4 ms·

At the risk of being down-voted, I'm not trying to start a political debate. I'd just like to know, as someone outside the USA, how this is affecting the electi

At the risk of being down-voted, I'm not trying to start a political debate. I'd just like to know, as someone outside the USA, how this is affecting the election campaigns there. Are personal costs of the pandemic encouraging people to support subsidised healthcare, and therefore a left-wing party? Or is the xenophobic rhetoric of "blame China/Europe/travellers/etc" causing people to support a right-wing party? I also haven't seen a full discussion of the chain of cause and effect. There was a shift from the primary sector to tertiary services, which led to urbanisation to find demand for services. Young people living in cities can make more friends than before, and this is good! It also means that there are more people living in close quarters, who can spread disease more effectively. I'm willing to face the risks of urban life instead of subsistence farming, but I wonder if other generations resent that.

BiteCode_dev 7y ago
I'm not in the US either. I see a lot of what you mention on online mediums. But it's usually quite different than what's really happening IRL. People love to play the panic game online, but I've seen only quiet order around me. Yesterday, my entire neighborhood has been evacuated because of a bomb, we were all grouped in an hospital, where we were questioned about possible fever. In airports, I see people wearing masks, facing cancelled flights. I see stores with huge queues to buy stock of food. It all happens in a calm and civil manner. Maybe I'm optimistic, but I'm nicely surprised by the way people act right now, despite all the blame we want to place.
bluGill 7y ago
Most people do not see any personal cost of healthcare and thus are not turning more left-wing. The left-wing party is pushing that view, but they are not changing anybodies mind. Similar for the right wing.
tomp 7y ago
I doubt it will affect elections directly. Looking around the world, there's mostly bad examples from all kinds of governments - right-wing (Trump in US, Johnson in the UK), centrist (Macron in France, Merkel in Germany), left-wing (Slovenia - was centre-left until a week ago, Denmark), totalitarian (Iran, China)...
whydoineedone 7y ago
not trying to start a political debate but using some very charged rhetoric yourself... right ;) honestly, this situation is becoming increasingly politicized. bernie supporters/left wing are trying to use it as an excuse/example for pushing their healthcare agenda but the truth is it's not working because not enough people have had to go to the emergency room and received the bill in the mail. More of the criticism seems to focus on trying to make the president appear incompetent. Either way, I don't think it's very effective because the president has destroyed the reputation of most media against him. the right wing is looking to blame anyone and everyone except themselves and the administration and trump, of course, is trashing democrats and the media saying nothing would have ever been enough. In short, both sides are just shoring up their existing support. Trump has more to lose right now, and he knows it, due to one of his major selling points being the economic recovery/stock market gains. These are looking very very grim at present. However, he's an excellent salesman and I expect he may find a way through it. He may have to apply a lot of pressure on the democrats for economic stimulus, though, and we will see how that goes. Democrats may hold the line and allow the economy to tank to ensure a Biden victory in November.
XorNot 7y ago
> Are personal costs of the pandemic encouraging people to support subsidised healthcare, and therefore a left-wing party? The entire free-world except the US has subsidized healthcare far in excess of the the American system. Which is to say: no one in Australia is looking at $1000 COVID-19 tests.
gjm11 7y ago
I don't know the answer to your question, but in addition to the mechanisms you mention there's at least one more: there's some evidence that fear in general, and fear of death in particular, tends to make people more supportive of right-wing authoritarian government. (I don't mean to imply that right-wing = authoritarian; I pair them together because my recollection is that the research in question was specifically about right-wing authoritarianism and not about rightism generally or authoritarianism generally.) So (1) to whatever extent the GOP is authoritarian as well as right-wing, or at least pushes the same psychological buttons that authoritarian rightists do, it might benefit from having a population that feels afraid, and (2) maybe Mr Trump would have done better politically with something along the lines of "This is a deadly epidemic, sweeping in from scary foreign countries, and only your strong President can protect you and keep you safe". I guess the restriction on air travel from Europe may be intended as a bit of a pivot in that direction.
SamReidHughes 7y ago
Well, it might have some downstream impact on public transportation proposals.
kaiabwpdjqn 7y ago
There’s not much right vs left yet. It’s just the Democrats figuring out who their candidate will be. The pandemic has a very small effect on the US right now. Things are closing but mostly in anticipation of the near future. Almost none of it is in the middle where the right lives. There’s been some yelling at trump over his poor handling but it’s mostly just virtue signaling at this point. When the elections come around for real we will probably see something of this if/when it has evolved into something more serious here. I say this in Boston, just a few degrees of separation from some of the COVID confirmed individuals.
passer_byer 7y ago
The long term impact on U.S. politics is hard to gauge. As a member of the Democratic party, I am in favor of emergency legislation that provides direct financial payments to impacted individuals. In particular, we have close to 30 million uninsured and they have a strong disincentive to get tested for Conrna virus due to unexpected/unknown costs. This is likely the same segment of the population who have a strong incentive to go to work ignoring risks of community spread. They live pay check to pay check and can't afford to be sick and take time off. As an emergency measure, the federal government should carry all costs associated with virus testing. Any individual who is quarantined or must stay home to care for those quarantined should receive direct cash transfers to off-set the immediate economic dislocations this causes. The current federal administration's argument for suspending payroll taxes does nothing for those who are unemployed or work in the informal, cash economy. Luckily, at the state and local level officials appear more competent placing the health related impacts above politics. As an example, the governor of New York took the unprecedented step of quarantining New Rochelle just outside New York city. If there is any possibility of a silver lining from all of this, it would be how the U.S. electorate might see the true economic cost of allowing roughly 10% of the population to be uninsured. To me, it is immoral that the richest nation on earth permits those who are most vulnerable not having equal access to adequate healthcare. Finally, as an indication of how the federal government continues to politicize the pandemic, the Secretary of State continues to call the Covid-19 pandemic, Wuhan virus, as an insult to China. As a US citizen lucky enough to not be significantly impacted by all of this, I'm deeply embarrassed by such an outrageous insult from a federal official.

BiteCode_dev 7y ago

I'm not in the US either. I see a lot of what you mention on online mediums. But it's usually quite different than what's really happening IRL. People love to play the panic game online, but I've seen only quiet order around me. Yesterday, my entire neighborhood has been evacuated because of a bomb, we were all grouped in an hospital, where we were questioned about possible fever. In airports, I see people wearing masks, facing cancelled flights. I see stores with huge queues to buy stock of food. It all happens in a calm and civil manner. Maybe I'm optimistic, but I'm nicely surprised by the way people act right now, despite all the blame we want to place.

bluGill 7y ago

Most people do not see any personal cost of healthcare and thus are not turning more left-wing. The left-wing party is pushing that view, but they are not changing anybodies mind. Similar for the right wing.

tomp 7y ago

I doubt it will affect elections directly. Looking around the world, there's mostly bad examples from all kinds of governments - right-wing (Trump in US, Johnson in the UK), centrist (Macron in France, Merkel in Germany), left-wing (Slovenia - was centre-left until a week ago, Denmark), totalitarian (Iran, China)...

whydoineedone 7y ago

not trying to start a political debate but using some very charged rhetoric yourself... right ;) honestly, this situation is becoming increasingly politicized. bernie supporters/left wing are trying to use it as an excuse/example for pushing their healthcare agenda but the truth is it's not working because not enough people have had to go to the emergency room and received the bill in the mail. More of the criticism seems to focus on trying to make the president appear incompetent. Either way, I don't think it's very effective because the president has destroyed the reputation of most media against him. the right wing is looking to blame anyone and everyone except themselves and the administration and trump, of course, is trashing democrats and the media saying nothing would have ever been enough. In short, both sides are just shoring up their existing support. Trump has more to lose right now, and he knows it, due to one of his major selling points being the economic recovery/stock market gains. These are looking very very grim at present. However, he's an excellent salesman and I expect he may find a way through it. He may have to apply a lot of pressure on the democrats for economic stimulus, though, and we will see how that goes. Democrats may hold the line and allow the economy to tank to ensure a Biden victory in November.

XorNot 7y ago

> Are personal costs of the pandemic encouraging people to support subsidised healthcare, and therefore a left-wing party? The entire free-world except the US has subsidized healthcare far in excess of the the American system. Which is to say: no one in Australia is looking at $1000 COVID-19 tests.

gjm11 7y ago

I don't know the answer to your question, but in addition to the mechanisms you mention there's at least one more: there's some evidence that fear in general, and fear of death in particular, tends to make people more supportive of right-wing authoritarian government. (I don't mean to imply that right-wing = authoritarian; I pair them together because my recollection is that the research in question was specifically about right-wing authoritarianism and not about rightism generally or authoritarianism generally.) So (1) to whatever extent the GOP is authoritarian as well as right-wing, or at least pushes the same psychological buttons that authoritarian rightists do, it might benefit from having a population that feels afraid, and (2) maybe Mr Trump would have done better politically with something along the lines of "This is a deadly epidemic, sweeping in from scary foreign countries, and only your strong President can protect you and keep you safe". I guess the restriction on air travel from Europe may be intended as a bit of a pivot in that direction.

SamReidHughes 7y ago

Well, it might have some downstream impact on public transportation proposals.

kaiabwpdjqn 7y ago

There’s not much right vs left yet. It’s just the Democrats figuring out who their candidate will be. The pandemic has a very small effect on the US right now. Things are closing but mostly in anticipation of the near future. Almost none of it is in the middle where the right lives. There’s been some yelling at trump over his poor handling but it’s mostly just virtue signaling at this point. When the elections come around for real we will probably see something of this if/when it has evolved into something more serious here. I say this in Boston, just a few degrees of separation from some of the COVID confirmed individuals.

passer_byer 7y ago

The long term impact on U.S. politics is hard to gauge. As a member of the Democratic party, I am in favor of emergency legislation that provides direct financial payments to impacted individuals. In particular, we have close to 30 million uninsured and they have a strong disincentive to get tested for Conrna virus due to unexpected/unknown costs. This is likely the same segment of the population who have a strong incentive to go to work ignoring risks of community spread. They live pay check to pay check and can't afford to be sick and take time off. As an emergency measure, the federal government should carry all costs associated with virus testing. Any individual who is quarantined or must stay home to care for those quarantined should receive direct cash transfers to off-set the immediate economic dislocations this causes. The current federal administration's argument for suspending payroll taxes does nothing for those who are unemployed or work in the informal, cash economy. Luckily, at the state and local level officials appear more competent placing the health related impacts above politics. As an example, the governor of New York took the unprecedented step of quarantining New Rochelle just outside New York city. If there is any possibility of a silver lining from all of this, it would be how the U.S. electorate might see the true economic cost of allowing roughly 10% of the population to be uninsured. To me, it is immoral that the richest nation on earth permits those who are most vulnerable not having equal access to adequate healthcare. Finally, as an indication of how the federal government continues to politicize the pandemic, the Secretary of State continues to call the Covid-19 pandemic, Wuhan virus, as an insult to China. As a US citizen lucky enough to not be significantly impacted by all of this, I'm deeply embarrassed by such an outrageous insult from a federal official.