6 ms·

Microsoft Surface Duo

41 points by reimertz 7y ago

uberman 7y ago
This seems very impressive. In my opinion it looks like the best multi-screen phone/phablet to date.
- screye 7y ago
  To me, the bigger potential is from the OS and not the hardware itself. As more manufacturers move to foldable devices, I see them licensing MSFT's android skin instead of going through the arduous process of developing one anew. It might be what lets microsoft finally get a foothold in the smartphone market, after many failed attempts.
albertzeyer 7y ago
It looks like this is based on Android? I wonder why they used that instead of some Windows version.
- BossingAround 7y ago
  Maybe because anything other than Android or iOS seems to be dead on arrival..? Edit: Anything that markets itself as a mobile phone and is targeted at the mainstream audience of course.
  - ta999999171 7y ago
    Surface/Surface Pro tablets have been anything besides DOA, this opinion is slightly outdated.
    - eropple 7y ago
      A charitable reading of the comment to which you replied might have incorporated the implied context of "phones".
    - deleted 7y ago
      [deleted]
    - protomyth 7y ago
      I think BossingAround means that any mobile OS other the iOS or Android has been a failure. The Surface & Surface Pro run a desktop OS: Windows 10. Microsoft tried with various mobile OS attempts and seems to have given up. Which is a shame, since the tile interface was actually pretty good.
- freeAgent 7y ago
  Microsoft tried pushing their own mobile OSes for years before finally giving up when they were down to low-single-digit marketshare in the US.
  - dgellow 7y ago
    Though they had way better result in Europe and other places in the world.
    - pjmlp 7y ago
      Yep, they were around 10% over here, and considered the Android alternative for those that didn't what to get iOS, when they gave up.
  - mumblemumble 7y ago
    "Tried" is maybe the wrong word. Windows CE was a leading OS on smart handheld devices for a good long while. Arguably, the biggest single thing that killed their market position (aside from the launches of iOS and Android, of course) was that they didn't retain backward compatibility, so Windows Phone 7 and later were effectively a completely different OS. Getting into competition with yourself is rarely a winning strategy.
    - soganess 7y ago
      Yes! So yes. But also no. When Microsoft released Windows Phone 7, it really got people excited. It was a shot across Skeuomorph UI's bow. Big fonts, dark mode by default, flat and chromeless to an almost fault. It was a serious departure from the Windows Mobile days. People were (more) comfortable with it not being backward compatible. Plus WM had turned into a mess of scaling problems, 3rd party skins, over the top launchers, and apps that weren't necessary cross device compatible. But then they did it again, Windows Phone 8 was not coming to any Windows Phone 7 devices. Even though MS originally said it would. Instead, all the WP7 phones got some 7.x feature update. Everyone showing off their shining new Nokias were burned during the honeymoon and that cooled interest. Especially when compared to Apple's sterling record. And then, they did it again, sorta. Many of the Windows phone 8 devices were not going to get updates to Windows 10 Mobile. Worse yet, Microsoft walked the striking UI way back. Except for the launcher, things starter looking rather conventional. There was no coming back from that. 41MP and real OIS, Zeiss optics and xenon flash. Things that were basically unheard of until 2019 (rip xenon) were not going recollect all that lost good will.
- dgellow 7y ago
  And the Microsoft Surface Neo will run Windows 10 X. That makes it even more confusing! https://blogs.windows.com/windowsexperience/2019/10/02/introducing-windows-10x-enabling-dual-screen-pcs-in-2020/ https://blogs.windows.com/windowsexperience/2019/10/02/intro...
- pjmlp 7y ago
  There are two versions of it. One is based on Android and the other one in Windows 10X. https://developer.microsoft.com/en-us/microsoft-365/virtual-events https://developer.microsoft.com/en-us/microsoft-365/virtual-... Official SDKs are based on Android Java, Kotlin, Xamarin, React Native and PWAs.
  - protomyth 7y ago
    I thought the smaller Duo was Android only?
    - pjmlp 7y ago
      Yeah, hence the emphasis on React Native, Xamarin and PWAs as well.
gchokov 7y ago
I will never buy this. Even looking at the screen with the borders between the two screens, I find it super misleading. The screen pretends to be one, but you open an app by touching an icon and it opens on the left one only. The icons remain hidden, and half of the desktop is on the right. Can I scroll the right scree? I mean.. scrolling left and right on one screen, and up and down on the other? Nope. Thank you.
- nicoburns 7y ago
  Funnily enough, I had the opposite reaction. This is the first tablet-like device that I would consider buying. I use two screens with my computer which works really well, and this seem just like that.
  - protomyth 7y ago
    It really has the Courier vibe and I was very ready to buy one of those if they ever actually made it.
- throwaway55554 7y ago
  Funny, I don't find anything "misleading" about this and I'm usually a big critic of MS. I actually think this is the right way to do a mobile foldable.
grenoire 7y ago
I definitely dig the PDA form factor on this, classic!
pcurve 7y ago
My knee jerk reaction was to pan it for having huge gap in the middle. But then I'm looking at my own monitor desktop. On left side, I have work application. On right side I have web browser. exactly 50:50 split. They may be onto something.
- throwaway55554 7y ago
  Right. I think people who are used to a dual screen desktop env will feel at home with this setup.
  - tfandango 7y ago
    And, for as much as they are charging for foldables, this setup seems like it will be much more resilient than the flexible plastic screens used elsewhere.
deleted 7y ago
[deleted]
dstaley 7y ago
Previous discussion from five months ago. [1] As far as I can tell, there's no new information on the linked page, so I'm not sure why it's resurfacing (ba dum tisss). [1] https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=21137450 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=21137450
protomyth 7y ago
Will Microsoft have their own app store for the Duo?
- dstaley 7y ago
  No, it comes with Google Play.
siod 7y ago
Conceptually and form factor wise this looks good, but those bezels just make the whole device look outdated.
- dstaley 7y ago
  The rumor is that the Duo has been hardware-final since 2018. They were waiting for Windows 10X to be ready, but eventually decided to just launch it with Android instead of attempting to make a phone version of Windows 10X. Source: https://www.windowscentral.com/surface-duo-spring-summer-early-launch-2020 https://www.windowscentral.com/surface-duo-spring-summer-ear...
  - siod 7y ago
    That explanation makes sense, if it's been in work for so long it's probably difficult internally to get the resources to bring it into line with current expectations. Unfortunately v1 will probably bomb in its current state and we won't see the proper potential of the device.
trqx 7y ago
Excuse my ignorance but I’ve never considered buying a surface up until now (they looked like "powerpoint toys" to me, hopefully I am wrong). My two most important criteria are not listed on their product page: - do they usually sell matte screen? - how is the hardware support for linux at launch?
- ta999999171 7y ago
  Matte touchscreen..?
  - trqx 7y ago
    Believe it or not, matte touchscreens do exists.
- rudiv 7y ago
  This device runs Android, which is based on Linux. Other Surface devices have a varying degree of support for Linux. IIRC none of them work perfectly, but most of them do work (Pro, Go, Laptop, etc.). The Surface Studio, I have no idea about.
mattlondon 7y ago
The "laptop" one with the flipout keyboard looks great. I wasn't sure in the video - are these separate devices (large and small versions of the same thing)? The laptop sized one would be awesome as a travel device if it were full-featured proper x86 device... I get the feeling these are android phones though right? Edit: The larger device appears to be a "Surface Neo": https://www.microsoft.com/en-us/surface/devices/surface-neo https://www.microsoft.com/en-us/surface/devices/surface-neo The marketing video for it has an Intel "CPU" animation so guessing this will be a "real" device?
- dstaley 7y ago
  The Surface Duo is an Android phone running a Qualcomm CPU, whereas the Surface Neo is a Windows 10X device using an Intel CPU.

41 points by reimertz 7y ago

uberman 7y ago

This seems very impressive. In my opinion it looks like the best multi-screen phone/phablet to date.

screye 7y ago
To me, the bigger potential is from the OS and not the hardware itself. As more manufacturers move to foldable devices, I see them licensing MSFT's android skin instead of going through the arduous process of developing one anew. It might be what lets microsoft finally get a foothold in the smartphone market, after many failed attempts.

albertzeyer 7y ago

It looks like this is based on Android? I wonder why they used that instead of some Windows version.

BossingAround 7y ago
Maybe because anything other than Android or iOS seems to be dead on arrival..? Edit: Anything that markets itself as a mobile phone and is targeted at the mainstream audience of course.
- ta999999171 7y ago
  Surface/Surface Pro tablets have been anything besides DOA, this opinion is slightly outdated.
  - eropple 7y ago
    A charitable reading of the comment to which you replied might have incorporated the implied context of "phones".
  - deleted 7y ago
    [deleted]
  - protomyth 7y ago
    I think BossingAround means that any mobile OS other the iOS or Android has been a failure. The Surface & Surface Pro run a desktop OS: Windows 10. Microsoft tried with various mobile OS attempts and seems to have given up. Which is a shame, since the tile interface was actually pretty good.
freeAgent 7y ago
Microsoft tried pushing their own mobile OSes for years before finally giving up when they were down to low-single-digit marketshare in the US.
- dgellow 7y ago
  Though they had way better result in Europe and other places in the world.
  - pjmlp 7y ago
    Yep, they were around 10% over here, and considered the Android alternative for those that didn't what to get iOS, when they gave up.
- mumblemumble 7y ago
  "Tried" is maybe the wrong word. Windows CE was a leading OS on smart handheld devices for a good long while. Arguably, the biggest single thing that killed their market position (aside from the launches of iOS and Android, of course) was that they didn't retain backward compatibility, so Windows Phone 7 and later were effectively a completely different OS. Getting into competition with yourself is rarely a winning strategy.
  - soganess 7y ago
    Yes! So yes. But also no. When Microsoft released Windows Phone 7, it really got people excited. It was a shot across Skeuomorph UI's bow. Big fonts, dark mode by default, flat and chromeless to an almost fault. It was a serious departure from the Windows Mobile days. People were (more) comfortable with it not being backward compatible. Plus WM had turned into a mess of scaling problems, 3rd party skins, over the top launchers, and apps that weren't necessary cross device compatible. But then they did it again, Windows Phone 8 was not coming to any Windows Phone 7 devices. Even though MS originally said it would. Instead, all the WP7 phones got some 7.x feature update. Everyone showing off their shining new Nokias were burned during the honeymoon and that cooled interest. Especially when compared to Apple's sterling record. And then, they did it again, sorta. Many of the Windows phone 8 devices were not going to get updates to Windows 10 Mobile. Worse yet, Microsoft walked the striking UI way back. Except for the launcher, things starter looking rather conventional. There was no coming back from that. 41MP and real OIS, Zeiss optics and xenon flash. Things that were basically unheard of until 2019 (rip xenon) were not going recollect all that lost good will.
dgellow 7y ago
And the Microsoft Surface Neo will run Windows 10 X. That makes it even more confusing! https://blogs.windows.com/windowsexperience/2019/10/02/introducing-windows-10x-enabling-dual-screen-pcs-in-2020/ https://blogs.windows.com/windowsexperience/2019/10/02/intro...
pjmlp 7y ago
There are two versions of it. One is based on Android and the other one in Windows 10X. https://developer.microsoft.com/en-us/microsoft-365/virtual-events https://developer.microsoft.com/en-us/microsoft-365/virtual-... Official SDKs are based on Android Java, Kotlin, Xamarin, React Native and PWAs.
- protomyth 7y ago
  I thought the smaller Duo was Android only?
  - pjmlp 7y ago
    Yeah, hence the emphasis on React Native, Xamarin and PWAs as well.

gchokov 7y ago

I will never buy this. Even looking at the screen with the borders between the two screens, I find it super misleading. The screen pretends to be one, but you open an app by touching an icon and it opens on the left one only. The icons remain hidden, and half of the desktop is on the right. Can I scroll the right scree? I mean.. scrolling left and right on one screen, and up and down on the other? Nope. Thank you.

nicoburns 7y ago
Funnily enough, I had the opposite reaction. This is the first tablet-like device that I would consider buying. I use two screens with my computer which works really well, and this seem just like that.
- protomyth 7y ago
  It really has the Courier vibe and I was very ready to buy one of those if they ever actually made it.
throwaway55554 7y ago
Funny, I don't find anything "misleading" about this and I'm usually a big critic of MS. I actually think this is the right way to do a mobile foldable.

grenoire 7y ago

I definitely dig the PDA form factor on this, classic!

pcurve 7y ago

My knee jerk reaction was to pan it for having huge gap in the middle. But then I'm looking at my own monitor desktop. On left side, I have work application. On right side I have web browser. exactly 50:50 split. They may be onto something.

throwaway55554 7y ago
Right. I think people who are used to a dual screen desktop env will feel at home with this setup.
- tfandango 7y ago
  And, for as much as they are charging for foldables, this setup seems like it will be much more resilient than the flexible plastic screens used elsewhere.

deleted 7y ago

[deleted]

dstaley 7y ago

Previous discussion from five months ago. [1] As far as I can tell, there's no new information on the linked page, so I'm not sure why it's resurfacing (ba dum tisss). [1] https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=21137450 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=21137450

protomyth 7y ago

Will Microsoft have their own app store for the Duo?

dstaley 7y ago
No, it comes with Google Play.

siod 7y ago

Conceptually and form factor wise this looks good, but those bezels just make the whole device look outdated.

dstaley 7y ago
The rumor is that the Duo has been hardware-final since 2018. They were waiting for Windows 10X to be ready, but eventually decided to just launch it with Android instead of attempting to make a phone version of Windows 10X. Source: https://www.windowscentral.com/surface-duo-spring-summer-early-launch-2020 https://www.windowscentral.com/surface-duo-spring-summer-ear...
- siod 7y ago
  That explanation makes sense, if it's been in work for so long it's probably difficult internally to get the resources to bring it into line with current expectations. Unfortunately v1 will probably bomb in its current state and we won't see the proper potential of the device.

trqx 7y ago

Excuse my ignorance but I’ve never considered buying a surface up until now (they looked like "powerpoint toys" to me, hopefully I am wrong). My two most important criteria are not listed on their product page: - do they usually sell matte screen? - how is the hardware support for linux at launch?

ta999999171 7y ago
Matte touchscreen..?
- trqx 7y ago
  Believe it or not, matte touchscreens do exists.
rudiv 7y ago
This device runs Android, which is based on Linux. Other Surface devices have a varying degree of support for Linux. IIRC none of them work perfectly, but most of them do work (Pro, Go, Laptop, etc.). The Surface Studio, I have no idea about.

mattlondon 7y ago

The "laptop" one with the flipout keyboard looks great. I wasn't sure in the video - are these separate devices (large and small versions of the same thing)? The laptop sized one would be awesome as a travel device if it were full-featured proper x86 device... I get the feeling these are android phones though right? Edit: The larger device appears to be a "Surface Neo": https://www.microsoft.com/en-us/surface/devices/surface-neo https://www.microsoft.com/en-us/surface/devices/surface-neo The marketing video for it has an Intel "CPU" animation so guessing this will be a "real" device?

dstaley 7y ago
The Surface Duo is an Android phone running a Qualcomm CPU, whereas the Surface Neo is a Windows 10X device using an Intel CPU.