7 ms·

Italy's Coronavirus Lockdown Upends the Most Basic Routines and Joys

67 points by ytNumbers 7y ago

vorpalhex 7y ago
A lockdown is obviously not an enjoyable thing, but it is necessary to flatten the curve [^1] and it's downsides are less severe then it's benefits if done correctly. Keep this in mind as the situation continues to evolve. Stock things in your house which bring you joy (good food, games, good books) and do your best to spread confidence to others around you. If you have enough space to get in some exercise, even if it's just pushups and situps, do so. If you are working from home, do your best to have a clearly defined time for your work and separate your working space from your leisure space as much as practical. If you've been thinking about writing a book or starting a new blog, now is a good time to do so. It may not be enjoyable but it is necessary. Make the best use of this time you can. [^1]: https://www.flattenthecurve.com/ https://www.flattenthecurve.com/
- magicsmoke 7y ago
  Imagine if steam takes advantage of this to have a coronavirus sale. 50% off all zombie themed games for the coming month.
  - phonypc 7y ago
    I think if they just did zombie games it could be construed as making light of the situation and get them some backlash. Broader discounts and some signalling that the intent is to encourage people to stay inside more might work though.
  - dysosmia 7y ago
    It would probably be in bad taste to theme it so...on the nose, but I'd believe that it's a good time to be releasing a fresh game right now. It's certainly a terrible time for games in development, with work collaboration maybe disrupted and with all the big publicity events getting cancelled, and it's a bad time for other media that bank a lot on physical releases (e.g. theatrical releases for movies getting pushed back), but the at-home media out now could find an audience with more time than they otherwise might have.
    - muzani 7y ago
      I don't know. I started playing Pandemic again. Play is a form of experimentation and learning, and what better way to experiment than zombie games?
    - bonzini 7y ago
      I don't think it would be in bad taste if it's clearly hyperbolic and perhaps it is coupled with informational messages. PornHub is famous for doing this. There's also a funeral services company in Rome whose death-themed ads have become a meme ("don't worry antivaxers, we will always be ready to help if you die"), we love it. :-)
      - saagarjha 7y ago
        Antivaxxers are generally not liked very much; it’s fairly “safe” to make fun of them. Doing so for coronavirus when people have family members who may have it is significantly less so.
        bonzini 7y ago
        Too late: https://www.facebook.com/onoranzefunebritaffo/photos/a.796425327129847/2581391841966511/?type=3&theater https://www.facebook.com/onoranzefunebritaffo/photos/a.79642... (translation: "stay at home or we will all end up in a box")
  - durpleDrank 7y ago
    I got a good chuckle out of this comment. Thanks.
- paulmd 7y ago
  edit: fair I'll retract this
  - eropple 7y ago
    I'm unfamiliar with this person. Do you have a reason to doubt that the author has the MPH that they assert that they have?
  - saagarjha 7y ago
    What’s wrong with the author’s credentials at the bottom of the page?
  - mjburgess 7y ago
    Assuming its the same person as https://tislab.org/jmcmurry.html https://tislab.org/jmcmurry.html (seems quite likely) then she's both well-informed about GSuite and public health.
jaclaz 7y ago
As a side note, maybe the single restaurant manager interviewed does normally that, but it is highly unusual that a restaurant manager hugs and/or kisses (or even shakes hands) with a customer of the restaurant. There is this sort of folklore about Italy that everyone kisses and hugs everyone else. This is simply not accurate. If you are introduced to someone (a stranger), it is normal courtesy to shake hands with him/her (and that's it, no hugs, no kisses), as well, unless the other person is an old friend the normal shaking of hands is the normal means of greeting. It is extremely rare that you are touched (again let alone hugged or kissed) as a customer when you enter any shop or similar.
- umvi 7y ago
  > If you are introduced to someone (a stranger), it is normal courtesy to shake hands with him/her (and that's it, no hugs, no kisses) Are you sure you aren't extending the culture of northern Italy to all of Italy? When I lived in Rome/Naples, it seemed like with almost everyone I met we shook hands and did the "air kisses" (not a real kiss but you still lean in close and touch cheeks). It didn't ever happen to me with restaurant owners, sure, but then again I never really interacted with anyone other than the waiter/waitress/cashier. I could see it happening in a super small hole-in-the-wall mom and pop type restaurant though.
  - riffraff 7y ago
    I am from Rome, the cheek kiss is common amongst people who know each other, and sometimes it applies "transitively" (e.g. a friend's partner which you don't know), but it is definitely not done when meeting random people at work. You could be kissing someone on the cheek coming in your restaurant if you are familiar with them, but it's not very common.
  - jaclaz 7y ago
    >Are you sure you aren't extending the culture of northern Italy to all of Italy? Yes, I am pretty sure, as a matter of fact I am more familiar with non-Northern Italy habits, as I am Italian (from the center and living in the center) but I have lived years in the South and also some time in Rome and near Naples. Again I am not talking of people you know and are friend with, I am talking of: 1 - people that have just been introduced to you 2 - normal greetings between people that meet in commercial or professional environments The case of: >I could see it happening in a super small hole-in-the-wall mom and pop type restaurant though. can surely happen, but it is not common/everyday as the folklore might lead to believe.
scaglio 7y ago
Italian here, north-west. Media are really exaggerating with the situation with daily life and routine, we are allowed to take a walk and go to bars or restaurants if there is one meter of distance between people. The real problem is in the hospitals, and for some enterprises who will really have a loss in these weeks (everything about tourism, for example). One of the biggest downsides is that people are not allowed to visit relatives or families in other cities/villages, even if a few kilometers away. We've been promised discounts, taxes, even free subscriptions for ebooks... this lockdown is not so bad, the important is that people really understand why it has been implemented (people here in Italy tend to overreact for every news - it's always apocalyptic).
- inciampati 7y ago
  The risk is that this lockdown isn't sufficient to modify the progression of the epidemic. Then it will probably have to be modified. Presumably, most transmission is happening in social settings and closed environments. These measures should mitigate that. The change in social behavior would suggest it's working. We'll find out in five days or so if this is working.
  - asdfasgasdgasdg 7y ago
    It's worked elsewhere so there is good reason to hope that it will work in Italy as well. It sucks that we have to wait five days to find out though. What I wouldn't give for a crystal ball right now.
    - mrb 7y ago
      A lockdown has worked in only one place: China. And it worked because the measures were extreme: not allowing people to leave their homes (except once a week to go shopping), banning cars on the roads, closing workplaces, etc. No country is implementing measures nearly as extreme as China, so they won't be as successful in slowing down the epidemic. Before someone mentions South Korea: Korean CDC explained their epidemic curve is bending because they are finishing testing the 200,000 sect members at the center of the epidemic. So fewer tests = fewer detected infections: "in Daegu and Gyeongbuk region, the transmission seems a bit slow down as testing Shincheonji members is almost finished" Source: https://www.cdc.go.kr/board/board.es?mid=a30402000000&bid=0030&act=view&list_no=366496&tag=&nPage=1 https://www.cdc.go.kr/board/board.es?mid=a30402000000&bid=00... In other words this is NOT a sign Korea is succeeding at containing it. I have seen zero epidemiologists correctly report on this. They all fail to read what KCDC is saying.
brainpool 7y ago
Well, what to expect? An uptick in pleasure and joy. No. This is serious measures for serious times.
- dang 7y ago
  Ok, but can you please not post unsubstantive comments here?
thefz 7y ago
Another Italian here. The situation is far from dramatic. Yes, being forced at home unless necessary is an inconvenience, but damn worth the risk of catching the virus or worse infecting others. We can work from home, and this for many of us is a first and indeed something we can leverage when things go back to normal. We can still go to the doctor, or grocery shopping, bars and restaurants are still open.
burlesona 7y ago
This kind of reporting seems counterproductive. A more helpful headline would be something like, “In locked down Italy, life is mostly normal.” The body of the article is OK, but the tone seems intentionally negative when the same facts could easily have been presented hopefully. One of my biggest concerns is that places in the United States, or other countries, will adopt aggressive social distancing policies early, while the number of cases is low, and then the backlash against those policies will be that “this is hell, and the virus isn’t even affecting that many people.” That can lead to pressure to drop the policies prematurely when the virus is nowhere near contained yet. This is a great opportunity for responsible journalism to strike a tone of optimistic “we are all in this together, it is very serious, but if we all do the right thing we should be OK.” Fear mongering on the one hand, or dismissal and backlash on the other, are both extremely harmful — But good for Clickbait and selling ads. We really need the media to resist that during this emergency.

67 points by ytNumbers 7y ago

A lockdown is obviously not an enjoyable thing, but it is necessary to flatten the curve [^1] and it's downsides are less severe then it's benefits if done correctly. Keep this in mind as the situation continues to evolve. Stock things in your house which bring you joy (good food, games, good books) and do your best to spread confidence to others around you. If you have enough space to get in some exercise, even if it's just pushups and situps, do so. If you are working from home, do your best to have a clearly defined time for your work and separate your working space from your leisure space as much as practical. If you've been thinking about writing a book or starting a new blog, now is a good time to do so. It may not be enjoyable but it is necessary. Make the best use of this time you can. [^1]: https://www.flattenthecurve.com/ https://www.flattenthecurve.com/

magicsmoke 7y ago
Imagine if steam takes advantage of this to have a coronavirus sale. 50% off all zombie themed games for the coming month.
- phonypc 7y ago
  I think if they just did zombie games it could be construed as making light of the situation and get them some backlash. Broader discounts and some signalling that the intent is to encourage people to stay inside more might work though.
- dysosmia 7y ago
  It would probably be in bad taste to theme it so...on the nose, but I'd believe that it's a good time to be releasing a fresh game right now. It's certainly a terrible time for games in development, with work collaboration maybe disrupted and with all the big publicity events getting cancelled, and it's a bad time for other media that bank a lot on physical releases (e.g. theatrical releases for movies getting pushed back), but the at-home media out now could find an audience with more time than they otherwise might have.
  - muzani 7y ago
    I don't know. I started playing Pandemic again. Play is a form of experimentation and learning, and what better way to experiment than zombie games?
  - bonzini 7y ago
    I don't think it would be in bad taste if it's clearly hyperbolic and perhaps it is coupled with informational messages. PornHub is famous for doing this. There's also a funeral services company in Rome whose death-themed ads have become a meme ("don't worry antivaxers, we will always be ready to help if you die"), we love it. :-)
    - saagarjha 7y ago
      Antivaxxers are generally not liked very much; it’s fairly “safe” to make fun of them. Doing so for coronavirus when people have family members who may have it is significantly less so.
      - bonzini 7y ago
        Too late: https://www.facebook.com/onoranzefunebritaffo/photos/a.796425327129847/2581391841966511/?type=3&theater https://www.facebook.com/onoranzefunebritaffo/photos/a.79642... (translation: "stay at home or we will all end up in a box")
- durpleDrank 7y ago
  I got a good chuckle out of this comment. Thanks.
paulmd 7y ago
edit: fair I'll retract this
- eropple 7y ago
  I'm unfamiliar with this person. Do you have a reason to doubt that the author has the MPH that they assert that they have?
- saagarjha 7y ago
  What’s wrong with the author’s credentials at the bottom of the page?
- mjburgess 7y ago
  Assuming its the same person as https://tislab.org/jmcmurry.html https://tislab.org/jmcmurry.html (seems quite likely) then she's both well-informed about GSuite and public health.

jaclaz 7y ago

As a side note, maybe the single restaurant manager interviewed does normally that, but it is highly unusual that a restaurant manager hugs and/or kisses (or even shakes hands) with a customer of the restaurant. There is this sort of folklore about Italy that everyone kisses and hugs everyone else. This is simply not accurate. If you are introduced to someone (a stranger), it is normal courtesy to shake hands with him/her (and that's it, no hugs, no kisses), as well, unless the other person is an old friend the normal shaking of hands is the normal means of greeting. It is extremely rare that you are touched (again let alone hugged or kissed) as a customer when you enter any shop or similar.

umvi 7y ago
> If you are introduced to someone (a stranger), it is normal courtesy to shake hands with him/her (and that's it, no hugs, no kisses) Are you sure you aren't extending the culture of northern Italy to all of Italy? When I lived in Rome/Naples, it seemed like with almost everyone I met we shook hands and did the "air kisses" (not a real kiss but you still lean in close and touch cheeks). It didn't ever happen to me with restaurant owners, sure, but then again I never really interacted with anyone other than the waiter/waitress/cashier. I could see it happening in a super small hole-in-the-wall mom and pop type restaurant though.
- riffraff 7y ago
  I am from Rome, the cheek kiss is common amongst people who know each other, and sometimes it applies "transitively" (e.g. a friend's partner which you don't know), but it is definitely not done when meeting random people at work. You could be kissing someone on the cheek coming in your restaurant if you are familiar with them, but it's not very common.
- jaclaz 7y ago
  >Are you sure you aren't extending the culture of northern Italy to all of Italy? Yes, I am pretty sure, as a matter of fact I am more familiar with non-Northern Italy habits, as I am Italian (from the center and living in the center) but I have lived years in the South and also some time in Rome and near Naples. Again I am not talking of people you know and are friend with, I am talking of: 1 - people that have just been introduced to you 2 - normal greetings between people that meet in commercial or professional environments The case of: >I could see it happening in a super small hole-in-the-wall mom and pop type restaurant though. can surely happen, but it is not common/everyday as the folklore might lead to believe.

scaglio 7y ago

Italian here, north-west. Media are really exaggerating with the situation with daily life and routine, we are allowed to take a walk and go to bars or restaurants if there is one meter of distance between people. The real problem is in the hospitals, and for some enterprises who will really have a loss in these weeks (everything about tourism, for example). One of the biggest downsides is that people are not allowed to visit relatives or families in other cities/villages, even if a few kilometers away. We've been promised discounts, taxes, even free subscriptions for ebooks... this lockdown is not so bad, the important is that people really understand why it has been implemented (people here in Italy tend to overreact for every news - it's always apocalyptic).

inciampati 7y ago
The risk is that this lockdown isn't sufficient to modify the progression of the epidemic. Then it will probably have to be modified. Presumably, most transmission is happening in social settings and closed environments. These measures should mitigate that. The change in social behavior would suggest it's working. We'll find out in five days or so if this is working.
- asdfasgasdgasdg 7y ago
  It's worked elsewhere so there is good reason to hope that it will work in Italy as well. It sucks that we have to wait five days to find out though. What I wouldn't give for a crystal ball right now.
  - mrb 7y ago
    A lockdown has worked in only one place: China. And it worked because the measures were extreme: not allowing people to leave their homes (except once a week to go shopping), banning cars on the roads, closing workplaces, etc. No country is implementing measures nearly as extreme as China, so they won't be as successful in slowing down the epidemic. Before someone mentions South Korea: Korean CDC explained their epidemic curve is bending because they are finishing testing the 200,000 sect members at the center of the epidemic. So fewer tests = fewer detected infections: "in Daegu and Gyeongbuk region, the transmission seems a bit slow down as testing Shincheonji members is almost finished" Source: https://www.cdc.go.kr/board/board.es?mid=a30402000000&bid=0030&act=view&list_no=366496&tag=&nPage=1 https://www.cdc.go.kr/board/board.es?mid=a30402000000&bid=00... In other words this is NOT a sign Korea is succeeding at containing it. I have seen zero epidemiologists correctly report on this. They all fail to read what KCDC is saying.

brainpool 7y ago

Well, what to expect? An uptick in pleasure and joy. No. This is serious measures for serious times.

dang 7y ago
Ok, but can you please not post unsubstantive comments here?

thefz 7y ago

Another Italian here. The situation is far from dramatic. Yes, being forced at home unless necessary is an inconvenience, but damn worth the risk of catching the virus or worse infecting others. We can work from home, and this for many of us is a first and indeed something we can leverage when things go back to normal. We can still go to the doctor, or grocery shopping, bars and restaurants are still open.

burlesona 7y ago

This kind of reporting seems counterproductive. A more helpful headline would be something like, “In locked down Italy, life is mostly normal.” The body of the article is OK, but the tone seems intentionally negative when the same facts could easily have been presented hopefully. One of my biggest concerns is that places in the United States, or other countries, will adopt aggressive social distancing policies early, while the number of cases is low, and then the backlash against those policies will be that “this is hell, and the virus isn’t even affecting that many people.” That can lead to pressure to drop the policies prematurely when the virus is nowhere near contained yet. This is a great opportunity for responsible journalism to strike a tone of optimistic “we are all in this together, it is very serious, but if we all do the right thing we should be OK.” Fear mongering on the one hand, or dismissal and backlash on the other, are both extremely harmful — But good for Clickbait and selling ads. We really need the media to resist that during this emergency.