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That's kind of standard with DOCSIS. You can't have a lot of upload speed due to the available bandwidth for upload channels.

coryrc 7y ago
The balance of upload and download is configurable.
- lawnchair_larry 7y ago
  Not if you already have a legacy cable television network it isn’t.
- milankragujevic 7y ago
  Yes, by lowering the download speed, at least on DOCSIS 3.0. DOCSIS 3.0 supports up to 8 upload channels for a total speed of 216 Mbps (on 6.4 MHz per channel). That's shared for all users on the CMTS, which could be a lot, depending on the setup. For comparison, on EuroDOCSIS 3.0, with 32 channels the total download speed is 1600 Mbps for all users, and on DOCSIS 3.0 it's 1216 Mbps. DOCSIS 3.1 allows for multiple OFDMA upload channels which can allow for up to 2 Gbps shared upload speed capacity, and DOCSIS 4.0 allows for symmetric 10/10 Gbps shared capacity with an undefined split DS:US (you can have the same number of channels). It uses extended RF spectrum in the cable and also needs new amplifiers and splitters.
  - AnthonyMouse 7y ago
    > Yes, by lowering the download speed, at least on DOCSIS 3.0. Which would imply that they should be able to offer a 100/100 connection for the same price as a 200/6 connection and have 6Mbps to spare.
    - milankragujevic 7y ago
      No, the maximum upload is fixed and independent of the download speed. I meant they can offer 6/6 Mbps, or 12/6 Mbps, for a 1:1 or 2:1 ratio. Basically as a joke.
      - AnthonyMouse 7y ago
        Even DOCSIS 3.0 supports up to 124 Mbps upload speeds using 4 channels: https://www.multicominc.com/training/technical-resources/docsis-3-0/ https://www.multicominc.com/training/technical-resources/doc... (Other sources quote it as 200Mbps? But either is a whole lot more than 6.)
        milankragujevic 7y ago
        As I have said here: https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=22572536 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=22572536 , DOCSIS 3.0 supports 216 Mbps usable upload capacity with 8 upstream channels, halved to 108 Mbps with 4 upstream channels. That speed is, however, shared with ALL users on a CMTS, which could be dozens or a hundred, since the coaxial infrastructure is based on a shared medium where all devices connect to one physical cable that leads to the CMTS and share the available RF bandwidth. You could sell 1 user 100 Mbps upload with 4 channels, and have one user on a CMTS. You can also sell 6 Mbps upload to 36 users, guaranteeing them 100% of the capacity, or to 72 users, guaranteeing them 50% of the capacity. It is not feasible to sell packages with more than 50 Mbps upload on most coaxial networks (even HFC, if there are many users, i.e. more than one apartment building connected to a node) as users will not be able to use the full capacity, and the speed will inevitably drop to the sub-10 Mbps level, but the user will be unsatisfied as they are paying for and expecting higher speeds.
        deleted 7y ago
        [deleted]
        AnthonyMouse 7y ago
        The maximum download speed for DOCSIS 3.0 is 1216 Mbps, and that's only if you use 32 channels. If you were selling 200/6 connections to 72 users then you would be only guaranteeing them each ~8% of the download capacity (and yet 50% of the upload capacity, using 8 upstream channels). To have the same level of oversubscription for upload as download, you would give them all 35Mbps upload with the 200Mbps download. But you don't even have to do that, because who says they all need the same plan? Sell a quarter of them 100Mbps up connections and the others still get 17Mbps up. No way to justify why it should only be 6 up if it can be 200 down. (And if they're offering 200Mbps down without that much oversubscription by using DOCSIS 3.1 or 4.0, even less excuse for 6Mbps up.)

coryrc 7y ago

The balance of upload and download is configurable.

lawnchair_larry 7y ago
Not if you already have a legacy cable television network it isn’t.
milankragujevic 7y ago
Yes, by lowering the download speed, at least on DOCSIS 3.0. DOCSIS 3.0 supports up to 8 upload channels for a total speed of 216 Mbps (on 6.4 MHz per channel). That's shared for all users on the CMTS, which could be a lot, depending on the setup. For comparison, on EuroDOCSIS 3.0, with 32 channels the total download speed is 1600 Mbps for all users, and on DOCSIS 3.0 it's 1216 Mbps. DOCSIS 3.1 allows for multiple OFDMA upload channels which can allow for up to 2 Gbps shared upload speed capacity, and DOCSIS 4.0 allows for symmetric 10/10 Gbps shared capacity with an undefined split DS:US (you can have the same number of channels). It uses extended RF spectrum in the cable and also needs new amplifiers and splitters.
- AnthonyMouse 7y ago
  > Yes, by lowering the download speed, at least on DOCSIS 3.0. Which would imply that they should be able to offer a 100/100 connection for the same price as a 200/6 connection and have 6Mbps to spare.
  - milankragujevic 7y ago
    No, the maximum upload is fixed and independent of the download speed. I meant they can offer 6/6 Mbps, or 12/6 Mbps, for a 1:1 or 2:1 ratio. Basically as a joke.
    - AnthonyMouse 7y ago
      Even DOCSIS 3.0 supports up to 124 Mbps upload speeds using 4 channels: https://www.multicominc.com/training/technical-resources/docsis-3-0/ https://www.multicominc.com/training/technical-resources/doc... (Other sources quote it as 200Mbps? But either is a whole lot more than 6.)
      - milankragujevic 7y ago
        As I have said here: https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=22572536 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=22572536 , DOCSIS 3.0 supports 216 Mbps usable upload capacity with 8 upstream channels, halved to 108 Mbps with 4 upstream channels. That speed is, however, shared with ALL users on a CMTS, which could be dozens or a hundred, since the coaxial infrastructure is based on a shared medium where all devices connect to one physical cable that leads to the CMTS and share the available RF bandwidth. You could sell 1 user 100 Mbps upload with 4 channels, and have one user on a CMTS. You can also sell 6 Mbps upload to 36 users, guaranteeing them 100% of the capacity, or to 72 users, guaranteeing them 50% of the capacity. It is not feasible to sell packages with more than 50 Mbps upload on most coaxial networks (even HFC, if there are many users, i.e. more than one apartment building connected to a node) as users will not be able to use the full capacity, and the speed will inevitably drop to the sub-10 Mbps level, but the user will be unsatisfied as they are paying for and expecting higher speeds.
        deleted 7y ago
        [deleted]
        AnthonyMouse 7y ago
        The maximum download speed for DOCSIS 3.0 is 1216 Mbps, and that's only if you use 32 channels. If you were selling 200/6 connections to 72 users then you would be only guaranteeing them each ~8% of the download capacity (and yet 50% of the upload capacity, using 8 upstream channels). To have the same level of oversubscription for upload as download, you would give them all 35Mbps upload with the 200Mbps download. But you don't even have to do that, because who says they all need the same plan? Sell a quarter of them 100Mbps up connections and the others still get 17Mbps up. No way to justify why it should only be 6 up if it can be 200 down. (And if they're offering 200Mbps down without that much oversubscription by using DOCSIS 3.1 or 4.0, even less excuse for 6Mbps up.)