happening.
- gwright 7y ago> people buying in surplus isn't demand. It's just, well, hoarding Of course it is demand. You may also call it "hoarding" those aren't mutually exclusive concepts.