4 ms·

Warning: I'm a salty dropout from an incredibly bad Computer Science program at a private Iowa school. > The main value of college, he said, is to be found in

Warning: I'm a salty dropout from an incredibly bad Computer Science program at a private Iowa school. > The main value of college, he said, is to be found in proving discipline by completing “annoying homework assignments” and in hanging around with people of the same age before entering the workforce. In my anecdotal experience, I find this statement to be incredibly true. Effectively it was party and do the busywork it takes to get by in your classes from professors who have lived the majority of their professional life in academia. They berated me for learning web dev because, "web software just won't be a thing" - this is in 2005-6ish where it absolutely was already. I worked in-industry at the time as a rookie sysadmin and web developer. It was a huge waste of my time to go to school vs. spending time learning on my own through my career and personal projects. I know this doesn't apply to all trades - I've always been focused on web development, automation, and ecommerce. Those were/are incredibly easy to self-learn if you enjoy it (even in 2005ish when I was in school)! I resent my schooling because I had a FT job with real responsibilities, living at home helping to support my cancer patient mother (bio dad died years prior), and trying to keep my head above water socially/academically. As someone saddled with responsibility I felt I was in a playground for children riddled with booze, partying, and sex while professors demeaned my career telling me to "not to write software for the internet". It was bad.

xhkkffbf 7y ago
I have to agree. Some of the full professors I know are real embarrassments. They refer to teaching web development as something a "trade school" would do. Then they fill up the classes with inane type theory that's obsessed with weirdo contrived cases that never occur in real life. Then to top it off, they trot out some nihilistic proof that "proves" the type systems can never be complete. What a bunch of maroons.
- burntoutfire 7y ago
  > They refer to teaching web development as something a "trade school" would do. I kinda agree. I think that you could learn all you need to know to be able to work in a FAANG junior web role (i.e. programming, algorithms, distributed computing, UNIX, databases etc.) in a focused 2-year trade school program.
  - folkhack 7y ago
    Absolutely... I've been wondering why the FAANGs don't just take education into their own hands and do this. The problem is when people talk down about it, which trust me is real. Wanting to make software that works great for people and is incredibly accessible utilizing the internet as a distribution/communications platform makes me less of an engineer than other more "traditional" ones... but the truth is I can add a lot of value to a company just by "getting things done" whereas I see a lot of the more academic-focused engineers pigeon-holing themselves into a one-dimensional career. Even though I think you could teach the basics of what I do professionally in a 2-year program I don't think it should be devalued by 4-year institutions/people due to market value alone.
    - lacker 7y ago
      The large tech companies do basically take practical education into their own hands. When you are an engineering manager and you get new graduates in your team, you have tools like code review and mentorship from tech leads to teach your new hires practical skills. It’s wise to expect a new grad new hire to spend some time just getting up to speed on practical programming methods, and not necessarily be super productive day 1. Startups are different, but Facebook or Google love to hire new grad engineers who don’t contribute much for six months as they learn from coworkers, then slowly develop into a top-tier contributor over the next year or two, then perform at a very high level consistently for the rest of their career. They prefer that to someone who can write medium-low quality code right now, let’s say enough to be a consistent 25th percentile performer at Oracle, and will continue to write that quality of code for the rest of their career.
alpineidyll3 7y ago
I was a professor at ND. I left happily for all these reasons. Hopefully the idea that some people who were parts of the problem left gives you some solace.
- deleted 7y ago
  [deleted]

xhkkffbf 7y ago

I have to agree. Some of the full professors I know are real embarrassments. They refer to teaching web development as something a "trade school" would do. Then they fill up the classes with inane type theory that's obsessed with weirdo contrived cases that never occur in real life. Then to top it off, they trot out some nihilistic proof that "proves" the type systems can never be complete. What a bunch of maroons.

burntoutfire 7y ago
> They refer to teaching web development as something a "trade school" would do. I kinda agree. I think that you could learn all you need to know to be able to work in a FAANG junior web role (i.e. programming, algorithms, distributed computing, UNIX, databases etc.) in a focused 2-year trade school program.
- folkhack 7y ago
  Absolutely... I've been wondering why the FAANGs don't just take education into their own hands and do this. The problem is when people talk down about it, which trust me is real. Wanting to make software that works great for people and is incredibly accessible utilizing the internet as a distribution/communications platform makes me less of an engineer than other more "traditional" ones... but the truth is I can add a lot of value to a company just by "getting things done" whereas I see a lot of the more academic-focused engineers pigeon-holing themselves into a one-dimensional career. Even though I think you could teach the basics of what I do professionally in a 2-year program I don't think it should be devalued by 4-year institutions/people due to market value alone.
  - lacker 7y ago
    The large tech companies do basically take practical education into their own hands. When you are an engineering manager and you get new graduates in your team, you have tools like code review and mentorship from tech leads to teach your new hires practical skills. It’s wise to expect a new grad new hire to spend some time just getting up to speed on practical programming methods, and not necessarily be super productive day 1. Startups are different, but Facebook or Google love to hire new grad engineers who don’t contribute much for six months as they learn from coworkers, then slowly develop into a top-tier contributor over the next year or two, then perform at a very high level consistently for the rest of their career. They prefer that to someone who can write medium-low quality code right now, let’s say enough to be a consistent 25th percentile performer at Oracle, and will continue to write that quality of code for the rest of their career.

alpineidyll3 7y ago

I was a professor at ND. I left happily for all these reasons. Hopefully the idea that some people who were parts of the problem left gives you some solace.

deleted 7y ago
[deleted]