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>aside from addictive potential And this is already very harmful in itself, hooking the user (read, mostly young teenagers) into an addiction for life. It's th

>aside from addictive potential And this is already very harmful in itself, hooking the user (read, mostly young teenagers) into an addiction for life. It's the last thing on your mind when you go to sleep, and the first when you wake up. As soon as you put one out, the itch begins to rise until you have another. That's enslaving, it's a bad thing in itself. Not to mention the thousands of dollars per year you will sink on that.

ceejayoz 7y ago
I agree, but to be fair, that's how a lot of us feel about coffee.
- gpderetta 7y ago
  Coffee addiction wean off completely after a few days of abstinence though. And the side effects of abstinence are quite mild.
  - Jarwain 7y ago
    I always get the worst headaches whenever I'm withdrawing from caffeine. Withdrawing from nicotine is pretty minor in comparison. Mainly just cravings, and they subside after a week or so depending on how long I had been vaping
    - giggles_giggles 7y ago
      Are you joking? When I quit I had a month of full on panic attacks over the tiniest things, and I only vaped for 5 years. I don't understand the motive for downplaying the addictive potential of nicotine unless you're excusing your own habits to yourself. It's posts like yours that led me to think vaping "wasn't that bad" when I first got hooked. I feel like I got my life back when I finally quit and I never would've been able to do it at all without the endless support and patience of my wife.
      - joey_bob 7y ago
        My experiences tend to agree with the GP. One thing to consider is that the withdraw effects may be proportional more to the intensity of an addiction prior to quitting rather than the length of time addicted. If you're drinking one cup of coffee a day, but vaping the equivalent of one or more packs a day, your nicotine withdraw may be far more severe. Conversely, if you smoke one cigarette a day, and consume the equivalent of 12 cups of coffee a day in caffeine (caffeine pills or energy drinks). This may sounds ridiculous to you, but if I were to interpolate your experience with my anecdotal sample set, it sounds as if you were vaping well over the equivalent of two packs a day. This is really extrapolation, I can't say I know anyone who has had panic attacks while going withdraw who otherwise would not have, and my sample includes people who have gone through withdraw from a pack a day + vaping. Obviously the sample is small and anecdotal. Also, I've neglected to find supporting sources. I acknowledge that you are probably relaying the events truthfully, but you are essentially downplaying the addictive potential of caffeine here similarly to how you accuse GP of downplaying the addictive effects of nicotine. In summary, caffeine withdraw is a thing, and can be worse than nicotine withdraw. I don't think you need to have some dark motive to state that.
        giggles_giggles 7y ago
        I just think it's extremely irresponsible to downplay the addictive power of nicotine and it's a theme I see recur frequently on this forum. I have a caffeine addiction as well, and have broken and restarted it multiple times in my life. It simply doesn't compare. If I don't get coffee (I'm a 3-4 cup/day coffee drinker), I'll be cranky but I'll live. When I vaped, my brain was on fire inside of an hour and a half. I couldn't get through a movie. I'd wake up in the middle of the night to vape. That has never happened to me with caffeine. There is no comparison. And I was vaping 3mg/ml liquid for the longest time. I can't imagine what the hit from a Juul or any nicotine salt vape is like in comparison. Everyone is different. But trying to find out if you're a person who can use nicotine without becoming hopelessly addicted is like lighting firecrackers in your hand to see if you're the kind of person who won't lose their fingers when it blows up. It's stupid and it's comments like the one I originally replied to, downplaying the potential for addiction, that helped me talk myself into it in the first place. After I'd had a few hits. I just hate seeing that in a place like this, with an ostensibly educated userbase. Frankly there's also abundant scientific research to back up just how hideously addictive nicotine is. I shouldn't have to supply all my anecdotes but hearing this community discuss how it really isn't so bad makes me so anxious that someone might actually believe it and start to use. I hope if someone is reading this and thinking about starting to vape that it makes them think again. Don't. It's awful.
- wmeredith 7y ago
  I’ve drank a lot of coffee and I’ve smoked a lot of cigarettes at different times in my life. They aren’t even in the same universe.
monadic2 7y ago
Well by this metric we have a pandemic of smartphone usage that poses an immediate public health risk.
- nitrogen 7y ago
  People have indeed made claims along those lines. Vaping isn't being singled out here.
rhizome 7y ago
Thousands of dollars a year? On vaping? Not even counting the money that would be extremely difficult to do. EDIT: deleted the distracting
- leetcrew 7y ago
  not that hard to do. juul pods in particular are fairly expensive. a pack of 4 juul pods costs $15-20 depending where you buy them. if you go through one pod a day (fairly high usage, but not unlikely for someone transitioning from a pack a day smoking habit), that's already over $1000/year.
  - rhizome 7y ago
    I spend less than $50/year and Juul are not the most popular device.
im3w1l 7y ago
I know many people who are aware of that and don't mind. To them addiction not a bad thing in itself, only if the object of addiction is harmful.
- analog31 7y ago
  Children can't really make that choice. And before anybody responds with "won't you please think of the children," this is about the children. If vaping is anything like tobacco, the primary marketing target is children, because for the most part virtually nobody starts smoking as an adult.
- giggles_giggles 7y ago
  That's funny, that sounds like exactly the kind of lie I used to tell myself when I was addicted. Nicotine is a powerful force for rationalization of your addiction to it.
  - im3w1l 7y ago
    They said this before they decided to get addicted.
    - lonelappde 7y ago
      That's an opinion on a matter they know nothing about. Addiction (and other mental modifications) is tricky that way.

ceejayoz 7y ago

I agree, but to be fair, that's how a lot of us feel about coffee.

gpderetta 7y ago
Coffee addiction wean off completely after a few days of abstinence though. And the side effects of abstinence are quite mild.
- Jarwain 7y ago
  I always get the worst headaches whenever I'm withdrawing from caffeine. Withdrawing from nicotine is pretty minor in comparison. Mainly just cravings, and they subside after a week or so depending on how long I had been vaping
  - giggles_giggles 7y ago
    Are you joking? When I quit I had a month of full on panic attacks over the tiniest things, and I only vaped for 5 years. I don't understand the motive for downplaying the addictive potential of nicotine unless you're excusing your own habits to yourself. It's posts like yours that led me to think vaping "wasn't that bad" when I first got hooked. I feel like I got my life back when I finally quit and I never would've been able to do it at all without the endless support and patience of my wife.
    - joey_bob 7y ago
      My experiences tend to agree with the GP. One thing to consider is that the withdraw effects may be proportional more to the intensity of an addiction prior to quitting rather than the length of time addicted. If you're drinking one cup of coffee a day, but vaping the equivalent of one or more packs a day, your nicotine withdraw may be far more severe. Conversely, if you smoke one cigarette a day, and consume the equivalent of 12 cups of coffee a day in caffeine (caffeine pills or energy drinks). This may sounds ridiculous to you, but if I were to interpolate your experience with my anecdotal sample set, it sounds as if you were vaping well over the equivalent of two packs a day. This is really extrapolation, I can't say I know anyone who has had panic attacks while going withdraw who otherwise would not have, and my sample includes people who have gone through withdraw from a pack a day + vaping. Obviously the sample is small and anecdotal. Also, I've neglected to find supporting sources. I acknowledge that you are probably relaying the events truthfully, but you are essentially downplaying the addictive potential of caffeine here similarly to how you accuse GP of downplaying the addictive effects of nicotine. In summary, caffeine withdraw is a thing, and can be worse than nicotine withdraw. I don't think you need to have some dark motive to state that.
      - giggles_giggles 7y ago
        I just think it's extremely irresponsible to downplay the addictive power of nicotine and it's a theme I see recur frequently on this forum. I have a caffeine addiction as well, and have broken and restarted it multiple times in my life. It simply doesn't compare. If I don't get coffee (I'm a 3-4 cup/day coffee drinker), I'll be cranky but I'll live. When I vaped, my brain was on fire inside of an hour and a half. I couldn't get through a movie. I'd wake up in the middle of the night to vape. That has never happened to me with caffeine. There is no comparison. And I was vaping 3mg/ml liquid for the longest time. I can't imagine what the hit from a Juul or any nicotine salt vape is like in comparison. Everyone is different. But trying to find out if you're a person who can use nicotine without becoming hopelessly addicted is like lighting firecrackers in your hand to see if you're the kind of person who won't lose their fingers when it blows up. It's stupid and it's comments like the one I originally replied to, downplaying the potential for addiction, that helped me talk myself into it in the first place. After I'd had a few hits. I just hate seeing that in a place like this, with an ostensibly educated userbase. Frankly there's also abundant scientific research to back up just how hideously addictive nicotine is. I shouldn't have to supply all my anecdotes but hearing this community discuss how it really isn't so bad makes me so anxious that someone might actually believe it and start to use. I hope if someone is reading this and thinking about starting to vape that it makes them think again. Don't. It's awful.
wmeredith 7y ago
I’ve drank a lot of coffee and I’ve smoked a lot of cigarettes at different times in my life. They aren’t even in the same universe.

monadic2 7y ago

Well by this metric we have a pandemic of smartphone usage that poses an immediate public health risk.

nitrogen 7y ago
People have indeed made claims along those lines. Vaping isn't being singled out here.

rhizome 7y ago

Thousands of dollars a year? On vaping? Not even counting the money that would be extremely difficult to do. EDIT: deleted the distracting

leetcrew 7y ago
not that hard to do. juul pods in particular are fairly expensive. a pack of 4 juul pods costs $15-20 depending where you buy them. if you go through one pod a day (fairly high usage, but not unlikely for someone transitioning from a pack a day smoking habit), that's already over $1000/year.
- rhizome 7y ago
  I spend less than $50/year and Juul are not the most popular device.

im3w1l 7y ago

I know many people who are aware of that and don't mind. To them addiction not a bad thing in itself, only if the object of addiction is harmful.

analog31 7y ago
Children can't really make that choice. And before anybody responds with "won't you please think of the children," this is about the children. If vaping is anything like tobacco, the primary marketing target is children, because for the most part virtually nobody starts smoking as an adult.
giggles_giggles 7y ago
That's funny, that sounds like exactly the kind of lie I used to tell myself when I was addicted. Nicotine is a powerful force for rationalization of your addiction to it.
- im3w1l 7y ago
  They said this before they decided to get addicted.
  - lonelappde 7y ago
    That's an opinion on a matter they know nothing about. Addiction (and other mental modifications) is tricky that way.