6 ms·

It's easy to understand how Europeans look at Americans is if they're brain-dead. However, the article does nothing to support the thesis that young people in p

by aazaa 7y ago

It's easy to understand how Europeans look at Americans is if they're brain-dead. However, the article does nothing to support the thesis that young people in particular are killing other people. It may be true. If so, including evidence to that effect would make a better article.

chadlavi 7y ago
Also this is in Newsweek, which as far as I know is mainly read by older, not so critical media consumers. This is sort of a playing to the home crowd piece.
stetrain 7y ago
"young people in particular are killing other people" I don't think that's the point. The point is that people are looking at the mortality curve of this illness, and it looks like it most severely affects the elderly. I've heard this point repeated all over the place as a "don't panic" qualifier, it's not so bad since you are not likely to be severely effected unless you are elderly. But if you aren't in that severely effected part of the age curve, your actions still can significantly affect the spread and effect of this illness on others and the strained medical system as a whole. It's not "young people are to blame" but "Just because you're young doesn't mean you shouldn't care about this"
acqq 7y ago
> the article does nothing to support the thesis that young people in particular are killing other people. It is very simple: from the pool of "all people" in any big enough area (e.g. a small city) those who will catch the virus, be able to spread it to others and will not develop significant symptoms, most of them will be very young. The older one is, more chance is that he will have strong symptoms (like not being able to breathe). So any young person which doesn't "feel" being ill who continues to live "normally" -- meaning contacting other people like always, as in "going out" at the evening or whatever -- is a strong transmitter of the same virus that is actively killing older people. Which all doesn't mean that older people who also behave like "nothing is happening" aren't also spreading the virus... and also, effectively, killing people. The biggest point is: please don't behave like "it's nothing."
- paulmd 7y ago
  Disproportionately, it is the olds who are behaving like nothing is happening. They are the ones consuming the cable news that is framing it as "wash your hands and everything will be fine!". Youngs generally accept that these large-scale phenomenon are real. We are just also powerless to change them, because politics are dominated by centrist olds who just don't want their 401k to go down too much. Yes, you should wash your hands, but that's not going to have much of an impact on an aerosolized respiratory virus. Individual action has a very limited impact on these giant, planet-wide phenomena. A very large number of people are going to get coronavirus unless there are state or country-scale interventions like mass quarantines. It's not our fault that the bigger actions aren't being taken. Youngs wield extremely little political power (in significant part thanks to ourselves and our own unwillingness to vote). See also: climate change, gun violence, pollution, etc etc. These are large problems that youngs accept and olds stonewall collective action on, instead pushing bullshit "individual responsibility" narratives with no realistic chance of solving the problem.
  - acqq 7y ago
    > the ones consuming the cable news that is framing it as "wash your hands and everything will be fine!". It was sad to watch that: both sides of political spectrum have had their own motives to downplay the issue and therefore postpone the necessary political actions -- and for these, obviously, the youngest can not be responsible. Both sides behave so, of course, "because economy" but there are other motives around as well. In reality being complacent seem to already result in bigger problems than the isolation measures alone would. Italy is an obvious example. I agree, there are indeed some similarities with the climate change problems.
themagician 7y ago
Young people aren't afraid because it poses no unusual risk to healthy people under 65. Airfare and hotels are at all time lows. It's a great time to travel if you aren't at risk and don't care about others. You can roundtrip to Hawaii for around $200 from some places.
graeme 7y ago
It is substantially better to respond to article content, not headlines. Authors don’t write their headlines. It would be better if they did, but they don’t. So if you argue against the headline only, you argue against a strawman. (It’s fine to address the headline as well, as that gets a lot of attention. But don’t attribute it to the author)
- aazaa 7y ago
  The headline is what brought many participants to this discussion. It's a part of the article, and comment-worthy. This looks like an editorial, for which it seems that at least some authors choose their own titles. For example, see: > Use a catchy title that ties into the theme of your piece. The title is what the reader sees first. Your title should entice the reader. https://www.ucsusa.org/resources/writing-op-eds https://www.ucsusa.org/resources/writing-op-eds There are other sources that give similar advice.
  - graeme 7y ago
    I specifically said the title is worth commenting on. Just not the only thing or the main argument.
jimmaswell 7y ago
> It's easy to understand how Europeans look at Americans is if they're brain-dead. I could easily say the reverse is equally understandable (letting their rights to free expression be eroded, horrible internet legislation for two) and that the covid-19 situation in Europe as a whole seems to be objectively worse than the US.
brianTheDog 7y ago
The old make it very difficult to own a home for the young. Maybe it’s time a large part died off?
Grue3 7y ago
>It's easy to understand how Europeans look at Americans is if they're brain-dead. It's absolutely not, considering how fast the virus is spreading in Europe, and mostly through old populations too. Symptomatic people spread virus faster, that much is obvious.

by aazaa 7y ago

chadlavi 7y ago

Also this is in Newsweek, which as far as I know is mainly read by older, not so critical media consumers. This is sort of a playing to the home crowd piece.

stetrain 7y ago

"young people in particular are killing other people" I don't think that's the point. The point is that people are looking at the mortality curve of this illness, and it looks like it most severely affects the elderly. I've heard this point repeated all over the place as a "don't panic" qualifier, it's not so bad since you are not likely to be severely effected unless you are elderly. But if you aren't in that severely effected part of the age curve, your actions still can significantly affect the spread and effect of this illness on others and the strained medical system as a whole. It's not "young people are to blame" but "Just because you're young doesn't mean you shouldn't care about this"

acqq 7y ago

> the article does nothing to support the thesis that young people in particular are killing other people. It is very simple: from the pool of "all people" in any big enough area (e.g. a small city) those who will catch the virus, be able to spread it to others and will not develop significant symptoms, most of them will be very young. The older one is, more chance is that he will have strong symptoms (like not being able to breathe). So any young person which doesn't "feel" being ill who continues to live "normally" -- meaning contacting other people like always, as in "going out" at the evening or whatever -- is a strong transmitter of the same virus that is actively killing older people. Which all doesn't mean that older people who also behave like "nothing is happening" aren't also spreading the virus... and also, effectively, killing people. The biggest point is: please don't behave like "it's nothing."

paulmd 7y ago
Disproportionately, it is the olds who are behaving like nothing is happening. They are the ones consuming the cable news that is framing it as "wash your hands and everything will be fine!". Youngs generally accept that these large-scale phenomenon are real. We are just also powerless to change them, because politics are dominated by centrist olds who just don't want their 401k to go down too much. Yes, you should wash your hands, but that's not going to have much of an impact on an aerosolized respiratory virus. Individual action has a very limited impact on these giant, planet-wide phenomena. A very large number of people are going to get coronavirus unless there are state or country-scale interventions like mass quarantines. It's not our fault that the bigger actions aren't being taken. Youngs wield extremely little political power (in significant part thanks to ourselves and our own unwillingness to vote). See also: climate change, gun violence, pollution, etc etc. These are large problems that youngs accept and olds stonewall collective action on, instead pushing bullshit "individual responsibility" narratives with no realistic chance of solving the problem.
- acqq 7y ago
  > the ones consuming the cable news that is framing it as "wash your hands and everything will be fine!". It was sad to watch that: both sides of political spectrum have had their own motives to downplay the issue and therefore postpone the necessary political actions -- and for these, obviously, the youngest can not be responsible. Both sides behave so, of course, "because economy" but there are other motives around as well. In reality being complacent seem to already result in bigger problems than the isolation measures alone would. Italy is an obvious example. I agree, there are indeed some similarities with the climate change problems.

themagician 7y ago

Young people aren't afraid because it poses no unusual risk to healthy people under 65. Airfare and hotels are at all time lows. It's a great time to travel if you aren't at risk and don't care about others. You can roundtrip to Hawaii for around $200 from some places.

graeme 7y ago

It is substantially better to respond to article content, not headlines. Authors don’t write their headlines. It would be better if they did, but they don’t. So if you argue against the headline only, you argue against a strawman. (It’s fine to address the headline as well, as that gets a lot of attention. But don’t attribute it to the author)

aazaa 7y ago
The headline is what brought many participants to this discussion. It's a part of the article, and comment-worthy. This looks like an editorial, for which it seems that at least some authors choose their own titles. For example, see: > Use a catchy title that ties into the theme of your piece. The title is what the reader sees first. Your title should entice the reader. https://www.ucsusa.org/resources/writing-op-eds https://www.ucsusa.org/resources/writing-op-eds There are other sources that give similar advice.
- graeme 7y ago
  I specifically said the title is worth commenting on. Just not the only thing or the main argument.

jimmaswell 7y ago

> It's easy to understand how Europeans look at Americans is if they're brain-dead. I could easily say the reverse is equally understandable (letting their rights to free expression be eroded, horrible internet legislation for two) and that the covid-19 situation in Europe as a whole seems to be objectively worse than the US.

brianTheDog 7y ago

The old make it very difficult to own a home for the young. Maybe it’s time a large part died off?

Grue3 7y ago

>It's easy to understand how Europeans look at Americans is if they're brain-dead. It's absolutely not, considering how fast the virus is spreading in Europe, and mostly through old populations too. Symptomatic people spread virus faster, that much is obvious.