4 ms·

It's usually a percentage of workers' paychecks, between 1-2% is pretty standard. Founding, organizing, and legal stuff for newly forming unions can be handled

by kyoob 7y ago

It's usually a percentage of workers' paychecks, between 1-2% is pretty standard. Founding, organizing, and legal stuff for newly forming unions can be handled by the larger organization (e.g. CWA) using pooled dues from existing unions within that organization.

sevenf0ur 7y ago
Losing that much per paycheck with nothing guaranteed in return would chaff me after awhile. I hope it works out for them.
- einpoklum 7y ago
  If your union is actually _your union_, i.e. yourself and your co-workers, organizing together to do something - then you're not paying to get a "return". You're participating in your own collective effort. Pecuniary union achievements are an added bonus (though a frequent one). Unfortunately, with larger unions, or those with weaker consciousness and mis-perceptions of what a union is supposed to be - there's alienation between the member worker on one hand and the union and its operatives on the other, and then dues payment seems to be something transactional: "What will you get me in exchange for what I pay you?"
- johnpowell 7y ago
  I was a union HVAC guy for a few years. And one very nice thing was that there were union shops and they went through the union to find employees. So if work dried up at one place the union would take care of getting my unemployment going and then when work came up they would call and say that I was needed elsewhere. This probably wouldn't translate well to software. But it works great if you are installing ducts. Same goes for plumbers and electricians. My sisters first husband was a union electrician. That is why I looked into getting a union gig. I hate job hunting. In the years I did it I worked for five different companies. I didn't have to run around dropping off resumes and doing practice tests. I just got a call from the union and was told where to go to work. And I made significantly more than my non-union counterparts. Easily more than the dues I had to pay.
  - fiter 7y ago
    Is this one of the angles that unions use to sell themselves to companies? They can help by providing a well of valuable resources to draw on in an as-needed basis. When both hiring and firing would be an easier proposition, I could see more activity occurring as a result. These people would have experience at different companies and could provide their knowledge like many say is the benefit of people rotating jobs a lot in the SF Bay Area.
    - dragonwriter 7y ago
      > Is this one of the angles that unions use to sell themselves to companies? Unions don't sell themselves to companies in the first place.
      - fiter 7y ago
        Why not? I would presume that would help with regard to union busting, scabs, outsourcing, etc.
        dragonwriter 7y ago
        > Why not? The same reason your criminal defense attorney doesn't sell themselves to the public prosecutor's office.
        fiter 7y ago
        Are you implying that public prosecutors have the option to not interact with criminal defense attorneys, because companies certainly have the option to hire employees that do not work for unions.
        dragonwriter 7y ago
        > Are you implying that public prosecutors have the option to not interact with criminal defense attorneys, No, I'm implying that working for an actor’s counterparty compromises your ability to represent that actor in adversarial interactions with the same counterparty, which is a core function of unions with respect to employers as it is with defense attorneys with respect to prosecutors. > companies certainly have the option to hire employees that do not work for unions. Not in the US; even where union shops are prohibited by state right-to-work laws, adverse employment decisions on the basis of union membership or union-related activity by an employer are prohibited by the National Labor Relations Act. That is, in some cases, employers are allowed to hire employees who aren't members of a union, but they aren't legally permitted to hire employees because (even in part) they aren't members of unions.
- hinkley 7y ago
  How much of a paycut would you take for getting a guaranteed max 40 (or say, 45) hour work week with no retribution from management? Put it this way, when I worked at startups that owed me a raise they couldn't afford, I've offered several times to take a 0% raise in exchange for a 10% reduction in hours. Not a single company has taken that offer and several thought I was trying to be funny. I was not.

by kyoob 7y ago

sevenf0ur 7y ago

Losing that much per paycheck with nothing guaranteed in return would chaff me after awhile. I hope it works out for them.

einpoklum 7y ago
If your union is actually _your union_, i.e. yourself and your co-workers, organizing together to do something - then you're not paying to get a "return". You're participating in your own collective effort. Pecuniary union achievements are an added bonus (though a frequent one). Unfortunately, with larger unions, or those with weaker consciousness and mis-perceptions of what a union is supposed to be - there's alienation between the member worker on one hand and the union and its operatives on the other, and then dues payment seems to be something transactional: "What will you get me in exchange for what I pay you?"
johnpowell 7y ago
I was a union HVAC guy for a few years. And one very nice thing was that there were union shops and they went through the union to find employees. So if work dried up at one place the union would take care of getting my unemployment going and then when work came up they would call and say that I was needed elsewhere. This probably wouldn't translate well to software. But it works great if you are installing ducts. Same goes for plumbers and electricians. My sisters first husband was a union electrician. That is why I looked into getting a union gig. I hate job hunting. In the years I did it I worked for five different companies. I didn't have to run around dropping off resumes and doing practice tests. I just got a call from the union and was told where to go to work. And I made significantly more than my non-union counterparts. Easily more than the dues I had to pay.
- fiter 7y ago
  Is this one of the angles that unions use to sell themselves to companies? They can help by providing a well of valuable resources to draw on in an as-needed basis. When both hiring and firing would be an easier proposition, I could see more activity occurring as a result. These people would have experience at different companies and could provide their knowledge like many say is the benefit of people rotating jobs a lot in the SF Bay Area.
  - dragonwriter 7y ago
    > Is this one of the angles that unions use to sell themselves to companies? Unions don't sell themselves to companies in the first place.
    - fiter 7y ago
      Why not? I would presume that would help with regard to union busting, scabs, outsourcing, etc.
      - dragonwriter 7y ago
        > Why not? The same reason your criminal defense attorney doesn't sell themselves to the public prosecutor's office.
        fiter 7y ago
        Are you implying that public prosecutors have the option to not interact with criminal defense attorneys, because companies certainly have the option to hire employees that do not work for unions.
        dragonwriter 7y ago
        > Are you implying that public prosecutors have the option to not interact with criminal defense attorneys, No, I'm implying that working for an actor’s counterparty compromises your ability to represent that actor in adversarial interactions with the same counterparty, which is a core function of unions with respect to employers as it is with defense attorneys with respect to prosecutors. > companies certainly have the option to hire employees that do not work for unions. Not in the US; even where union shops are prohibited by state right-to-work laws, adverse employment decisions on the basis of union membership or union-related activity by an employer are prohibited by the National Labor Relations Act. That is, in some cases, employers are allowed to hire employees who aren't members of a union, but they aren't legally permitted to hire employees because (even in part) they aren't members of unions.
hinkley 7y ago
How much of a paycut would you take for getting a guaranteed max 40 (or say, 45) hour work week with no retribution from management? Put it this way, when I worked at startups that owed me a raise they couldn't afford, I've offered several times to take a 0% raise in exchange for a 10% reduction in hours. Not a single company has taken that offer and several thought I was trying to be funny. I was not.